Dunlop Tyres

[935]

Dunlop obviously "sponsor" the EERC. Lets say it is to the tune of £100k per annum. If there are 10 races with 25 cars on the grid average (I am trying to be realistic here!)and each car has a new set of tyres per race (ignoring practice ) then Dunlop sell 250 sets of tyres per year to the EERC competitors. Obviously, this ignores the 24 hour race. In other words, for each set of tyres sold Dunlop gives the EERC £400. This sounds a bit too much but I bet it works out to around £250 minimum!
If these numbers are correct, (why cant we find out as it is "our" club afterall!!), I would vote for an open tyre formula and I would pay an extra £250 per entry.
Oh well, I can dream!!!
Best get back to buildingthe car as it all starts soon.
Richard.
P.S. I saw some nice uprights being made near Silverstone at the weekend. I wonder who they are for??????

[Racing Rod]

935 said:

Dunlop obviously "sponsor" the EERC. Lets say it is to the tune of £100k per annum. If there are 10 races with 25 cars on the grid average (I am trying to be realistic here!)and each car has a new set of tyres per race (ignoring practice ) then Dunlop sell 250 sets of tyres per year to the EERC competitors. Obviously, this ignores the 24 hour race. In other words, for each set of tyres sold Dunlop gives the EERC £400. This sounds a bit too much but I bet it works out to around £250 minimum!

I doubt that your figures are correct, the sponsorship deal would be more like £50k p.a plus some extras here and there, and one can't ignore the 24hr as that's like another mini season in one go !!!

Circa 500sets is more likely the target area. I recon that the EERC might get the equivalent of £100 per set of tyres sold, i.e 12/12.5% but that's just my guess based on reported deals that may have happened in other series such as Tuscans and BGT. I did 8 rounds in BGT last year at two sets per race plus wets when needed, price per tyre,£197 plus vat. My tyre account was plus £16000 but others spent up to double this with testing etc, so assuming 30 car grids at say an average of £20k a pop, say 600 sets for the sake of argument, and that's £600k revenue. Rumour has it, and I stress, rumour, that the Avon deal with SRO was worth £100k so that's a touch over 16% or thereabouts. Commercially, I can't see the tyre companies working on higher discount margins then as above but who really knows what goes on !!!

I suggest this to highlight that IMHO, a tyre choice scenario could be put in place and would only add £100 to race fees if this is what most competitors wanted but the problem comes back to support and back up for how many tyre companies would attend race weekends with the prospect of only selling say a fifth of what they currently sell??

[Calorus]

Scuffers said:

Calorus said:

scuffers said:

Calorus said:

Why not approach someone like Kumho or Hankook. I spoke to them at Autosport International, and both suggested that they were interested in raising their UK sporting crednentials. And the nature of the companies means they're more like to be more flexible and invest more heavily.

with all due...

unless they are going to commit LARGE summs of money to tyre development and testing, that's just pointless.

I would suggest that for every type of car on the grid, it would take the best part of 3-4 months to develop a tyre to work with it....(and that assumes 100% commitment etc)

Is this not an example of taking nothing rather than something? I mean, as it stands you've all got tyres which aren't bespoke to the cars, and which aren't even performance balanced across the size ranges. Wouldn't it be a huge improvement to at least have a full size range of endurance tyres and then set the cars up to use the tyres, as they do in every other control tyre championship?

If I understand what you are saying, then no.

just take the typical Britcar grid:

Porsche 935
Mosler MT900R
Opel V8 Star
BMW M3 E36
Porsche 996 GT3
Ferrari 360 Challenge
Marcos Mantis
BMW M3 E36
Ferrari 355 Challenge
Lotus Exige 2
Lotus Elise 1
BMW Mini 53
Peugeot 406 Coupe
Dodge Viper

the list goes on...

now, this means you have to have tyres from 15" though to 18" (and 19"??)

and then you have issues that just because two (or more) cars share the same tyre physical sizes, the construction requirements are nothing like the same - for example, the Elise front us a 15", only tyre Dunlop have for it is designed for a radical, and it's construction is just hopeless for the Elise)

the reality of the situation is, no manufacture can justify making the right tyre for every car on the grid (just look at the trouble Avon have had in GT with a limited field of car types), even between on the face of it, the same 911’s they have different requirements.

Yup I can see exactly where you're coming from, but this leaves a situation, where, with Dunlop who refuse to do any development at all, you don't have the tyres, and even where you do have the tyres they aren't comparable.

In the rest of the racing championships from WTCC to Toyo Modified Production Saloons they are given tyres which, other than size have similar characteristics and told to make do. In Britcar, you're given tyres with completely different characteristics and told to make do. How is that an improvement?

Edited by Calorus on Tuesday 6th February 13:05

[Scuffers]

Calorus said:

Yup I can see exactly where you're coming from, but this leaves a situation, where, with Dunlop who refuse to do any development at all, you don't have the tyres, and even where you do have the tyres they aren't comparable.

In the rest of the racing championships from WTCC to Toyo Modified Production Saloons they are given tyres which, other than size have similar characteristics and told to make do. In Britcar, you're given tyres with completely different characteristics and told to make do. How is that an improvement?

I never said I agreed with it!

running the Elise introduced me to the issues first hand...

My comment was one based on the situation, not my prefference.

[935]

Rod, I am happy to accept your figures, although I suspect the correct answer lies somewhere in between, and this just makes my arguement stronger. If the sponsorship per year is "just" £50k (or £75k or whatever) it would be cheaper and better for everyone to arrange their own tyres at their own negiotated rate and pay a little more on the entry fee to keep the club going.

I may be missing the point but I fail to see the massive benifit to the competitors of a single tyre format. OK, there is trackside support (and this is worth something) but we pay the going rate for the rubber and are treated at times like idiots. I dont blame Dunlop or the EERC as it gives the club a healthy input of guaranteed money but I suspect there are other ways to generate the cash whilst opening up the tyre supply.

Now, where is Dunlops phone number - I need some rubber for testing!!

Cheers,

Richard.

[Racing Rod]

935 said:

Rod, I am happy to accept your figures, although I suspect the correct answer lies somewhere in between, and this just makes my arguement stronger. If the sponsorship per year is "just" £50k (or £75k or whatever) it would be cheaper and better for everyone to arrange their own tyres at their own negiotated rate and pay a little more on the entry fee to keep the club going.

I may be missing the point but I fail to see the massive benifit to the competitors of a single tyre format. OK, there is trackside support (and this is worth something) but we pay the going rate for the rubber and are treated at times like idiots. I dont blame Dunlop or the EERC as it gives the club a healthy input of guaranteed money but I suspect there are other ways to generate the cash whilst opening up the tyre supply.

Now, where is Dunlops phone number - I need some rubber for testing!!

Cheers,

Richard.

Hi Richard,

My point balances thinly on the matter of support, personally I would prefer to have the ability to off load anything on the tyre front to those who are best equipped to fit and change them safely, or as close as I can get to safely. When all is said and done, our tyres, which ever the make, are the only real contact we have with the track and I need to have as much confidence as I can in the fitting and performance I can get from them. Having said that, I'm always open to change so if It came to pass then I'm sure we could find a way of solving the support issue.