Bernie Ecclestone: Good guy or not?
Discussion
I think this is a good question.
Ecclestone has an incredible grip on what Formula One is and what is can do in the world entertainment field. To my mind GP racing has progressed fantastically well under his stewardship.
However, I enjoyed many years of motor racing where you feel completely deserted by big time organization, marketing development and general professionalism because it's 'drawn off' or reserved for F1.
Like it's been neutered in the interests of/sacrificed on the high alter of FI GP.
On balance and ignoring personal reservations particularly as a BRDC member, I think on the whole he's been magic. He's still has the energy, vision and deal brokering skills to put Motor Racing up there with the best of Olympics, Golf or Footballing world stages. Proper super-tight management.
Still reckon MotoGP is the best pure racing and support on the planet right now. Hope it doesn't disappear up it's own chuff.
Ecclestone has an incredible grip on what Formula One is and what is can do in the world entertainment field. To my mind GP racing has progressed fantastically well under his stewardship.
However, I enjoyed many years of motor racing where you feel completely deserted by big time organization, marketing development and general professionalism because it's 'drawn off' or reserved for F1.
Like it's been neutered in the interests of/sacrificed on the high alter of FI GP.
On balance and ignoring personal reservations particularly as a BRDC member, I think on the whole he's been magic. He's still has the energy, vision and deal brokering skills to put Motor Racing up there with the best of Olympics, Golf or Footballing world stages. Proper super-tight management.
Still reckon MotoGP is the best pure racing and support on the planet right now. Hope it doesn't disappear up it's own chuff.
GarrettMacD said:
loneranger said:
I was told that he doesn't like Silverstone because the BRDC wouldn't let him join their club!
Don't thay have some fairly stringent entry criteria though??? Something like at least a couple of seasons of consistent success in an international championship. I think Bernie only ever went to F3 level in the UK. It's safe to assume that a BRDC member is a fairly handy racing driver, although I did see that logo on Jason Plato's overalls, so they must make the odd exception... said:
The entry criteria to the Club remains very strict with full membership offered only to those ladies and gentlemen who have attained international success over a number of seasons. Associate membership is offered to those persons who have made a significant contribution to the sport and honorary membership is bestowed upon only a special few, including F1 World Champions who by dint of nationality do not otherwise qualify. Every British or Commonwealth World Champion is, or has been in their lifetime, a full member of the Club.
That's from the BRDC website. GarrettMacD said:
loneranger said:
I was told that he doesn't like Silverstone because the BRDC wouldn't let him join their club!
Don't thay have some fairly stringent entry criteria though??? Something like at least a couple of seasons of consistent success in an international championship. I think Bernie only ever went to F3 level in the UK...Eric Mc said:
If you haven't done so already, I advise you to read the book "Bernie's Game".
As I said earlier, back in the late 70s and early 80s he did wonders turning what had often been a shambolic amateurish circus into a slick professional outfit.
That was the good bit.
In recent years his involvment has only been to the detriment of the sport - losing classic tracks, shifting to countries with no tradition or even affection for motor racing etc.
Luckilly, he can't hang around too much longer - although I remember saying that to myself ten years ago
.
IMHO the book 'Bernie's Game' was not that good. Personally I can't wait for the official book to come out later this year.As I said earlier, back in the late 70s and early 80s he did wonders turning what had often been a shambolic amateurish circus into a slick professional outfit.
That was the good bit.
In recent years his involvment has only been to the detriment of the sport - losing classic tracks, shifting to countries with no tradition or even affection for motor racing etc.
Luckilly, he can't hang around too much longer - although I remember saying that to myself ten years ago
.Eric, I agree with on BCE turning round F1 and I'm not really not sure about some of his actions in the recent years.
Whatever you think about him you can't but have respect for his business sense.
He came to F1 when it cost teams to race. Which they did 'cause they loved racing.
Now they get paid silly money to race - which some would, still, do for no money 'cause they love racing.
Look at it this way. BCE has made himself a lot of money, he has make a lot of other people a lot of money, in return we get to watch F1 races every other weekend rather than a 1 min clip on the news.
I know I've not explained it very well but I hope you all see where I'm coming from/meaning.
.....................
GarrettMacD said:
....a BRDC member is a fairly handy racing driver, although I did see that logo on Jason Plato's overalls, so they must make the odd exception...
Thats a bit naughty but still very good 
t Neal...chris_w said:
He has clearly had a massive impact upon the business of F1 (and hence the sport). He's given it direction, cohesion and made everyone a pot of money to boot (most notably for himself).
Personally I feel he's now done all he can to raise the profile of the sport globally and we've achieved a state where his continual attempts to milk ever more money from the F1 gravy train are starting to be severely detrimental to the sport. We have races held in locations where there is not a huge local interest in the sport, and an ever expanding calendar where there is a danger of the traditional races that give the championship a sense of history being lost.
His continual sniping at Silverstone is also very boring (I had a great weekend there and the track and facilities are easily better than Spa, Monza and Montreal), he seems to have only one negotiating tactic left when it comes to the older cicuits - the threat of taking the race elsewhere.
I would have shouted 'time to get out of the way old man' and maybe clipped him with your wing mirror just to make sure he got the message.
Well said Personally I feel he's now done all he can to raise the profile of the sport globally and we've achieved a state where his continual attempts to milk ever more money from the F1 gravy train are starting to be severely detrimental to the sport. We have races held in locations where there is not a huge local interest in the sport, and an ever expanding calendar where there is a danger of the traditional races that give the championship a sense of history being lost.
His continual sniping at Silverstone is also very boring (I had a great weekend there and the track and facilities are easily better than Spa, Monza and Montreal), he seems to have only one negotiating tactic left when it comes to the older cicuits - the threat of taking the race elsewhere.
I would have shouted 'time to get out of the way old man' and maybe clipped him with your wing mirror just to make sure he got the message.
A good well balanced post. Edited by Piglet on Monday 9th July 20:29
GarrettMacD said:
loneranger said:
I was told that he doesn't like Silverstone because the BRDC wouldn't let him join their club!
Don't thay have some fairly stringent entry criteria though??? Something like at least a couple of seasons of consistent success in an international championship. I think Bernie only ever went to F3 level in the UK. It's safe to assume that a BRDC member is a fairly handy racing driver, although I did see that logo on Jason Plato's overalls, so they must make the odd exception...Are you sure that Bernie isn't a member?
flemke said:
There are loads of members who have been invited to join for reasons other than their race driving.
Are you sure that Bernie isn't a member?
I wasn't aware that one could be invited without some sort of race pedigree. I can only assume that the invitees must be bringing some other sort of specailist experience that the club is in need of - ££££'s???Are you sure that Bernie isn't a member?
As for Bernie being a member or not, I am assuming he's not, and to be honest, I don't think he's a commitee kind of guy. More of an iron fist in a (very small) glove...
GarrettMacD said:
flemke said:
There are loads of members who have been invited to join for reasons other than their race driving.
Are you sure that Bernie isn't a member?
I wasn't aware that one could be invited without some sort of race pedigree. I can only assume that the invitees must be bringing some other sort of specailist experience that the club is in need of - ££££'s???Are you sure that Bernie isn't a member?
As for Bernie being a member or not, I am assuming he's not, and to be honest, I don't think he's a commitee kind of guy. More of an iron fist in a (very small) glove...
Ron Dennis, Frank Williams, Murray Walker...
A friend who's an active member told me recently that BCE is also a member, and we laughed at the irony.
The BRDC is packed with members who could bail out Silverstone, but like so many British sports they don't have the brains nor the balls. Silverstone has the space and the council want expansion but too many 'blazers' will not deal with people who want to take over their land and develop it. Sport is professional, F1 is business and the sooner these people wake upto the facts the better. Government should not be paying, but if I had the money I would buy out the BRDC and develop the whole site...moving the GP to Donington.
belleair302 said:
The BRDC is packed with members who could bail out Silverstone, but like so many British sports they don't have the brains nor the balls. Silverstone has the space and the council want expansion but too many 'blazers' will not deal with people who want to take over their land and develop it. Sport is professional, F1 is business and the sooner these people wake upto the facts the better. Government should not be paying, but if I had the money I would buy out the BRDC and develop the whole site...moving the GP to Donington.
The club is not a single homogeneous entity, but rather an eclectic mix of characters who collectively have shown the ability to behave perversely.Ray Bellm may not be Mr Warmth, but he came in and pretty much pulled the club back from the brink. To show their appreciation, the club sacked him.
Flemke....how right you are. But the BRDC like the RFU or the LTA must look at the bigger picture and not live in the past. F1 makes money, maybe not enough for the circuit operators, but they need to develop the site or Bernie will take it away. Somebody will offer the BRDC money for the whole complex, lease them back premises and then develop the facilities, offering the public more and making the whole place more 21st centure. Its expensive but more events (non motorsport) should be held there to generate additional cashflow.
belleair302 said:
Flemke....how right you are. But the BRDC like the RFU or the LTA must look at the bigger picture and not live in the past. F1 makes money, maybe not enough for the circuit operators, but they need to develop the site or Bernie will take it away. Somebody will offer the BRDC money for the whole complex, lease them back premises and then develop the facilities, offering the public more and making the whole place more 21st centure. Its expensive but more events (non motorsport) should be held there to generate additional cashflow.
I quite accept that that is the reality.It is just such a shame that, with the staggering amount of money floating about in F1, and with the outrageous sums pissed away in self-indulgence and self-promotion, a circuit has to be brought to its knees because its not being subsidised by money belonging to Malaysian, Chinese, or Turkish taxpayers.
You will have noticed that it didn't take the Governemnt long to stump up the dough for the Olympics and the Tour de France, and justify those politicians' vanity projects with economic projections that are utterly risible.
Yet another victory for political correctness, and another regrettable consequence of Blair's bright idea to take a million quid from Bernie in return for...future considerations.
The Olympics will remain a massive mistake for maybe ten years after 2012. Just loo at how long it has taken for the Millenium Dome (O2 Arena) to become commercially viable. Politicians and sport do not mix, although MP's love a good freebie. At some point either private equity groups or a major entertainment group will make F1 a better spectacle here in the UK and will develop Silverstone into more thna just a circuit....but when and who, who knows. The BRDC are in a mess and Bernie knows that if he can just wait a year or two he may be offered the promotional rights for a small fee and away we go. Maybe his backers will make an offer?
Picking up some of the points raised....
BCE was a member of the BRDC, I'm not sure if he still is but he has been in the past.
Don't forgot Octagon took a 20 year lease of Silverstone and attempted to promote it. They then worked out that the GP isn't the cash cow it's suggested to be (especially after the deal dear Nicola put together with one BCE to get it away from Silverstone!), and their parent company pulled them out after losing a very large sum of money in quite a short time (over the four now MSV circuits and Silverstone).
Running a GP requires a vast amount of investment both in fees payable to hold one and the works required to bring the circuit infrastructure up to the standard required by BCE in his Daily Mail rants. There is no long term contract awarded and the money that is received back by the circuit isn't a vast amount (its the ticket sales as I understand it).
The difficulty for the BRDC is that they are a not for profit organisation charged with promoting and supporting grass roots motorsport in the UK. There is a lot of feeling within the Club that the risk to the Club of running a GP and investing the required amounts is too great to take.
The 2000 April GP with its resultant problems nearly crippled them and they only have one real asset that their charter requires them to protect.
As for Government/Local Authority support - the Local Authority recently refused consent for a hotel development at Silverstone!
BCE was a member of the BRDC, I'm not sure if he still is but he has been in the past.
Don't forgot Octagon took a 20 year lease of Silverstone and attempted to promote it. They then worked out that the GP isn't the cash cow it's suggested to be (especially after the deal dear Nicola put together with one BCE to get it away from Silverstone!), and their parent company pulled them out after losing a very large sum of money in quite a short time (over the four now MSV circuits and Silverstone).
Running a GP requires a vast amount of investment both in fees payable to hold one and the works required to bring the circuit infrastructure up to the standard required by BCE in his Daily Mail rants. There is no long term contract awarded and the money that is received back by the circuit isn't a vast amount (its the ticket sales as I understand it).
The difficulty for the BRDC is that they are a not for profit organisation charged with promoting and supporting grass roots motorsport in the UK. There is a lot of feeling within the Club that the risk to the Club of running a GP and investing the required amounts is too great to take.
The 2000 April GP with its resultant problems nearly crippled them and they only have one real asset that their charter requires them to protect.
As for Government/Local Authority support - the Local Authority recently refused consent for a hotel development at Silverstone!
chris_w said:
lots of very well said stuff
very well put chris. agree completely with your first post. no single man has done more for the sport, but his continuous threats are tedious beyond belief. he seems to have forgotten most of us go to an F1 race to watch a race, not marvel at gold plated urinals. and silverstone usual provides a great one.
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