Damn you, UKSaabs classifieds!! 99t buys another £350 Saab!!
Discussion
Cheers!
Since this is primarily a comfy commuter, I'll probably go for standard replacements in the main, only exception would be applications where the standard item has a reputation for failing quickly and where going poly isn't going to add significant noise or vibration.
Once the suspension is off, I'll decide whether the springs and dampers need replacing, and if so whether to splurge on an upgrade. It doesn't feel especially floaty so if I can re-use them I should. We'll see what the strip down reveals...
That said, I've just had an unexpected little windfall at work which would just cover a set of Eibach and Billies so the temptation is there!!
Since this is primarily a comfy commuter, I'll probably go for standard replacements in the main, only exception would be applications where the standard item has a reputation for failing quickly and where going poly isn't going to add significant noise or vibration.
Once the suspension is off, I'll decide whether the springs and dampers need replacing, and if so whether to splurge on an upgrade. It doesn't feel especially floaty so if I can re-use them I should. We'll see what the strip down reveals...
That said, I've just had an unexpected little windfall at work which would just cover a set of Eibach and Billies so the temptation is there!!
Possibly. I guess it all depends upon factors that can't be predicted with any great accuracy.
I could spend a thousand pounds plus making good the suspension with decent components and then get several years use out of the car with nothing more than basic maintenance and consumables. At which point it would feel like money well spent.
Alternatively I could spend the money and then have the turbo and gearbox s
t themselves catastophically the next day. Which would be mildly irritating.
Of course, in the worst case scenario, the good bits I bought would transfer to another example if needed.
I could spend a thousand pounds plus making good the suspension with decent components and then get several years use out of the car with nothing more than basic maintenance and consumables. At which point it would feel like money well spent.
Alternatively I could spend the money and then have the turbo and gearbox s
t themselves catastophically the next day. Which would be mildly irritating.Of course, in the worst case scenario, the good bits I bought would transfer to another example if needed.
Indeed. Very few cars where any form of improvement can be justified from a purely financial perspective. Although I have achieved break-even in the past on classics, generally it is rare indeed to get back what you spend on humdrum stuff.
So if it can't be justified financially then one has to look for more esoteric motivation. Buying shiny new parts is always satisfying as is the feeling of a job done well. And if the car feels better as a result then that will be appreciated too.
I think the key thing to bear in mind is that I'm not running a £350 shed because I have to, but because I enjoy the character and foibles of an older car, and the satisfaction of keeping it reliable and making improvements.
It may well be a form of madness, but I like it!!
So if it can't be justified financially then one has to look for more esoteric motivation. Buying shiny new parts is always satisfying as is the feeling of a job done well. And if the car feels better as a result then that will be appreciated too.
I think the key thing to bear in mind is that I'm not running a £350 shed because I have to, but because I enjoy the character and foibles of an older car, and the satisfaction of keeping it reliable and making improvements.
It may well be a form of madness, but I like it!!
C70R said:
If you're going to spend >£400 on suspension for a £350 car, why not buy an ~£800 car in the first place that is probably better all round?
I've looked at plenty of 9-5's over the years, this one was better in all the key areas than ones I'd seen at substantially more than ~£800 and indeed ~£1,800, which was one of the main reasons I bought it.Cost ≠ value
rxe said:
A dab of black paint on the tops of the LEDs should tone it down a bit - more redneck than resistors (which is the correct answer) but probably easier!
Back to the over-bright LED's and a bit of fettling at the weekend - I didn't want to start hacking stuff into the perfectly functional loom so went full redneck - well I do own an El Camino, what else would you expect? I found filtering the LED's directly tended to make the light a bit uneven so instead removed the front of the switches and tried various types of tape applied directly to the back of the symbol.
After a little trial and error, I settled on some carpet fixing tape as being close to the correct density, with decent results.
Before
After
Although one fan symbol looks a bit bright in the photo, it isn't really noticeable to the eye, certainly not to the casual glance anyway.
Suspension refresh commenced at the weekend, so the 9-5 is now SORN and tucked up in the barn and in good company!
Initial snag was the front discs were absolutely solid on the hubs. Increasingly violent hammering was having no effect other than starting to mark the inside face - despite being a little crusty around the edges, they are barely worn so I want to re-use them.
Instead, I tried a little trick I picked up in Internetland - reinsert the caliper carrier bolts without the carrier and use their full length to push the disc off.
Have to say this worked like a charm!
Struts came out easily next - they are OE spec and may be the originals, but are in remarkably good condition if so. Certainly they don't look sixteen years and 172k miles old. The powder coating is still on the springs and neither damper has any sign of leakage. Even the top mount rubbers look good and the bearings rotate smoothly.
Drop links were a bit tired as expected and will be replaced along with both bottom ball joints, although none were in terrible condition.
Will pull the lower arms next time and inspect the bushes closely but they don't look bad, at least whilst in-situ...
Initial snag was the front discs were absolutely solid on the hubs. Increasingly violent hammering was having no effect other than starting to mark the inside face - despite being a little crusty around the edges, they are barely worn so I want to re-use them.
Instead, I tried a little trick I picked up in Internetland - reinsert the caliper carrier bolts without the carrier and use their full length to push the disc off.
Have to say this worked like a charm!
Struts came out easily next - they are OE spec and may be the originals, but are in remarkably good condition if so. Certainly they don't look sixteen years and 172k miles old. The powder coating is still on the springs and neither damper has any sign of leakage. Even the top mount rubbers look good and the bearings rotate smoothly.
Drop links were a bit tired as expected and will be replaced along with both bottom ball joints, although none were in terrible condition.
Will pull the lower arms next time and inspect the bushes closely but they don't look bad, at least whilst in-situ...
It was all going so smoothly!
Of course, before removing the struts I should have loosened the pinch bolts for the balljoint to control arm since strut removal meant the upright was now flopping around attached only by the balljoint and driveshaft. The pinch bolts were very tight so the only option was to re-fit the struts temporarily!
Having done so, and left the pinch bolts to soak overnight, I had another try - very tight indeed...
Sigh!
Cue much swearing, brute force and tea breaks, combined with a breaker bar on the bolt head slowly gaining a little rotation and then a drift on the snapped off remains.
Removing both pinch bolts took much of the day, even though the offside nut did undo rather than snap the bolt, the bolt itself still wasn't for moving.
Finally though, both ball joints were free and the lower arms and stuts removed (again).
Candidate for the "Council" thread?
Inspected the control arm bushes, not bad at all really but the arms are really crusty, the ball joints are shot and a couple of bushes are just starting to show some signs of cracking so I will replace both arms complete and be done with it.
Split the track rod ends from the uprights, just to check for play, both still felt like new, rubbers not cracking so no need to replace at this stage.
The subframe bushes don't look bad at all from what I can see, need to have a bit of a lever and check for movement. Amazed just how rust-free the subframe is though.
Next job is to investigate the engine and gearbox mounts since I fully expect at least the torque rod bushes to be shot...
Of course, before removing the struts I should have loosened the pinch bolts for the balljoint to control arm since strut removal meant the upright was now flopping around attached only by the balljoint and driveshaft. The pinch bolts were very tight so the only option was to re-fit the struts temporarily!
Having done so, and left the pinch bolts to soak overnight, I had another try - very tight indeed...
Sigh!
Cue much swearing, brute force and tea breaks, combined with a breaker bar on the bolt head slowly gaining a little rotation and then a drift on the snapped off remains.
Removing both pinch bolts took much of the day, even though the offside nut did undo rather than snap the bolt, the bolt itself still wasn't for moving.
Finally though, both ball joints were free and the lower arms and stuts removed (again).
Candidate for the "Council" thread?
Inspected the control arm bushes, not bad at all really but the arms are really crusty, the ball joints are shot and a couple of bushes are just starting to show some signs of cracking so I will replace both arms complete and be done with it.
Split the track rod ends from the uprights, just to check for play, both still felt like new, rubbers not cracking so no need to replace at this stage.
The subframe bushes don't look bad at all from what I can see, need to have a bit of a lever and check for movement. Amazed just how rust-free the subframe is though.
Next job is to investigate the engine and gearbox mounts since I fully expect at least the torque rod bushes to be shot...
Bit of a pause in progress recently due to a dodgy back and then a weekend away, but managed an hour or so this weekend.
Ground the lower drop link nuts off as they weren't for loosening by any less drastic means.
Removed the torque rod (gearbox mount / engine stabiliser) to find one bush to be a tad tired...
Duly ordered a replacement. Subframe bushes look ok as do the other engine mounts, so I don't think I need to touch any of them which is a relief!
Lower arms, balljoints and droplinks have already arrived so once the torque rod arrives I can reassemble the front end
Ground the lower drop link nuts off as they weren't for loosening by any less drastic means.
Removed the torque rod (gearbox mount / engine stabiliser) to find one bush to be a tad tired...
Duly ordered a replacement. Subframe bushes look ok as do the other engine mounts, so I don't think I need to touch any of them which is a relief!
Lower arms, balljoints and droplinks have already arrived so once the torque rod arrives I can reassemble the front end
This should have been back on the road by now, but isn't.
When I went to fit the new torque rod it was immediately obvious that the engine was sitting far too low for it to align properly. Jacking the engine slightly revealed a totally failed gearbox mount (which I had thought looked ok) so there was a delay until a new one could be obtained.
Compression of old vs new pretty obvious
Completely sheared rubber in old one.
Interestingly, the Febi replacement has a ground off part number on it which, from the tiniest amount of stamping still visable, would appear to be the proper Saab part number...
Mount was nice and easy to fit and the torque rod then bolted up correctly. Decided to put off re-fitting the suspension until my time off between Christmas and New Year.
Unfortunately, on our traditional Boxing Day family walk, I slipped (fractionally) on a piece of wet wood and jarred my back again, thus spending the remainder of my holiday pretty much immobile, recovering just sufficiently to return to work today!
Happy Bloody New Year!!!
When I went to fit the new torque rod it was immediately obvious that the engine was sitting far too low for it to align properly. Jacking the engine slightly revealed a totally failed gearbox mount (which I had thought looked ok) so there was a delay until a new one could be obtained.
Compression of old vs new pretty obvious
Completely sheared rubber in old one.
Interestingly, the Febi replacement has a ground off part number on it which, from the tiniest amount of stamping still visable, would appear to be the proper Saab part number...
Mount was nice and easy to fit and the torque rod then bolted up correctly. Decided to put off re-fitting the suspension until my time off between Christmas and New Year.
Unfortunately, on our traditional Boxing Day family walk, I slipped (fractionally) on a piece of wet wood and jarred my back again, thus spending the remainder of my holiday pretty much immobile, recovering just sufficiently to return to work today!
Happy Bloody New Year!!!
Cheers. I'm missing the relaxed waftyness the 9-5 to be honest.
Of the fleet, the 9-3 Aero 'vert is currently SORN'ed waiting for the worst of winter to pass; the Z4 is a little bit low for me to creak my back in and out of right now, and my usually trusty Skoda decided not to start the other day (possibly crank sensor I suspect) and although it started working again later the same day, I don't quite trust it for commuting until I've had a chance to diagnose properly.
This has left me with the Monaro as the only "in one piece", working and on the road car that I can currently drive! No great hardship mind, just so long as that one keeps on working!!
Of the fleet, the 9-3 Aero 'vert is currently SORN'ed waiting for the worst of winter to pass; the Z4 is a little bit low for me to creak my back in and out of right now, and my usually trusty Skoda decided not to start the other day (possibly crank sensor I suspect) and although it started working again later the same day, I don't quite trust it for commuting until I've had a chance to diagnose properly.
This has left me with the Monaro as the only "in one piece", working and on the road car that I can currently drive! No great hardship mind, just so long as that one keeps on working!!
Not that many 9000's around any more, that could be a good buy if it isn't rusty. Fortunately miles away from me!
However my New Year resolution is not to buy any "bargain" cars this year.
The fact that people are asking silly money for absolute piles of dross these days is going to help my cause, but that's another thread altogether...
Anyway, I've got to the start of day three and have only been on Ebay Motors once so far this year!!
However my New Year resolution is not to buy any "bargain" cars this year.
The fact that people are asking silly money for absolute piles of dross these days is going to help my cause, but that's another thread altogether...
Anyway, I've got to the start of day three and have only been on Ebay Motors once so far this year!!
No progress in January, partly due to me entering hibernation mode, partly due to the final decline of my father, who had been terminally ill for some time.
Necessary arrangements out of the way, some Saab shaped distraction seemed a good idea, so dragged myself back over to the barn.
I had removed the nearside arch liner to see if it provided a better view of engine or subframe mounts (it didn't) so took the opportunity to clean the metalwork up and check for rot.
Arch liner has done its job well
Just one bit of grot, around a sheared off stud that once helped secure the liner
Ground it back flush and then drilled the centre so I can use a self-tapper to re-fix the liner. Note rust creeping under paint
Cleaned the area back and treated with Phosphoric and wire brush until pits were completely cleaned (a little bit after this pic was taken)
Bit of zinc rich primer to protect the bare metal
I'll put some top coat over this before refitting the liner, won't be 279 Steel Grey as I don't have any, but that hardly matters as completely hidden when the liner is back on!!
Necessary arrangements out of the way, some Saab shaped distraction seemed a good idea, so dragged myself back over to the barn.
I had removed the nearside arch liner to see if it provided a better view of engine or subframe mounts (it didn't) so took the opportunity to clean the metalwork up and check for rot.
Arch liner has done its job well
Just one bit of grot, around a sheared off stud that once helped secure the liner
Ground it back flush and then drilled the centre so I can use a self-tapper to re-fix the liner. Note rust creeping under paint
Cleaned the area back and treated with Phosphoric and wire brush until pits were completely cleaned (a little bit after this pic was taken)
Bit of zinc rich primer to protect the bare metal
I'll put some top coat over this before refitting the liner, won't be 279 Steel Grey as I don't have any, but that hardly matters as completely hidden when the liner is back on!!
Thanks.
At the risk of revisiting the cost / value discussion on pages three and four of this thread, I agree that everywhere I've looked, poked and prodded, this does seem to be a pretty damn good example of a pre-facelift Aero, utterly regardless of the purchase price paid.
Given that early ones like this are getting rarer now, I'm pondering whether I should use this as planned - a cheap and cheerful commuting car to pretty much run into the ground with just basic maintenance, or whether I should continue to give it some TLC and tidy it up further - I don't think it would actually take that much to make it really nice.
Hmm...
At the risk of revisiting the cost / value discussion on pages three and four of this thread, I agree that everywhere I've looked, poked and prodded, this does seem to be a pretty damn good example of a pre-facelift Aero, utterly regardless of the purchase price paid.
Given that early ones like this are getting rarer now, I'm pondering whether I should use this as planned - a cheap and cheerful commuting car to pretty much run into the ground with just basic maintenance, or whether I should continue to give it some TLC and tidy it up further - I don't think it would actually take that much to make it really nice.
Hmm...
Based on the condition of ones I have looked at previously, nigh on impossible would be my guess.
I'm in the process of having a bit of a think about what to do with my "fleet".
As much as I like every car in it, the current number feels a bit unmanageable without neglecting my family duties, so some thinning out and changes are probably coming this year.
Not sure where that'll leave this old Saab yet, but it won't even be back on the road unless I get my finger out and put the front suspension back together!!
I'm in the process of having a bit of a think about what to do with my "fleet".
As much as I like every car in it, the current number feels a bit unmanageable without neglecting my family duties, so some thinning out and changes are probably coming this year.
Not sure where that'll leave this old Saab yet, but it won't even be back on the road unless I get my finger out and put the front suspension back together!!
As the temperature in the barn had reached the heady heights of 1℃ today, I decided to see if I could fit the new lower arms before losing feeling in my fingers and toes.
I had bought the arms complete with the bushes and ball joint already fitted and I slotted the first one into the subframe without problem. However when I connected up the ball joint to the upright, there was a distinct lack of clearance between the ball joint bolts and the pinch bolt as below.
Note the curious location of the massively thick washers...
Already rather chilly by that point I retreated home to consult the Saab EPC
Shakes head
Washers should be below the ball joint (which is where I would have expected them to be TBH)
I'll try again tomorrow, correct the assembly (and the other side which is also wrong) and see if the clearance looks better.
I had bought the arms complete with the bushes and ball joint already fitted and I slotted the first one into the subframe without problem. However when I connected up the ball joint to the upright, there was a distinct lack of clearance between the ball joint bolts and the pinch bolt as below.
Note the curious location of the massively thick washers...
Already rather chilly by that point I retreated home to consult the Saab EPC
Shakes head
Washers should be below the ball joint (which is where I would have expected them to be TBH)
I'll try again tomorrow, correct the assembly (and the other side which is also wrong) and see if the clearance looks better.
Cheers! 
Disassembled and reassembled the ball joint fittings correctly. Clearance now ok.
Now to torque up the control arms
ONE DEGREE!! Seriously? HTF are you supposed to measure one degree? And would it REALLY make a difference if it was just horizontal instead??!!
Some time later, after an awful lot of faffing around...
Disassembled and reassembled the ball joint fittings correctly. Clearance now ok.
Now to torque up the control arms
SAAB WIS said:
Some time later, after an awful lot of faffing around...
Cambs_Stuart said:
Impressive diligence!
Or not.Seems my earlier
was a tad premature.Looking again at the picture I uploaded before, I thought, "funny, the height of the ball joint nuts above the arm - almost looks like I've gone and put the ball joint above the arm rather than under it.... nah, I wouldn't have..... I couldn't have...."
Looked for another picture taken at the same time
OH FFS!!!!!
Seems whilst I was re-positioning the washers and ranting to myself about the imbecile at Scantech who assembled the ball joints wrongly, I became that imbecile!!
Sorted now.
At least a) I noticed and b) I hadn't fitted the struts, brakes etc which would have made it a far more annoying and lengthy cock up to fix.
Onward and upward...
All back together now.
I'd dumped the front wheels around the side of the garage and completely forgotten to send them for a refurb and new tyres!
As a quick Sunday fix, I borrowed two wheels from the 9-3 which will do the trick until the ALU28s are sorted.
Connected up the battery (without so much as a charge since the car last ran in October) and the old girl fired up first time and settled into a steady idle. Moved backwards and forwards a few times to let the suspension settle.
Still want to replace the thermostat and change the auto box fluid before I put her back into use, so the target is 1st April!!
I'd dumped the front wheels around the side of the garage and completely forgotten to send them for a refurb and new tyres!
As a quick Sunday fix, I borrowed two wheels from the 9-3 which will do the trick until the ALU28s are sorted.
Connected up the battery (without so much as a charge since the car last ran in October) and the old girl fired up first time and settled into a steady idle. Moved backwards and forwards a few times to let the suspension settle.
Still want to replace the thermostat and change the auto box fluid before I put her back into use, so the target is 1st April!!
Gassing Station | Readers' Cars | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff