Phoenix from the flames - Porsche Boxster with an Audi 2.7T
Discussion
Escy said:
Quick question about the easy bleed please. 
I have one and just tried to use it, for the first time. But mine doesn't seem to seal with the master cylinder. If the big bottle is empty and I add pressure it drops quickly. If I add fluid to the big bottle then add pressure it starts leaking out around the bottom of the cap and onto the top of the master. So can I ask does your just seal perfectly? Did you need to do anything special or funky to get it to seal?
Thanks
Escy said:
I dried it all out and got someone to run a hose pipe over the rear end while I looked for leaks. There was nothing. I then realised the leak was actually coming from the front.
I had something similar to this with my 986. But with mine it was simply water getting onto the pollen filter. I had some of the plastic covers under the wipers off the car and water was finding its way onto the pollen filter, then I assume through the air vent / fan / or whatever its called and onto the passenger floor. I didn't see in these pics a pollen filter anywhere. But I'm assuming the 987 has the pollen filter / fan in the same place as the 986 platform. It is exactly where your leak appears to be. 
mercedeslimos said:
I really do admire your perseverance. I think that as a project, I do the same thing, slowly work to absolute perfection - everything working, looking, sounding and driving the way I want it to. Certainly takes time.
Yeah, there's a big difference between running and driving and fully sorted. I can see why lots of projects run out of steam towards the end, you'd rather use it than chase minor issues. I've seen it said that the last 10% takes 90% of the time. There isn't much left on my to do list now. ATM said:
Quick question about the easy bleed please.
I have one and just tried to use it, for the first time. But mine doesn't seem to seal with the master cylinder. If the big bottle is empty and I add pressure it drops quickly. If I add fluid to the big bottle then add pressure it starts leaking out around the bottom of the cap and onto the top of the master. So can I ask does your just seal perfectly? Did you need to do anything special or funky to get it to seal?
Thanks
It sealed up fine on mine, have used it a few times without issue. There is a rubber seal inside the cap, does yours have it? I have one and just tried to use it, for the first time. But mine doesn't seem to seal with the master cylinder. If the big bottle is empty and I add pressure it drops quickly. If I add fluid to the big bottle then add pressure it starts leaking out around the bottom of the cap and onto the top of the master. So can I ask does your just seal perfectly? Did you need to do anything special or funky to get it to seal?
Thanks
I left the car in a rain storm with pallet wrap taped to the bulkhead under the area it was leaking. It stayed dry so I think I'm probably sorted on the water leak.
IMG_20231208_145012560
I bought an AC compressor and mounting bracket from a 2.7t. That's the one in the middle. The one on the left is the one that died. The one on the right is from a Boxster. After comparing them the Boxster one shared all the dimensions as the 2.7t and was less scabby so I used that.
IMG_20231203_174924767
I took it to Kwik Fit for the AC to be gassed. I wasn't holding much hope it would hold pressure since I hadn't worked out how the last lot of gas leaked out. It did hold pressure and the AC works. It's something I've been looking at for ages so glad to tick it off the list.
IMG_20231208_163453646
I've got new fittings for the WMI solenoid. It doesn't leak now. I also bought a new head for my pump which has threads so I can swap to compression fittings rather than use free push fit style. Unfortunately I bought the fittings from China, I thought they were UK supplied so I'll have to fit that at a later date.
IMG_20231208_145012560I bought an AC compressor and mounting bracket from a 2.7t. That's the one in the middle. The one on the left is the one that died. The one on the right is from a Boxster. After comparing them the Boxster one shared all the dimensions as the 2.7t and was less scabby so I used that.
IMG_20231203_174924767I took it to Kwik Fit for the AC to be gassed. I wasn't holding much hope it would hold pressure since I hadn't worked out how the last lot of gas leaked out. It did hold pressure and the AC works. It's something I've been looking at for ages so glad to tick it off the list.
IMG_20231208_163453646I've got new fittings for the WMI solenoid. It doesn't leak now. I also bought a new head for my pump which has threads so I can swap to compression fittings rather than use free push fit style. Unfortunately I bought the fittings from China, I thought they were UK supplied so I'll have to fit that at a later date.
Escy said:
ATM said:
Quick question about the easy bleed please.
I have one and just tried to use it, for the first time. But mine doesn't seem to seal with the master cylinder. If the big bottle is empty and I add pressure it drops quickly. If I add fluid to the big bottle then add pressure it starts leaking out around the bottom of the cap and onto the top of the master. So can I ask does your just seal perfectly? Did you need to do anything special or funky to get it to seal?
Thanks
It sealed up fine on mine, have used it a few times without issue. There is a rubber seal inside the cap, does yours have it? I have one and just tried to use it, for the first time. But mine doesn't seem to seal with the master cylinder. If the big bottle is empty and I add pressure it drops quickly. If I add fluid to the big bottle then add pressure it starts leaking out around the bottom of the cap and onto the top of the master. So can I ask does your just seal perfectly? Did you need to do anything special or funky to get it to seal?
Thanks
A small update. My boost control is finally sorted out, I've been making changes and seeing how it reacts. I've been going around in circles a bit. I asked Baldur (who made the ECU) to tune it for me. He'd make changes, I make a pull and send him a log. It took him 4 revisions to get it bang on - easy when you know what you are doing!
I've had some Boxster S gauges I wanted to fit for over a year. They had 115k on them and my car had 110k mileage. I didn't want to fit clocks with the wrong mileage, it's a bit silly as it makes no real difference. Waiting to do the 5k miles and swapping them over would be easy on a car that gets used but would probably take me 3 years.
My clocks were on 110,011 miles. I had a Nexpeak K1plus ODB tool that I bought previously, they specifically told me it had the ability to adjust the milage. It turns out it didn't work and I forgot about fitting them. I bought an ODB tool for my dad for Christmas, decided to get a decent one which said it was capable of adjusting the mileage, it was an Xtool A30M. This worked perfectly. My original clocks have the wrong mileage here as I was making sure it works before swapping them over.
IMG_20231221_122536909_HDR
The closest I could get my mileage was 110,025 so 14 out. Not bad. The Boxster S clocks are a silver dial which I think lifts the interior a bit. I don't like everything black. They also match my AEM canbus gauge. The speedo goes up to 190 rather than 175. That was a bit of a gimmick by Porsche as neither engine option could do 175mph anyway. I don't think mine would either unless I raised the rev limit.
IMG_20231221_130517811_HDR
I've had some Boxster S gauges I wanted to fit for over a year. They had 115k on them and my car had 110k mileage. I didn't want to fit clocks with the wrong mileage, it's a bit silly as it makes no real difference. Waiting to do the 5k miles and swapping them over would be easy on a car that gets used but would probably take me 3 years.
My clocks were on 110,011 miles. I had a Nexpeak K1plus ODB tool that I bought previously, they specifically told me it had the ability to adjust the milage. It turns out it didn't work and I forgot about fitting them. I bought an ODB tool for my dad for Christmas, decided to get a decent one which said it was capable of adjusting the mileage, it was an Xtool A30M. This worked perfectly. My original clocks have the wrong mileage here as I was making sure it works before swapping them over.
IMG_20231221_122536909_HDRThe closest I could get my mileage was 110,025 so 14 out. Not bad. The Boxster S clocks are a silver dial which I think lifts the interior a bit. I don't like everything black. They also match my AEM canbus gauge. The speedo goes up to 190 rather than 175. That was a bit of a gimmick by Porsche as neither engine option could do 175mph anyway. I don't think mine would either unless I raised the rev limit.
IMG_20231221_130517811_HDRTRIUMPHBULLET said:
some poor sod on PH bought a Jag F-pace and had problems that would have sent a mere mortal insane lol.
Speaking of which, how is the definition of how not to do cost cutting in the automotive manufacturing world doing?! Don't recall an update to that thread for a while so I presume the engine build is working just fine?mercedeslimos said:
It's all the small details that add up to a top-class build. Very jealous of your skills, well played sir!
Thanks. It's nice to get the little bits and pieces done, makes a difference to how you feel driving it. The AC felt like a milestone.TRIUMPHBULLET said:
Good to see you are getting somewhere with this, you have put a lot of work into the car.
Still, its only trivial problems you have had, some poor sod on PH bought a Jag F-pace and had problems that would have sent a mere mortal insane lol.
I've put a lot of work in but it's been worth the graft. Can't say the same for the Jag.Still, its only trivial problems you have had, some poor sod on PH bought a Jag F-pace and had problems that would have sent a mere mortal insane lol.
Adrian E said:
Speaking of which, how is the definition of how not to do cost cutting in the automotive manufacturing world doing?! Don't recall an update to that thread for a while so I presume the engine build is working just fine?
I updated it a few weeks ago, showing what I spent doing it. By the time it's running tidy the values have dropped so it was fruitless from a financial point of view but I like the car so not too bothered (providing it's trouble free for a while)My fuelling had been drifting leaner slightly over time but I hadn't really clocked it. I'm always adjusting stuff on the mapping so I've been adding fuel as I've been making other changes. It's not like I've ever had a locked down tune. Since the new larger injectors I fitted last spring my injector duty cycle % had started off in the high 60's and I was now in the mid 80's. Over a pull you could see the fuel pressure would drop off a bit. I think my fuel pump has been slowly degrading. I was running an APS 340lph pump. I fitted it when I had the original KO3 turbos in the red Boxster.
I bought a Bosch BR540 which is 415lph (it's also re-branded and sold as the DW400).
It's physically bigger than the old pump.
Fitted into the standard basket, I had to cut the bottom out of it to get it in, also needed to cut down the huge strainer that came with the pump as any bigger than the circle in the middle and it wouldn't fit back into the tank. Used an O-ring to hold down the edges where the strainer was cut. happy with it considering I was making it up as I went along. It fits snugly. I also upgraded the wiring size inside the tank which is a smaller gauge than the wires going to the plug on the outside.
I've been out for a drive, the fuel is now too rich a at the top end and my fuel pressure is higher so it was a worthwhile upgrade.
Whilst I was looking for a fuel pump I stumbled upon the Pierburg CWA-150, a new version of their charge cooler pump. I bought a new Pierburg CWA-50 a few years back and it stopped working, ended up ditching it for a Davies Craig EBP40, the Pierburg used PWM signal and the Davies Craig was just a simple 2 wire pump. Looking around on the internet these Pierburg pumps are supposed to be the best option. There's room for improvement with my W2A charge cooler system and I thought it was pump related so decided to buy one.
It was physically bigger but fitting was the same as the old one pretty much. I did have to run all new wiring, this has a 25amp fuse the old one had a 10amp.
With the water/meth turned off I see the IAT's steadily rise as the rev's do (and then I get a IAT based ignition retard). I log the coolant in and out temps on the charge coolers, they seem to put a decent amount of heat into the coolant. My thinking was a higher coolant flow rate would remove more heat out of the charged air. I haven't managed to get any perfect runs to compare logs with my baseline run I made before as I messing about with the PWM settings getting the pump running right but from what I've seen so far it's made no difference at all.
I read a thread where a heating engineer broke down the Audi 4.0T system, flow testing individual components, making changes based on the data (rather than my take a punt approach), the gains were marginal at best. I just think these systems are generally underwhelming. Maybe the Mercedes S600 charge coolers are holding it back but they are well integrated into everything so I'll just leave it as it is.
I bought a Bosch BR540 which is 415lph (it's also re-branded and sold as the DW400).
It's physically bigger than the old pump.
Fitted into the standard basket, I had to cut the bottom out of it to get it in, also needed to cut down the huge strainer that came with the pump as any bigger than the circle in the middle and it wouldn't fit back into the tank. Used an O-ring to hold down the edges where the strainer was cut. happy with it considering I was making it up as I went along. It fits snugly. I also upgraded the wiring size inside the tank which is a smaller gauge than the wires going to the plug on the outside.
I've been out for a drive, the fuel is now too rich a at the top end and my fuel pressure is higher so it was a worthwhile upgrade.
Whilst I was looking for a fuel pump I stumbled upon the Pierburg CWA-150, a new version of their charge cooler pump. I bought a new Pierburg CWA-50 a few years back and it stopped working, ended up ditching it for a Davies Craig EBP40, the Pierburg used PWM signal and the Davies Craig was just a simple 2 wire pump. Looking around on the internet these Pierburg pumps are supposed to be the best option. There's room for improvement with my W2A charge cooler system and I thought it was pump related so decided to buy one.
It was physically bigger but fitting was the same as the old one pretty much. I did have to run all new wiring, this has a 25amp fuse the old one had a 10amp.
With the water/meth turned off I see the IAT's steadily rise as the rev's do (and then I get a IAT based ignition retard). I log the coolant in and out temps on the charge coolers, they seem to put a decent amount of heat into the coolant. My thinking was a higher coolant flow rate would remove more heat out of the charged air. I haven't managed to get any perfect runs to compare logs with my baseline run I made before as I messing about with the PWM settings getting the pump running right but from what I've seen so far it's made no difference at all.
I read a thread where a heating engineer broke down the Audi 4.0T system, flow testing individual components, making changes based on the data (rather than my take a punt approach), the gains were marginal at best. I just think these systems are generally underwhelming. Maybe the Mercedes S600 charge coolers are holding it back but they are well integrated into everything so I'll just leave it as it is.
Is the excess heat on the charge side holding it back? I've never modified a turbo petrol car beyond basic maps so generally the cooling and intercooling systems have been fine - any modified stuff I've done has been diesel and that doesn't heat the same level at all.
Those Pierburg bumps seem to die often, Just replaced the OE one in our Scirocco TDI which had been on the way out, I think the only reason that uses one is that it also cools the DSG with the coolant.
Everything looks like it has its right place, if you went replacing the chargecoolers themselves, are there any better (affordable?) OE alternatives out there or would an aftermarket do a better job (and probably vastly more expensive). If you had unlimited space, I wonder would having a fully separated chargecooler cooling system circuit be advantageous - separate radiator, etc, no engine heating it. That's in an ideal world though, not stuffed into the middle of a Boxster with no room for a fag paper never mind another radiator!
Those Pierburg bumps seem to die often, Just replaced the OE one in our Scirocco TDI which had been on the way out, I think the only reason that uses one is that it also cools the DSG with the coolant.
Everything looks like it has its right place, if you went replacing the chargecoolers themselves, are there any better (affordable?) OE alternatives out there or would an aftermarket do a better job (and probably vastly more expensive). If you had unlimited space, I wonder would having a fully separated chargecooler cooling system circuit be advantageous - separate radiator, etc, no engine heating it. That's in an ideal world though, not stuffed into the middle of a Boxster with no room for a fag paper never mind another radiator!
It's not really holding it back, other than pulling a bit of ignition timing. I have the water/meth injection which is masks any poor results from the charge cooler system. It's more about just trying to make improvements and refine stuff.
I think I'm probably pushing my turbos past their efficency, next time I go to a dyno I'm going to run it at different boost levels and see what difference it makes to power. I could well be introducing a load of extra heat and making no power gains past a certain point.
My charge cooler system is completely independent of the engine cooling system. The radiator for the charge coolers is in the middle at the front.
If I was to change the charge coolers, I quite like the look of the F10 M5 ones or the Mclaren ones. I also had my eye on new turbos. I need to resist the urge to take it apart and make changes. It's fine as it is and everything is nicely integrated. I do enjoy the tinkering as much as the driving.
I think I'm probably pushing my turbos past their efficency, next time I go to a dyno I'm going to run it at different boost levels and see what difference it makes to power. I could well be introducing a load of extra heat and making no power gains past a certain point.
My charge cooler system is completely independent of the engine cooling system. The radiator for the charge coolers is in the middle at the front.
If I was to change the charge coolers, I quite like the look of the F10 M5 ones or the Mclaren ones. I also had my eye on new turbos. I need to resist the urge to take it apart and make changes. It's fine as it is and everything is nicely integrated. I do enjoy the tinkering as much as the driving.
Got any plots of the temps you are seeing?
Could be any one of numerous issues:
Could be any one of numerous issues:
- Too much water flow, doesn't give the fluid time to absorb or reject the charge heat
- Poor cooler efficiency of the cooler rejecting the heat to atmosphere
- Poor cooler efficiency of the charge cooler
- Compressor operating outside of the core of its efficiency map, drive the compressor too hard and the heat it will generate will be exponential.
I'll try and get some logs this evening. The ones I took before were compromised as the pump wasn't operating as I intended. I'd seen enough to know the new pump wasn't a game changer. I log air intake temp, coolant temp in and out of the charge coolers.
On the road the car only sees full throttle for probably less than 10 seconds at a time, I've got enough system capacity that this isn't long enough for me to see significantly raised temperatures on the coolant temp in. I rarely see raised temps for the coolant coming in to the charge coolers. I'm sure under constant throttle on a track (I'm going to Castle Coombe on the 16th April) I'll find it may struggle to bring the temps back down but at the moment the heat exchanger at the front rejecting heat isn't an issue.
My understanding is coolant flow rate is king (if rejecting head at the heat exchanger at the front isn't a problem). the thread I read with the heating engineer trying to re-develop the 4.0T system was all about flow rate, many of them are running 2 of these pumps I've just fitted in series.
Like I mentioned before, I'm probably pushing the turbos too hard and I also think poor efficiency of the charge coolers could be an issue. If my coolant flow has gone up but my temps haven't gone down it points to that. The S600 came out in 1999. I'm not sure how much technology has moved on in terms of core design? It might just be down to physical size. This is what they are like inside.
On the road the car only sees full throttle for probably less than 10 seconds at a time, I've got enough system capacity that this isn't long enough for me to see significantly raised temperatures on the coolant temp in. I rarely see raised temps for the coolant coming in to the charge coolers. I'm sure under constant throttle on a track (I'm going to Castle Coombe on the 16th April) I'll find it may struggle to bring the temps back down but at the moment the heat exchanger at the front rejecting heat isn't an issue.
My understanding is coolant flow rate is king (if rejecting head at the heat exchanger at the front isn't a problem). the thread I read with the heating engineer trying to re-develop the 4.0T system was all about flow rate, many of them are running 2 of these pumps I've just fitted in series.
Like I mentioned before, I'm probably pushing the turbos too hard and I also think poor efficiency of the charge coolers could be an issue. If my coolant flow has gone up but my temps haven't gone down it points to that. The S600 came out in 1999. I'm not sure how much technology has moved on in terms of core design? It might just be down to physical size. This is what they are like inside.
Escy said:
I bought an ODB tool for my dad for Christmas, decided to get a decent one which said it was capable of adjusting the mileage, it was an Xtool A30M. This worked perfectly.
Don't suppose you know if this works on 986 clocks? I've got the old set from mine which can be donated to a friends 986 if there's an easy way to put the right mileage on them!Gassing Station | Readers' Cars | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff