Disgusted with Alonso

[air cooled]

For the record the Bild zeitung in Germany ran a series of articles during the summer questioning whether or not it was Hamilton who was being held back by Maclaren. The Bild zeitung is the German version of the sun, sport, t*ts etc. So to claim that "the rest of the world" is more F.A. friendly is not correct. Talking regularly with race fans in several european countries opinions of F.A. have changed over this year and he is no longer seen as worthy. Of course there are the few who wont change their opinions, a little like PH posts (notice it is always the same few F.A. fans who turn up).
Yup ! you know who you are !

It is not Hamilton's fault that the mee-ja go over the top with praise, it is only in keeping with the crap spouted about other international sports and foreigners in general. There are a few PH threads that contain plenty of "Brit beats foreigner" opinions.

As for F.A. the worthy nearly 3 times Champ - that doesn't stand either.
2005 - was all about tyres and only michelin teams were in with a chance.
funny how the french tyres went best on french cars eh?
2006 - mid season was dominated by the front suspension saga: Renault's system was declared illegal as a moving aerodynamic aid - same system used in 2005 mind ? Just wonder whether it was therefore also illegal in 2005.
Both seasons had F.A. whinging to the mee-ja every time someone put a mike his way too, remember Renault didn't love him enough, tyre testing should be stopped, etc etc etc.
(wonder when Stepney became disillusioned with Ferrari - before or after Schumacher's engine blew at the penultimate race? just a thought)

Spantard - says it all

[Heebeegeetee]

air cooled said:

As for F.A. the worthy nearly 3 times Champ - that doesn't stand either.
2005 - was all about tyres and only michelin teams were in with a chance.
funny how the french tyres went best on french cars eh?
2006 - mid season was dominated by the front suspension saga: Renault's system was declared illegal as a moving aerodynamic aid - same system used in 2005 mind ? Just wonder whether it was therefore also illegal in 2005.

Oh, so Alonso only wins through pure luck?

Blimey, you wouldn't care to dissect Schumachers 7 championships as well, would you?

[5.0%]

bennno said:

Alonso appears to have been exceptionally disloyal to McLaren this year, both in terms of his press outbursts and in his involvement which ultimately led to the team being stripped of all points this year. I read today he is now in Italy volunteering evidence. Over the last week have read from all sources of his criticism for Ron Dennis and favouritism being shown for his team mate.

Personally I have lost all respect for the whining spaniard, who simply appears to be throwing his toys out of the pram as he is up against a team mate for the first time who clearly has a similar or better capability.

The damage he has caused to McLaren and RD this year, with the potential knock on for their sponsors has been significant. Even when Prost and Senna were neck and neck in the championships for McLaren neither turned on the team.

For me I half wish he wins the championship as he will then look a fool. I then hope he loses his seat for next year as if you did as he has done in any other form of paid employment you would be out of the door before its possible to say gross misconduct.

Bennno

Bloody dago Alonso, how dare he be in the same team as Saint Hamilton. Totally shocking. And the ITV showing cars other than Saint Hamilton's during the race. Totally Shocking.
Saint Hamilton is the best racing driver ever, I know this because I heard it on ITV and I told everyone at kindergarten.
That dago Alonso isn't even British, what's he doing in a British McLaren car. Totally shocking. And he even tries to race with our Saint Lewis. Who does he think he is? Totally Shocking. He should go back to Benidorm and work as a waiter like all the other dagos.

Must go now, mummy says I shouldn't play with her computer.

[air cooled]

Schumacher's first two championships were won with the same team as Spantard.
And they both involved controversial team mechanicals. The FIA were trying to point the finger at the 94 Bennetton as being illegal due to the software it used. As they couldn't they tried to ban the driver instead, leading to the Silverstone black flag.
In 95 the Walkinshaw/Flavio outfit (Same Flavio as now remember) used a non spec refueling rig to gain a few tenths, came unstuck at Hockenheim.

So yes I can recall a few interesting items from the Bennetton Renault history book. For the record its the same Renault as pulled the plug on Mansell to put Prost in the winning car and the same Renault who shafted Danon Hill too.

Any way it doesn't matter how many posts the Spantard supporters put up or how fast they post them they, that is the Spantard supporters are, the tiny minority. (Probably Spanish as well!!!!!)

[Heebeegeetee]

air cooled said:

Schumacher's first two championships were won with the same team as Spantard.
And they both involved controversial team mechanicals. The FIA were trying to point the finger at the 94 Bennetton as being illegal due to the software it used. As they couldn't they tried to ban the driver instead, leading to the Silverstone black flag.
In 95 the Walkinshaw/Flavio outfit (Same Flavio as now remember) used a non spec refueling rig to gain a few tenths, came unstuck at Hockenheim.

So yes I can recall a few interesting items from the Bennetton Renault history book. For the record its the same Renault as pulled the plug on Mansell to put Prost in the winning car and the same Renault who shafted Danon Hill too.

Any way it doesn't matter how many posts the Spantard supporters put up or how fast they post them they, that is the Spantard supporters are, the tiny minority. (Probably Spanish as well!!!!!)

So has anyone ever won a championship fair and square, bearing in mind that no-one ever won a championship in a crap car, so i guess they've all been lucky?

I mean, Jim Clark won all his championships with Colin Chapman, and he was a right rogue.

[stew-S160]

heebee- do you recall last year when FA was complaining that renault were not supporting him in the last few races. yet he still drove exactly how he was all seasons and was still quicker than fisi by the same amount.

FA is just a git. plain and simple.

[mattikake]

Heebeegeetee said:

mattikake said:

Heebeegeetee said:

Well, take the Alain prost saga i mentioned - he tested at a circuit with the team and was consistently within a tenth of Senna, then when they return to the circuit a month or so later he's suddenly a second slower than Senna. He knew clearly that something was up, and it turned out that Honda were supplying him duff engines. Prost complained to the media, Honda were dee[ly embarrased, and after that the drivers got to pick their engines and Prost was never that slow again. So how precisely, was he supposed to 'let his driving do the talking'? At the time, Prost said "call me a whinger if you like but don't call me stupid".

Wasn't that down to Honda not McLaren? I seem to remember Honda doing exactly the same thing with Mansell and Piquet in '87 at Williams. Mansell at one point in the season was losing 18Kph on the straights to Piquet pure through engine power!

Only if (again) we are to believe that the team don't know whats going on within the team, and I know that Prost was left pretty much to fight his own battle. Being the political animal that he was, he did.

Edited by Heebeegeetee on Thursday 11th October 15:02

Interesting opinion. You know at the time, I thought Prost was a scheming git, and couldn't handle Senna simply being better than him (as many a comparison between FA and LH), even if only by a tenth or two at most races, so played the political game instead and manipulated McLaren to suit him. It was Senna that I remember getting most upset about a perceived lack of fairness in the team, which was where their feud promptly started in Imola '88, after Senna decided not to stick to Prost's gentleman's agreement over whoever entered the first corner first should win the race... Of course in the end this team manipulation didn't work either, so Prost left for Ferrari. Somewhere where FA has been linked since. Deja Vu anyone?!

If both McLaren and Williams were unable to notice (either too late or not at all) that engines supplied by Honda could not only be variable in power but also in reliability, then it seems pretty fair to me to say that this can happen again, and to any team? There are a lot of employees afterall and you can't know what all of the are doing all of the time.

It's my firm belief that RD has always wanted a fair fight for his drivers as this gets the best out of them. Even with Prost and Lauda.

Depends what side of the fence you choose I guess, as there appears to be equal reason to stand either side.

Anyway, all said, I've never ever heard of a driver being so disloyal to his own team. That's self-destructive and not very clever really, is it? LH can take short stabs at FA wherever he chooses, he doesn't have to say much to imply there's only one driver acting like the younger 'rookie'...

Edited by mattikake on Thursday 11th October 15:47

[Marki]

air cooled said:

Spantard.

[Heebeegeetee]

stew-S160 said:

heebee- do you recall last year when FA was complaining that renault were not supporting him in the last few races.

No, I don't actually, I recall him moaning once or twice when Fisi was impeding him from tackling schumacher, but I don't think he had much more than that to moan about.

I've never read such bile for, say, Jenson, so I think we can safely say that britain loves a loser but can't stomach a win-at-all-costs merchant? You'll have to pardon me if I step outside the thinking of the masses, if you don't mind.

[mattikake]

Heebeegeetee said:

stew-S160 said:

heebee- do you recall last year when FA was complaining that renault were not supporting him in the last few races.

No, I don't actually, I recall him moaning once or twice when Fisi was impeding him from tackling schumacher, but I don't think he had much more than that to moan about.

Fans always have selective hearing. This is what is means to be a fan.

Heebeegeetee said:

I've never read such bile for, say, Jenson, so I think we can safely say that britain loves a loser but can't stomach a win-at-all-costs merchant?

I think that's more like the British media loves a loser... and the British public hate a cheating as opposed to 'win-at-all-costs merchant'? Pick your side of the fence...

Heebeegeetee said:

You'll have to pardon me if I step outside the thinking of the masses, if you don't mind.

I didn't know a few people on PH represented the masses? The 'masses' usually implies the ill-informed and quick to judge, which usually means lead by the media. I'd say people on here are enthusiasts which are more likely NOT to be lead by the media and forming their own opinions. I know I'm not. In fact I'm considered somewhat as a heartless rebel... by the 'masses'. Ok, ok, so I get-off on it?!

Edited by mattikake on Thursday 11th October 16:14

[air cooled]

Heebeegeetee said:

stew-S160 said:

heebee- do you recall last year when FA was complaining that renault were not supporting him in the last few races.

No, I don't actually, I recall him moaning once or twice when Fisi was impeding him from tackling schumacher, but I don't think he had much more than that to moan about.

I've never read such bile for, say, Jenson, so I think we can safely say that britain loves a loser but can't stomach a win-at-all-costs merchant? You'll have to pardon me if I step outside the thinking of the masses, if you don't mind.

Then it is a shame the MINORITY cannot remember F.A. whinging on last year about Renault not loving him because just about every other PHer here can remember it quite clearly. Probably a few will remember the season prior him whinging on that the FIA should ban Tyre testing. He has brought the negative reaction from the MAJORITY down upon himself by standing in front of cameras and whinging. Might go down well with his home crowd but few others Brits or not.

[Heebeegeetee]

mattikake said:

I think that's more like the British media loves a loser... and the British public hate a cheating as opposed to 'win-at-all-costs merchant'? Pick your side of the fence...

So who's cheating? I wasn't aware there was any real cheating as such, going on, and I would remind you to think of which team has been found guilty of cheating, and that Lewis was investigated after Japan.

mattikake said:

I didn't know a few people on PH represented the masses? The 'masses' usually implies the ill-informed and quick to judge, which usually means lead by the media. I'd say people on here are enthusiasts which are more likely NOT to be lead by the media and forming their own opinions. I know I'm not. In fact I'm considered somewhat as a heartless rebel... by the 'masses'. Ok, ok, so I get-off on it?!

I think thats exactly what is going on though, there's a media led tirade going on here. I don't read autosport and motoring news every week any more, but i think i read enough, what with the web etc. Clearly, there is another side to this story, but for whatever reason, i can never find it in the brit media.

[bennno]

Heebeegeetee said:

Clearly, there is another side to this story, but for whatever reason, i can never find it in the brit media.

Ahey, Alonso is permanently in the british media
- publicly slating Ron Dennis publicly for the teams issues and their off track problems
- suggesting that he is getting poor treatment by comparison
- Alonso's comments in May about the team giving him nothing whilst he has given the 2-3 seconds a lap
- Smashing up Hospitality centre at last race weekend,
- Giving evidence against the team to the FIA
- pushing his team mate Hamilton off the circuit in Belgium
- publicly criticising the FIA for not penalising Hamiltons driving behind the pace car the other weekend
- constant griping about he is only slower due to the team favouring their other driver

I would love to see him win next weekend as he should then be thoroughly embarrassed by his behavour this season. There isnt another sport where it would be tolerated nor any other form of employment where you can do as he has done to his employer.

I wouldnt currently put it past him to try to drive Hamilton off the track this weekend, if he has a mechanical fault.

Put simply he has had his back to the wall all season by a driver thats at least as good as him, as a result his toys have been thrown about and he has made himself look like an ungracious idiot.

Bennno

[mattikake]

Heebeegeetee said:

mattikake said:

I think that's more like the British media loves a loser... and the British public hate a cheating as opposed to 'win-at-all-costs merchant'? Pick your side of the fence...

So who's cheating? I wasn't aware there was any real cheating as such, going on, and I would remind you to think of which team has been found guilty of cheating, and that Lewis was investigated after Japan.

Sorry I was being general, not referring to anyone in particular nor even to F1... as I thought you were. Nevermind. No-one likes a blatent cheat, a bit like Schumi... Oops. Damn. I said it!

Anyway, LH was found innocent of the safety car incident, so OFFICIALLY he wasn't cheating.

[rude-boy]

bennno said:

Put simply he has had his back to the wall all season by a driver thats at least as good as him, as a result his toys have been thrown about and he has made himself look like an ungracious idiot.

Sums it up in one for me.

I was an Alonso supporter; although I did think it a tad childish when he made his comments last year (biting the hand that feeds you is never the best idea in the World is it?)but you take the rough with the smooth. Going into this year, and even up to Monaco, I wanted him to win the WDC, Hamilton second, Massa third. Not now. Hell I’d rather Mosley won than FA.

The side he has shown this year though goes beyond 'sporting rivalry' and gamesmanship. Any one (save for the alleged 'blackmailing' incident) of the things FA has done this year would be naughty, but you would live with it. I especially didn't like the Spa move but truth be told I would have been far happier with it if it had been LH giving... Add them all up though and I have to say I have lost almost all respect for FA as a person (like he would care ) although his driving still puts him in the top 5 of the current crop in F1 IMO.

[rude-boy]

Heebeegeetee said:

...that Lewis was investigated after Japan.

Was a total joke, think back to JPM/Schumy and the countless other times incidents have occoured behing the Safety car in F1, let alone the surprising number i see every year

[5.0%]

bennno said:

Heebeegeetee said:

Clearly, there is another side to this story, but for whatever reason, i can never find it in the brit media.

Ahey, Alonso is permanently in the british media
- publicly slating Ron Dennis publicly for the teams issues and their off track problems
- suggesting that he is getting poor treatment by comparison
- Alonso's comments in May about the team giving him nothing whilst he has given the 2-3 seconds a lap
- Smashing up Hospitality centre at last race weekend,
- Giving evidence against the team to the FIA
- pushing his team mate Hamilton off the circuit in Belgium
- publicly criticising the FIA for not penalising Hamiltons driving behind the pace car the other weekend
- constant griping about he is only slower due to the team favouring their other driver

I would love to see him win next weekend as he should then be thoroughly embarrassed by his behavour this season. There isnt another sport where it would be tolerated nor any other form of employment where you can do as he has done to his employer.

I wouldnt currently put it past him to try to drive Hamilton off the track this weekend, if he has a mechanical fault.

Put simply he has had his back to the wall all season by a driver thats at least as good as him, as a result his toys have been thrown about and he has made himself look like an ungracious idiot.

Bennno

Do you never feel that the British Media may be leading you by the nose?

[Conian]

5.0percent said:

Bloody dago Alonso, how dare he be in the same team as Saint Hamilton. Totally shocking. And the ITV showing cars other than Saint Hamilton's during the race. Totally Shocking.
Saint Hamilton is the best racing driver ever, I know this because I heard it on ITV and I told everyone at kindergarten.
That dago Alonso isn't even British, what's he doing in a British McLaren car. Totally shocking. And he even tries to race with our Saint Lewis. Who does he think he is? Totally Shocking. He should go back to Benidorm and work as a waiter like all the other dagos.

Must go now, mummy says I shouldn't play with her computer.

[bennno]

[quote=5.0%]

bennno said:

Heebeegeetee said:

Clearly, there is another side to this story, but for whatever reason, i can never find it in the brit media.

Ahey, Alonso is permanently in the british media
- publicly slating Ron Dennis publicly for the teams issues and their off track problems
- suggesting that he is getting poor treatment by comparison
- Alonso's comments in May about the team giving him nothing whilst he has given the 2-3 seconds a lap
- Smashing up Hospitality centre at last race weekend,
- Giving evidence against the team to the FIA
- pushing his team mate Hamilton off the circuit in Belgium
- publicly criticising the FIA for not penalising Hamiltons driving behind the pace car the other weekend
- constant griping about he is only slower due to the team favouring their other driver

I would love to see him win next weekend as he should then be thoroughly embarrassed by his behavour this season. There isnt another sport where it would be tolerated nor any other form of employment where you can do as he has done to his employer.

I wouldnt currently put it past him to try to drive Hamilton off the track this weekend, if he has a mechanical fault.

Put simply he has had his back to the wall all season by a driver thats at least as good as him, as a result his toys have been thrown about and he has made himself look like an ungracious idiot.

Bennno

Do you never feel that the British Media may be leading you by the nose?

Nah, if he was acting graciously about all this then I would still have the respect I had for him a year ago. Was genuinely excited to see him in a McLaren - but now fed up with his harping to anybody that will listen.

As below I half hope he wins the championship as it will show him up as a total e-diot.

Its actually made Hamilton who seems a bit smug and conceited in to appearing quite a nice fella.

I never saw the diatribe from Barichello or Massa at Ferrari partnering Schumi. It only seems to be those who end up being totally outqualified and raced by their team mate (e.g. JV) for the full season that show this kind of public disloyalty to their team.

Bennno

[baz1985]

I want LH to win, but

'We were racing Fernando'- ah that equality.