Bertone X19 - The Restore Part Deux

[Tim16V]

In the late 1980's I had a Saturday job selling Fiats.

They had a used X1/9 in stock for, quite literally, months without any interest - it just sat there.

Then out of the blue someone turned up for a test drive - unfortunately on starting the engine the cambelt snapped - so unfortunate.

[devnull]

Loved the X19 as a kid. But now I'm a pretty heavy 6"2' adult, I doubt I could even fit in one!

[Pistom]

I had a V reg one, then C and then D. All great cars, all sold for more than I paid for them, never let me down and lots of fun.

An ex work colleage has an R reg one which he got new for his 21st and last I heard was still in his garage.

Really great cars.

[killerferret666]

So the 1st goal is to get the engine running right. Firstly, last time I identified the automatic choke wasn't working and it appears to be water pump failure. At this point I've had to make a decision do I change the timing belt and tensioner and other bits as well. I've decided not to at this stage. What I'm trying to do is get a well running engine. I can then do a proper full service of belts after. Yes it might not be the most efficient way but I may buy a timing belt tensioner at £40 and find I don't need it. Things will be replaced which need to be, not just for the fun of it. This way I know the cause of a noise rather than replace a load of parts and go 'it was one of them that solved the noise'

Next engine task: Noisy Head

The one thing that struck me was how noisy the head was when it was running, when I got my dad outside last weekend he told me its always been like that. So I let it go...but it ate at me over the last week. My gut said its not right it should be quieter. The Cam cover is only 6 bolts on this and easy to access. So I decided I was going to investigate.

I purchased some feeler gauges because I felt the cam to tappets / Shims were out of tolerance based on the noise, it reminded me of my old xr2i. So I removed the cam cover...and half the gasket - New cam cover gasket needed. I found online the tolerances



So What you do is rotate the engine till the lobe of the cam is pointing up (180Degrees) from the tappet / shim of the valve you are measuring. You then take the feeler gauges and stick them between. Its like Goldilocks, too big and it wont go in, too little and it will be loose. But then its just right! Ok that doesn't sound like Goldilocks anymore!

So first the intakes (Tolerance range of 0.011 - 0.014 in)
Valve 2 - .016 *Outside Tolerance*
Valve 3 - .016 *Outside Tolerance*
Valve 6 - .021 *Outside Tolerance*
Valve 7 - .017 *Outside Tolerance*

Exhaust side (Tolerance Range of 0.015 - 0.018 in)
Valve 1 - .020 *Outside Tolerance*
Valve 4 - .024 *Outside Tolerance*
Valve 5 - .024 *Outside Tolerance*
Valve 8 - .024 *Outside Tolerance*

The Haynes manual has the tolerances as 0.18 for inlet and 0.24 for exhaust. And this shows why internet car clubs with workshop manuals uploaded are important, I will go to the workshop manuals as even if working to the Haynes manual we are right at the top of the range.

So whats next. I cant just go buy a load of shims as the engine already has some in. So I need to remove them and find out their thickness 1 of two ways.

1) Its still printed on the underside (please god, all 8 be printed)
2) digital micrometer or caliper

To remove them on this engine unfortunately I need a special fiat tool to hold the buckets down from the cam and ping off the shim, I cant just remove the cam unfortunately on this engine, its within a housing. Then its a simple calculation to do;


Actual Measurement (.024) - (minus) ideal gap size in tolerance (.016 for exhaust) = 0.008
then it is
Shim size + 0.008 = new shim size required for that valve.

I need to do this for each one!! Now the trick is not to do one at a time here. All of mine are outside tolerance, I suspect I may be able to use some shims from the exhaust side on the inlet side if I'm lucky but I expect to have to buy at least 4 new shims for the exhaust side.... but you never know.

By getting these shims the right size the tractor noise will go and power / response will also be slightly better. (this was an 85bhp engine, I need every 0.1 BHP back)


This could be a big battle though...find where to buy the tool from to do the job!
If anyone has the shim tool and would be so kind to loan it, I will happily give beer tokens

Photo below shows Valve number 8 and the Cam in position to place the feeler gauges inbetween to determine the gap size.

Edited by killerferret666 on Saturday 24th February 21:36

[TwoStrokeNut]

Lovely car, great to see it getting some love.

There's a tool here:

https://xwebforums.com/forum/index.php?threads/val...

http://www.vickauto.com/newstore/index.php?main_pa...

Cheers.

[Jellyfish]

A tidy red V reg came past me this morning when I was walking my dogs. It was droning a bit so maybe his clearances need doing as well.

Bookmarked, good luck continuing to sort her out.

[killerferret666]

TwoStrokeNut said:

Lovely car, great to see it getting some love.

There's a tool here:

https://xwebforums.com/forum/index.php?threads/val...

http://www.vickauto.com/newstore/index.php?main_pa...

Cheers.

thanks,
Emailed as they do ship internationally. In a complete surprise and shock ebay hasnt come up trumps!

[Krikkit]

Please, please don't take this the wrong way (it's said with love not hate)...

If the car's been standing outside for a few years, then inside for quite a few more, surely the engine will a) need a full belt and tensioner renewal, b) be completely filthy/corroded and need a good lick of paint etc, c) all the ancillaries and pipework will be the same way.

Thinking that, I'd have the engine, box and rear axle off ASAP so that you can clean it up and service it without scrabbling around in the back of the car.

[killerferret666]

Krikkit said:

Please, please don't take this the wrong way (it's said with love not hate)...

If the car's been standing outside for a few years, then inside for quite a few more, surely the engine will a) need a full belt and tensioner renewal, b) be completely filthy/corroded and need a good lick of paint etc, c) all the ancillaries and pipework will be the same way.

Thinking that, I'd have the engine, box and rear axle off ASAP so that you can clean it up and service it without scrabbling around in the back of the car.

I Never take anything the wrong way if presented well, these forums are useful for bits people miss when doing a build. So quick summary but do let me know if I've missed anything as I don't want to. As most importantly it has to be safe, its carrying my dad.

1) Once engine is running and good health, belts will be done. What I'm doing is not economical time wise but the car isn't at mine, its at my dads currently. So I'm dealing with the bad engine noise, as its a from top of car job & quick to pop over and action with little chance of things going majorly wrong. Agree some pipes may of gone or at least rubber hoses may of perished.

b) The engine is barely corroded at all which has really surprised me, mostly just oxidisation on some bits (can see it in the carb pic). Every bolt has come off better than my 7yr old car. The engine has all undertrays on and as mentioned dad had the whole underside waxoyl'd & the huge filter housing on top has protected it too. The car also never saw a wet (or salt) road after its last restore & only did 1500miles. No doubt this made a difference. So I was expecting a massive engine appearance problem, ill be giving it a pressure steam clean first and seeing what I'm left with and go from there I think.

c) The suspension arms are covered in waxoyl etc... and was all new bushes on the last refurb, so I will check them all over properly when the car is at mine and I'm doing the brakes, however it all looks really good under there other than the rusty worm clamps on pipes. When I say looks good, its a mess because of the waxoyl but not rusty, also perished rubber wont show till its used a bit as well.

I'm also very luck to not have to worry about scratching the paint work when working on it as I'm also spraying it. I will drop the engine if I need to as its not the hardest job in the world, but the cars at my dad's currently so work is based on tools at that location till its at mine. You've made some good points, I'll make sure to get more pics of the underside and bits when its at mine in case anyone spots things I miss.

[toon10]

Watching this with interest. My old school mate had one as his first car back in the day. It was the 1.5 in red. I absolutely loved the styling and as an impressionable 16 year, the experiences we had hooning around stay with me to this day. I don't think it was that fast but back then, it felt so exotic compared to the usual car choices. He ended up swapping it for a 1.6 Capri complete with house Hi-Fi speakers in the boot. I never warmed to that like I did the little Fiat.

I'm at that mid life crisis age where I look back to the good old days. I often yearn for an old school hot hatch but every time I see a picture of an X19, I convince myself I need to get one. It'll never happen, Mrs Toon likes holidays and I'd struggle to keep a skateboard on the road with my spanner skills but I can live out my fantasies via people like you who can bring such cars back to life.

[MX6]

A very nice classic to restore, there can't be too many of these left on these shores, interested in seeing the progress. Fingers crossed there aren't too many hidden issues that escalate the work.

[Mark Benson]

My first sports car was an X1/9 VS back in 1989, I loved it but it was as rotten as a pear.
The A pillar was slowly disintegrating up the windscreen.
It also had the automatic choke problem which I cured by buying a manual choke conversion kit.

Used to get it fettled by a chap in Walworth, S. London which, as I lived in Queens Park was quite a drive (ropey mid-engined Fiat in slow London traffic.....) but what he didn't know about Fiats and Lancias wasn't worth knowing. I forget his name but his yard was always full of classic Italian stuff and you never knew how long he was going to take to get round to your job.

Mine was eventually written off by a drunk driver in Kilburn who drove into me head-on at a junction. Probably for the best as the rust was getting pretty terminal. I bought the wreck off the insurance company and used it as credit against work at the aforementioned specialist on it's replacement, the world's most neglected Integrale.

[poo at Paul's]

I had one in about 1992!! Loved the reverse sweep on the rev counter!!

Edited by poo at Paul's on Tuesday 27th February 01:57

[irocfan]

Bright Halo said:

Great little cars, such a shame that Fiat did not develop and update them further.
I have had 3 in the past and thoroughly enjoyed them all. One had a twin 40 carb installed, probably not a lot quicker but sounded great.
There used to be people who had done 2litre twincam and uno turbo conversions I would have liked to drive one of those, the extra shove would have suited it well.
There was a very active X1/9 owners club and forum, not sure how alive it is now though?

The auto chokes are notoriously unreliable and it is one of those things you seem to end up constantly adjusting. There used to be manual choke conversion kits available which I remember successfully installing on one of mine. Much better after that.

Good luck

I can assure you that the Uno turbo conversion works VERY well (gave great mpgs too!)

[killerferret666]

Well this update is long overdue, with our Winter that didnt seem to end with Snow and Rain, the moving of the car over to mine kept on getting delayed, but finally its here.



First thing was, even though I had brought a new battery, Dad hadn' t trickled charged it or anything. This sums up this restore, get it usable and in nice condition but no point going the full hog of immaculate because it wont be kept that way. Ill save that for the day it gets handed over to me.

Ive mentioned previously of how good the car is rust wise and Finally I could jack it up and take a proper look and I wasnt disappointed. This is the underside of the car.


All the Waxoyl he had applied really doing its job. Some oxidisation on the coolant pipes and clips. the pipes will be cleaned up and the rubber hoses and pipes replaced eventually but an excellant chassis to start with.


Todays task was to change the water pump... which I will get to in a moment, this did mean removing one of the wheels, so wheel arch check time. the brake dust / stone guards I suspect I will just remove, i think they are too far gone, the discs are fine. they just need a wire brush down. The calipers will be refurbished.



Again looks good, so I gave it a clean with some industrial strength cleaner and a pressure wash.



Not an ounce of rust or anything, everything covered in waxoyl, its done its job perfectly. The lower arms are covered in Waxoyl to, infact everything is. so it all looks fine. The biggest thing will be perished rubber.

Now todays job was the water pump, the first big job and it was not easy. Firstly the alternator is the tensioner and of course would not pivet at all, driving me nuts, in the end as im going to replace the belt, I cut it at this stage. Then there is the job of getting the water pump out the housing, it fowls on the sidewall if you try and just remove it.

The simplest solution was to undo an engine mount and jack the engine up to give enough room to remove it and slide the new one in. The internet gave me loads of harder answers like, remove alternator and housing as well but the above was the simplest. I think its safe to safe the water pump had seen better days



The coolant system will require quite a few drains of the system to clear it I suspect, I wouldn't be surprised if I have to replace the radiator.

I'm going to have to stat keeping a list of the jobs to get the car roadworthy. Tomorrow I'm going to grease up the electric window runners and wiper mechanism as they are both slow to move and they should easy jobs to get done whilst I wait on some parts.

• caliper refurb kits
• Aux Belt

I still cant actually find the Shim tool to purchase, the american company would not send me the tool on its own due to shipping costs, so I'm stuck but the shims must be done. However both cars were looking good today in the sun, giving a good contrast of New and Old

Edited by killerferret666 on Saturday 14th April 23:22

[AW111]

If you end up having to measure the shims, make sure they're clean (obviously) and oil free.
A film of engine oil on the shim can be enough to give a slightly oversize reading. When I last did shims on my car I washed them all in thinners before measuring them, then re-oiled them so they wouldn't rust.


Keep up the good work.

[killerferret666]

AW111 said:

If you end up having to measure the shims, make sure they're clean (obviously) and oil free.
A film of engine oil on the shim can be enough to give a slightly oversize reading. When I last did shims on my car I washed them all in thinners before measuring them, then re-oiled them so they wouldn't rust.


Keep up the good work.

Thanks for the tip, I've actually never done any shim work before so just learning as I go.

[bstark]

One of these might be what you are looking for. Postage shouldn't be a problem from Italy:

www.sgricambi.com/prodotto/attrezzo-sostituzione-p...

www.betafer.it/it/100497-attrezzi-per-sostituzione...

I have fond memories of a friend's gold X1/9 at uni. It felt really special to drive, even if the gearchange didn't like to be rushed. Like an MG Midget it felt really quick as long as there was no one else going quickly to compare it to. About the only area I would compare it to an MG though

The reverse sweep rev counter was strangely appealing, as were the comedy electrics. The headlights had a mind of their own and you had to try a few times to get both to stay popped up at the same time! Great fun but rusty - yours looks in great nick

[irocfan]

had good memories of the X1/9 (especially driving my mate's one so hard that he thought I'd set his brakes on fire - to be fair his wheel-wells did look like they were trying to impersonate factory chimneys) had a few myself. Very under-rated

Edited by irocfan on Sunday 15th April 21:52

[killerferret666]

bstark said:

One of these might be what you are looking for. Postage shouldn't be a problem from Italy:

www.sgricambi.com/prodotto/attrezzo-sostituzione-p...

www.betafer.it/it/100497-attrezzi-per-sostituzione...

Thank you very much I'll check the links out