I've bought a Peugeot 207!

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Mark Benson said:

Right car (potentially) - wrong timing! We're about to embark on a big extension/renovation project which means I'll be potless for a while (and I've sold anything that could be considered a tow car).

I've been gravitating towards something more sports prototype for a while after a long time racing Sevens and saloons and this potentially fits the bill (a bit more robust and trackday-friendly as well as being MSA compliant). The wife would kill me though.......

https://moorgatefinance.com/motorsport-finance/ and you're welcome to keep it at Bedford Autodrome........ she'd never find out

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travel is dangerous said:

can you just show up to a trackday with an F1 car?

No, no you can't.......... unless it's Zolder. Zolder you can.... and that is as insane as it sounds.

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eltax91 said:

He can do whatever the fk he likes. He’s PPBB!!

as you know there is plenty of opportunity to let the F1s out to play each year

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eltax91 said:

Yes you are right. It would be incredible to have your own f1 car. I mean unbelievable! How much work to build up the one you are looking at?

A fair bit, it's pretty complete front end wise and it's no problem for us to make things like steering columns, pedal boxes etc. in house. Needs a fuel cell and associated components and has no engine and box but that's not a problem as we would use our Audi Formula back end setup as per the Sauber.

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Vitorio said:

Just wondering PPBB, but doesnt the four-pot turbo sound from the audi lump sound a bit naff for an F1 car? I dont know my V8s, but isnt there some cheap flat plane V8 that is easily turboed up to the required 500-600hp? Would also be a bit more forgiving, as the larger displacement means less boost

And yes, i do realise im making a complete fool out of myself telling you how to build a racecar..

Not really, the Audi actually sounds bloody good at nigh on 9000RPM and 2bar+ boost. It's very reminiscent of the current generation of cars. The issue with picking an engine is that there isn't actually very much out there that will work - the option of a "something or other V8" sounds simple but when you consider you need to hang the entire back of the car off it as a fully stressed member 99% of road car stuff is completely useless as it simply cannot carry those sort of loads, the Sauber for example pulls over 4.5G lateral G.

Also you need it to fit in the original space, changing aero surfaces and heavily bubbling engine covers looks rubbish and completely spoils the aero, which cost million to develop and is the one bit you really want to retain to keep the speed in the car.

Finally for the cars where the original powertrain simply isn't available (the Ferrari/KERS combo in the Sauber for example) the only option you have is swapping to a different powertrain. We could run a Cossy CA or similar but the cost vs performance doesn't stack up - we can get within 30bhp of the CA with the Audi with only 20KG penalty over it. It's a case of we would much rather have a fast and working car than a show car a lot of the time.

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Had the Pug out at Bedford again this weekend - it clearly overheard me considering selling it.....

Looked good out there though!







Big thanks to Sprite Photography for the excellent on track pits.

Unfortunately just before lunch the clutch started slipping with the tell tale smell of gearbox oil, quick engine out:



and gearbox strip:



Revealed that the "Jesus" bolt that holds the input shaft into the primary shaft had come loose allowing the input shaft to move forwards out of the seal and fill the bell housing with oil. Bit of a downer, however whilst stripped I also discovered this:



Dog ring with a chunk missing

I also found this:


The intermediate drive shaft bearing housing had worn allowing the bearing to float in the housing, as this is the only bearing on that side of the diff this had caused the pinion some significant drama. So that'd be a new CWP then and a new dog ring, new second gear ratio, new "Jesus" bolt and secondary shaft nut with a smattering of seals and bearings.

The intermediate bearing housing is a Mygale part but unfortunately there are no more, I could draw it up and machine one from billet or I can take the housing back out to round, sleeve it and press fit a new bearing into it with a retainer plate on the top. I'm thinking the latter due to time and the fact anything with a loose fit bearing is always going to be a wearing part!

While it's apart it will also have a new clutch and I'm looking at what lighter flywheel options there are and if I can run a 184mm twin plate clutch as the standard setup is a mix and match of road car and Alcon bits, the later being on 10 week lead time! The release bearing was also looking nasty but that's only sold as an assembly and Sadev are on 4 - 5 weeks for it. As the carrier and surface plate was in good condition I've pressed it apart and just renewed the bearing, which was 11 quid vs 190 quid and same day

So at least if I do sell it the new owner can be safe in the knowledge that the box and clutch is fresh!

Unfortunately it means I'm going to miss Javelin this coming weekend

Edited by poppopbangbang on Friday 15th June 05:06

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So update. The pug is back in action:



After the small application of lots of new, shiny and quite painfully expensive bits:







Yes that's a new CWP kit from Sadev, plus it's had new dog rings, new 1st and 2nd gears etc. etc. basically a full box rebuild. I've left the diff preload alone after checking it as I am not a driving god and can't make use of a super tight diff like some can, what I excellent at though is spearing backwards into the scenery so best for everyone if I don't go crazy on the preload In addition it's had a new release bearing, intermediate drive shaft bearing, new clutch and new flywheel.

The new flywheel is 4KG lighter than the old one and seems to have made a great improvement to the engines responsiveness. I always thought the throttle blip let it down somewhat but the lower engine rotational mass now has masked that issue somewhat and the paddleshift or rather gear control strategies it is running now feel a lot more modern than they are (a lot of dev on gearbox control has happened since 2007!).

Intermediate driveshaft bearing carrier was also fixed as above. I did speak to Mygale to see if they had any more but unfortunately not so this one was machined out to remove the damaged and a shim made to put the bearing back where it needs to be. Once clamped up it is dimensionally the same as original and should be good for a long time to come, especially considering as the previous one was original to the car!



The broken bits aren't actually that broken bar a dog ring but as it's quite a job to pull the engine and box and the ratios aren't accessible in situ it was silly not to address all the worn/coming up to life bits whilst it was apart.



If nothing else the big gearbox service is now done and it's ready for the next few thousand KMs.

Oh and we made one more addition to the rear of the car :

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Well I've put the Pug on e-bay today. Mixed feelings to be honest as it's an incredible thing and a pleasure to race. It never fails to grab attention where ever it goes but the mission is on now to acquire an F1 as if I don't do it now I may never do it.

I "might" get a cheap single seater to slag around in the mean time..... just to keep my eye in you understand

[poppopbangbang]

James96 said:

Such a cool car, just had a read of the listing, a bit out of my price range haha.
This may sound weird but on the subject of Ebay, did you buy some presto taps recently? I think I recognise your eBay user name.

I've just had a look and as far as I can tell we haven't, however it's the sort of thing we do buy so please send me a message if you think you can help us out!

[poppopbangbang]

Small update. I drove the Pug through the sleepy village I live in for the yearly fete the other weekend. Hilarious I think is the best way to sum it up



Oh and I've found an F1.

All I need to do now is sell the Pug, the plane, a kidney and anything that's not bolted down and we're set!

Edited by poppopbangbang on Wednesday 11th July 00:19

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seiben said:

..........plane?!

PA28 if you fancy it?

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Julian, Great to meet you earlier! I am so pleased the Pug has gone to someone who will use and enjoy it as I have, it's a special thing and one of a very few now. I am very sad to see it go.

I think we got through everything in hand over but my phones always on if you need anything.

[poppopbangbang]

Dzeus should always be taped over, then if the two panels move relative to each other they won't pop. Gorilla tape is the current motorsport spec

Very best option is Tridair Live Locks which are what is generally used in F1 - https://jet-tek.com/tridair-structural-panel-faste... available from Trident at Silverstone or Clarendon FS among others - http://www.tridentracing.co.uk/racing-supplies/tri... , http://www.clarendonsf.com/products/commercial/pan... but make sure you a sitting down when you price them up! There isn't really a better option though. You could do 45 degree or curved surfaces in captive nuts and bolt down with countersunks in an ally bucket (as 45's/curved always pop Dzeus) and the Dzeus on flat to flat..... or the above mentioned race tape

If you do a standard trailer you really want a cover for the car too as cars on exposed trailers do get filthy even on a nice day. PCC do the best ones - https://www.prestige-carcovers.co.uk/index.php?pag...

The engine is common with the Cooper S so there are LOTS of tuning options out there

[poppopbangbang]

Fantastic you've had it out for a run Julian! Great to see it on track

With regards low speed understeer I believe the front bar is on medium at the moment, get them to change this to soft and it should reduce the low speed understeer. You're quite right that before I went up a tyre size it was prone to oversteer with the slightest bit of post apex throttle.

High RPM misfire may well be the same thing I had when I purchased the car, it had stood for about 2 years at that point and there was some light corrosion on the plugs, they don't take kindly to a wire brushing as they are very small electrodes but a fresh set solved it for me. Maybe treat it to a new fuel filter as well if it has stood with fuel in it for a while.

With regards power I believe PugSport now have a copy of Wintax that will talk to the ECU and there is a hybrid turbo option.....

[poppopbangbang]

Julian Thompson said:

Thanks - I was monitoring the fuel pressure on the dash as the misfire happened and I saw no change - I seem to recall fuel pressure of around 150 (!) under load. Sound about right?

Yep that's about right if memory serves. The HPFP was one of the items I replaced when I got hold of the car so that should still be in rude health given the low mileage it has done. The first sign of them failing is when it requires lots and lots (like 30 seconds+) of cranking to start from cold so if it's firing up relatively on the button it is unlikely to be that.

VVT solenoid is a really good shout as they have a habit of not working on a lot of things when left to their own devices for a while, it would also explain why it isn't pulling all the revs! I'd definitely put that on the replace list to be sure.

It's made my day to see the pictures of it back out on circuit, I absolutely love that car and the reaction it gets from others

[poppopbangbang]

Julian Thompson said:

I’d also quite like a rear view camera - does anyone do a credible motorsport one that would replace the mirrors?

Missed this! http://www.dcemotorsport.com/Home/RearCameras

Give DCE a call, ask for Dave and tell him I sent you

[poppopbangbang]

Julian Thompson said:

Okay so Matt at Pug1Off reckons that we could rebuild the motor with forged internals and stick a bigger turbo on it and aim at 320hp. We would still need to find someone who can map the Marelli Motorsport ECU for definite.

Or, the other option I thought about was - what about a K20 or Duratec in supercharged flavours? Would they fit do you think and could we make the Sadev box work?

The chassis was designed to take pretty much anything, it was a Mygale program before it was a Peugeot program I always thought a rorty NA Duratec with 300bhp in the back would be incredible (and lighter!) and even that wouldn't give the chassis anything like a hard time.

As for the gearbox the bell housing is a bolt on and there are plenty of options for Duratec, K20 etc. available that will go straight on the front. You may need an input shaft change if there is a length issue but that's just a bolt in to the ST75. Steve at SWR motorsport will happily sort you out with anything you need.

There are some guys in Germany who apparently have the CFGs and maps for the Spider, if you can get hold of them then I have a copy of Wintax and we can work it out from there. Most of the F1 motors I've calibrated have been on Marelli. If you do want to engine swap it then it's no drama to sort a replacement GCU too to run the gearbox - you have all the Le Mans spec Shiftec stuff on there vs what they originally came with after all and that means we can make it work with pretty much any ECU or engine as required. Alternatively you could engineer another ECU on there and replace the original Marelli stuff but keep the Peugeot motor.