Titivating my Mercedes 124
Discussion
It's interesting (as I'm not paying the bill) to see how much work the car needs. From driving to Cannes a couple of years ago to seeing it at Newbury services a couple of weeks ago (how the mighty have fallen), from the topside it didn't look that bad, albeit your visible rust had developed much faster than mine on a car of similar age.
As you've said before, living in the North Sea will do it.
As you've said before, living in the North Sea will do it.
Just looking at some of the pictures from the Cannes trip back in 2019, it did look mint then, didn't it? (Pic below of an unblemished front wing on the Col de Turini.)
I don't think the front wings were as well prepared as they could have been back in 2014. Once rust appeared, it got ahold very quickly. In two years they have gone from flawless to pretty ropey. As for the underside, who knows? It has never previously had any welding underneath that I can think of. I feel a bit gloomy about the work done this week: I will have to have a difficult conversation with the welding man.
I don't think the front wings were as well prepared as they could have been back in 2014. Once rust appeared, it got ahold very quickly. In two years they have gone from flawless to pretty ropey. As for the underside, who knows? It has never previously had any welding underneath that I can think of. I feel a bit gloomy about the work done this week: I will have to have a difficult conversation with the welding man.
The repairs are OK, as is the welding. The time and effort required to make a repair indistinguishable from the original panel is an order of magnitude higher than a simpler, but sturdy patch. I wouldn't be unhappy with the work.
Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
Really, i dont think its worth the effort too swap the diff ratios, you will have slightly lower cruising rpm at the cost of acceleration and drivability. I think fitting a 722.6 with the ofgear controller is the way to go as that will give you a 5th overdrive gear and lockup. Slightly bigger job but you wont have to sacrifice acceleration.
Re the welding, personally i would of liked to butt weld and seam weld it so you know its not hiding anything and your not creating extra moisture traps by overlapping pieces. But as others have said the painting and rust prevention is probably more important as an expertly welded repair will rust faster than a poorly welded one if the paint and finishing is poor.
Re the welding, personally i would of liked to butt weld and seam weld it so you know its not hiding anything and your not creating extra moisture traps by overlapping pieces. But as others have said the painting and rust prevention is probably more important as an expertly welded repair will rust faster than a poorly welded one if the paint and finishing is poor.
Edited by w124tony on Saturday 17th July 11:27
mwstewart said:
The repairs are OK, as is the welding. The time and effort required to make a repair indistinguishable from the original panel is an order of magnitude higher than a simpler, but sturdy patch. I wouldn't be unhappy with the work.
Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
Thank you so much for this reassuring contribution. Knowing what you know about these things, if you think it's ok then it's ok for me. I went to see the chap who is doing it today and I am pretty confident in him. The surface treatment will be rust converter, zinc primer, seam sealer, epoxy mastic, stone chip; there will be cavity wax in the cavities. All Bilt Hamber apart from the stone chip which is 3M.Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
w124tony said:
Really, i dont think its worth the effort too swap the diff ratios, you will have slightly lower cruising rpm at the cost of acceleration and drivability. I think fitting a 722.6 with the ofgear controller is the way to go as that will give you a 5th overdrive gear and lockup. Slightly bigger job but you wont have to sacrifice acceleration.
My diff is worn out so something needs to be done. And besides, the subframe is out and a new subframe is going in, so fitting a used but unworn diff from a saloon adds very little in the scheme of things. I have new mounting bushes and all that stuff. The chap who is doing the job is almost finished fitting an OM606 turbo to his Sprinter and recently put a M112k into a 190 so if anyone could do a transmission swap, he could. I am attracted to the idea of an OM606 turbo with a 722.6 but when the engine and transmission are original and hardly touched, it seems a shame to take them out.I picked up a load of suspension pipes from MB Newcastle today, including two pipes which go from the valve above the rear axle to and from the tank and pump at the front of the engine bay. MB were worried about how to transport them as they came in 5m long cardboard tubes from Germany and they couldn't get them in their van. The totally absurd thing is that they cost £11.20 each. MB parts prices are bizarre.
what are you doing about the speedo in relation to changing the diff ratio - is it minimal that you are leaving it, or are you changing it?
My question earlier about the diff ratios for the e320 manual box is because I am going to put the engine and box into a 190, but I need a longer diff in it that the current one fitted as per the factory - I've done my research in terms of my diff options, but the speedo accuracy is yet to be solved
My question earlier about the diff ratios for the e320 manual box is because I am going to put the engine and box into a 190, but I need a longer diff in it that the current one fitted as per the factory - I've done my research in terms of my diff options, but the speedo accuracy is yet to be solved
Great post. Those hydraulic pipes were good value, not really worth making them for that price! Might be worth replacing the metal clamps that go on the rubbers that hold the hydraulic and fuel pipes to the underside of the car, if you can afford them. I've just replace ours with genuine MB ones. Would you believe 40 and 85 pence each for the two types (plus vat of course).
Keep up the good work
Keep up the good work
KrisP said:
what are you doing about the speedo in relation to changing the diff ratio - is it minimal that you are leaving it, or are you changing it?
My question earlier about the diff ratios for the e320 manual box is because I am going to put the engine and box into a 190, but I need a longer diff in it that the current one fitted as per the factory - I've done my research in terms of my diff options, but the speedo accuracy is yet to be solved
I think JDO Instruments can recalibrate them. They did a great job refurbishing my 190’s speedo for very little dosh.My question earlier about the diff ratios for the e320 manual box is because I am going to put the engine and box into a 190, but I need a longer diff in it that the current one fitted as per the factory - I've done my research in terms of my diff options, but the speedo accuracy is yet to be solved
If you can hack your way through the German, this is pretty inspirational.
http://wagen124.com/restauration-hinterachse-280te...
http://wagen124.com/restauration-hinterachse-280te...
mwstewart said:
The repairs are OK, as is the welding. The time and effort required to make a repair indistinguishable from the original panel is an order of magnitude higher than a simpler, but sturdy patch. I wouldn't be unhappy with the work.
Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
You're quite correct, the longevity will all be down to the products used. I wasn't suggesting that the patches should be indistinguishable. My point was that if I was paying someone to patch up a car the least I would expect is a repair that would pass an MOT. If that repair was being done for a retest my tester would expect to see the repaired area uncovered, he wouldn't pass a patch held on by stitches and tacks with gaps inbetween, the rules are clear:Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-inspection-manual-...
Of course if the repair isn't for a retest it'll be covered in seam sealer and nobody will be any the wiser, and you're right given the locations in question it'll probably be sturdy enough.
Edited by Accelebrate on Monday 19th July 14:13
Accelebrate said:
mwstewart said:
The repairs are OK, as is the welding. The time and effort required to make a repair indistinguishable from the original panel is an order of magnitude higher than a simpler, but sturdy patch. I wouldn't be unhappy with the work.
Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
You're quite correct, the longevity will all be down to the products used. I wasn't suggesting that the patches should be indistinguishable. My point was that if I was paying someone to patch up a car the least I would expect is a repair that would pass an MOT. If that repair was being done for a retest my tester would expect to see the repaired area uncovered, he wouldn't pass a patch held on by stitches and tacks with gaps inbetween, the rules are clear:Longevity of the repairs is ultimately determined by the final surface treatment. Ask the garage to use epoxy primer over the bare metal; I used to swear by etch primer as a first base, but epoxy really is incredible stuff. Seam sealer can go over the top to seal the joints.
Most important is a liberal coating of wax on both sides of the repairs and, ideally, the rest of the underside including subframes and brake pipes. It doesn't look pretty but it works.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-inspection-manual-...
It’s depressing how these old cars soldier on and then suddenly everything goes to pot. My ‘95 E300D, smoke silver like the anchor of this thread, pottered along for years with the odd thing needing doing, and now in the last couple of months it’s just started to fall apart: n/s lower control arm collapsed, so both sides and springs plus track rods replaced; exhaust back box blown; rear suspension crumbling; and the final insult, infra red central locking given up (when locked of course) when the passenger lock has also stopped working, which meant tailgate window out in the course of which discovering that the surface rust in the bottom o/s corner of the frame is (was) very deep and now we have a new hole, currently covered with gaffer tape pending decision on repair or replacement. I used to think the diesel engine rule would kill it (just had my letter from TfL explaining the new charges) but now I think it is just going to turn to dust.
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