2001 Jaguar XJ8 Project
Discussion
stickleback123 said:
These are such great looking cars, the 4 litre V8 and 5 speed automatic gave them the performance they needed over the rather dated AJ16 so you don't feel at all short changed for performance when you get out of a modern car.
Have you taken a look at the secondary timing chain tensioners, or got anything in the history to suggest they've been changed? Your car is late enough that it won't have the original ones that fall to pieces but I've read that some of the revised versions were problematic too.
Previously I had another 4.0 XJ8 and a friend had a XJR x300 and they felt about the same in a straight line (though not round corners). I preferred mine really! Although post of that was helping him change the throttle body on his car, which remains one of the worst jobs I've ever done on a car!Have you taken a look at the secondary timing chain tensioners, or got anything in the history to suggest they've been changed? Your car is late enough that it won't have the original ones that fall to pieces but I've read that some of the revised versions were problematic too.
In terms of the tensioners, mine should have the later ones fitted as it is a late model. I believe a further revision was done which were better again. It may be something for the future, but so far there is no rattle at start up etc so I don't think it's an issue as yet.
stickleback123 said:
These are such great looking cars, the 4 litre V8 and 5 speed automatic gave them the performance they needed over the rather dated AJ16 so you don't feel at all short changed for performance when you get out of a modern car.
Have you taken a look at the secondary timing chain tensioners, or got anything in the history to suggest they've been changed? Your car is late enough that it won't have the original ones that fall to pieces but I've read that some of the revised versions were problematic too.
Have you taken a look at the secondary timing chain tensioners, or got anything in the history to suggest they've been changed? Your car is late enough that it won't have the original ones that fall to pieces but I've read that some of the revised versions were problematic too.
This. There have been three versions of the secondary chain tensioners on the AJV8.The original red plastic bodied ones were actuated by engine oil pressure. Tensioner bodies cracked allowing oil to leak around the piston leading to the classic death rattle because the secondary chain was no longer being properly tensioned or if the the slipper came off the chain would jam and snap. Jaguar replaced the original design when the engine was revised from AJ26 to AJ27 spec in 1998 from engine no 98102106XX to a brown plastic bodied version with tension provided by an integral spring rather than oil pressure. Slippers on these were more securely attached but bodies eventually cracked too and because chain tension was still being maintained failure was usually silent .
The third and final version was similar in design to the second but had a aluminum, not plastic body. There were introduced on the 4.2 V8 in 2003 and are a retro fit on the earlier 3.2 and 4.0. Some original red tensioners were changed under TSB or warranty to the revised plastic design if the customer complained of chain rattle but to be safe you need top either whip the offside cam cover off - the nearside is a PITA to remove - and have a look to see which design you have fitted or have a receipt with tensioner part numbers C2A1511 and C2A1512 on it which are the aluminium bodied type. You must use slightly longer bolts to fit the new aluminium ones.
Secondary tensioners are easy enough to change. No need for any factory tools and you can ignore the official very long winded procedure - my get round is simply remove the exhaust camshaft which gives you just enough room to wriggle the old tensioner out and fit the new one. No need for timing tools either, just preserve the valve timing by tie wrapping the exhaust cam chain to both sprockets.
ETA: Highlighted for LF.
Edited by Jaguar steve on Wednesday 3rd June 12:13
Edited by Jaguar steve on Wednesday 3rd June 12:27
Here you are.
I took these out of my 2001 XJ8 about 10 years ago and at something like 35k miles from new.
See the tiny crack just starting by the AF lettering on one of the bodies? That's the mechanism of failure, the crack will eventually open up far enough to allow the piston and sleeve inside the body to twist far enough for the chain to catch on the end of the slipper either breaking the chain or allowing the exhaust timing to jump and retard leading to valve/piston contact.
This can happen with the 2 gen tensioners like these without any prior warning rattle.
I took these out of my 2001 XJ8 about 10 years ago and at something like 35k miles from new.
See the tiny crack just starting by the AF lettering on one of the bodies? That's the mechanism of failure, the crack will eventually open up far enough to allow the piston and sleeve inside the body to twist far enough for the chain to catch on the end of the slipper either breaking the chain or allowing the exhaust timing to jump and retard leading to valve/piston contact.
This can happen with the 2 gen tensioners like these without any prior warning rattle.
Jaguar steve said:
Here you are.
I took these out of my 2001 XJ8 about 10 years ago and at something like 35k miles from new.
See the tiny crack just starting by the AF lettering on one of the bodies? That's the mechanism of failure, the crack will eventually open up far enough to allow the piston and sleeve inside the body to twist far enough for the chain to catch on the end of the slipper either breaking the chain or allowing the exhaust timing to jump and retard leading to valve/piston contact.
This can happen with the 2 gen tensioners like these without any prior warning rattle.
Thanks for all that good information. Looks like another job to add to the list!I took these out of my 2001 XJ8 about 10 years ago and at something like 35k miles from new.
See the tiny crack just starting by the AF lettering on one of the bodies? That's the mechanism of failure, the crack will eventually open up far enough to allow the piston and sleeve inside the body to twist far enough for the chain to catch on the end of the slipper either breaking the chain or allowing the exhaust timing to jump and retard leading to valve/piston contact.
This can happen with the 2 gen tensioners like these without any prior warning rattle.
This is such a nice car, I want to keep it as good as possible; the downside of that being trying to sell it for a reasonable price when you can still pick them up for shed money (albeit proper grotty horrors!)... Ah well, have to keep it then!
Lewis's Friend said:
Jaguar steve said:
Here you are.
I took these out of my 2001 XJ8 about 10 years ago and at something like 35k miles from new.
See the tiny crack just starting by the AF lettering on one of the bodies? That's the mechanism of failure, the crack will eventually open up far enough to allow the piston and sleeve inside the body to twist far enough for the chain to catch on the end of the slipper either breaking the chain or allowing the exhaust timing to jump and retard leading to valve/piston contact.
This can happen with the 2 gen tensioners like these without any prior warning rattle.
Thanks for all that good information. Looks like another job to add to the list!I took these out of my 2001 XJ8 about 10 years ago and at something like 35k miles from new.
See the tiny crack just starting by the AF lettering on one of the bodies? That's the mechanism of failure, the crack will eventually open up far enough to allow the piston and sleeve inside the body to twist far enough for the chain to catch on the end of the slipper either breaking the chain or allowing the exhaust timing to jump and retard leading to valve/piston contact.
This can happen with the 2 gen tensioners like these without any prior warning rattle.
This is such a nice car, I want to keep it as good as possible; the downside of that being trying to sell it for a reasonable price when you can still pick them up for shed money (albeit proper grotty horrors!)... Ah well, have to keep it then!
Lovely welding work! Suspect mine is hiding similar sill tin worm. Can empathise with the subsiding drivers side switches and sticky buttons - most annoying. Bought off PistonHeads 8 years ago and meant to sell after using as our wedding car but 4 years later still haven’t got round to it. Lovely motor, although do wish I’d gone for a 4.0 rather than 3.2 ‘sport’
My good mate who runs restoration business that specialises in jags has been buying up all the descent conditioned bargains he can find , including a JLR directors car that was a mobile test bed for all sorts of upgrades. He owns about 8 of them . They along with all the classic XJ's are certainly going up in value . The days of grabbing a half descent one for a couple of hundred seems to be long gone . Just a shame that I have problems with getting in and out of them these days as I would love one as my daily . They really are a nice place to be in .
The XJ40 reset Jaguar in terms of manufacturing, complexity and modernity. It was significantly simpler to build that the previous XJ6. The bonnet of which alone, contained 90 parts that had to be fitted like Meccano into a jig by hand and then welded by hand.
This gen was definitely a jump forward from the XJ40 and the most successful of the Fawd, let’s go retro Jags. The S and X Type, not so much.
By the time they stopped making it, it had had substantial upgrades and was a decent car.
One minor continuing issue, getting the paint to adhere to the convex shapes on the bonnet skin over the lights. On some lighter colours. It was possible to see the primer.
Hope you enjoy it. Loved the post.
This gen was definitely a jump forward from the XJ40 and the most successful of the Fawd, let’s go retro Jags. The S and X Type, not so much.
By the time they stopped making it, it had had substantial upgrades and was a decent car.
One minor continuing issue, getting the paint to adhere to the convex shapes on the bonnet skin over the lights. On some lighter colours. It was possible to see the primer.
Hope you enjoy it. Loved the post.
They really are lovely cars and wear their age very well. I ran an XJ6 out to 180k miles and it still looked good - sound bodywork and the leather interior almost mint. I swapped it because I got lucky 7 years ago and was offered an XJ8 with 28k miles on the clock for a price that would have been rude to refuse. Chris Forbes (at Corley) did the essential updates of chain tensioners, water pump and transmission oil change. Mugglestones fitted a proper multipoint LPG system as I was using it as a daily commute car. It's still going strong and looks great and apart from routine services it's only needed a few suspension bushes and one ball joint. I recently swapped rear springs and dampers - just because they looked a bit tired and parts are fairly cheap.
Look after the essentials and they can go on and on and are actually fairly economical to run - probably the last of the home mechanic jags.
Enjoy yours.
Look after the essentials and they can go on and on and are actually fairly economical to run - probably the last of the home mechanic jags.
Enjoy yours.
Cheers for all the nice comments. It is a lovely car, and particularly great for long distance.
I would love to think these are about to skyrocket in value, but I'm not relying on that. I would say good ones are gradually increasing in value (pre-pandemic anyway; who knows what happens now?).
Rust treatment aside, much of the work I'm about to do isn't really needed. The car drives and works fine, but this should get it to the next level and also satisfies my need to tinker with something!
I would love to think these are about to skyrocket in value, but I'm not relying on that. I would say good ones are gradually increasing in value (pre-pandemic anyway; who knows what happens now?).
Rust treatment aside, much of the work I'm about to do isn't really needed. The car drives and works fine, but this should get it to the next level and also satisfies my need to tinker with something!
I tend to use mine mostly for long distances too.
Asking prices do appear to be firming a little for what present on paper as good examples, I only paid £3k for mine with thirty one thousand on the clock about ten years ago and I expect I could sell it for a smudge more than that now at double the miles and age.
Thing is 'tho absolutely nothing else in the Jaguar range appeals so I have no idea what I'd replace it with.
Asking prices do appear to be firming a little for what present on paper as good examples, I only paid £3k for mine with thirty one thousand on the clock about ten years ago and I expect I could sell it for a smudge more than that now at double the miles and age.
Thing is 'tho absolutely nothing else in the Jaguar range appeals so I have no idea what I'd replace it with.
Jaguar steve said:
Thing is 'tho absolutely nothing else in the Jaguar range appeals so I have no idea what I'd replace it with.
I've owned a fair few jags now, but I'm not really a jag fanboy (though I do like them of course). However, when I look at buying another car nothing else seems to offer the value and experience combined. As I said previously, I looked at e38 7 series and I very much like them, particularly later ones, but for the same money I was looking at shabby rotters with rust on every panel!
So everytime I look to move away from a jag, it never works!
Jaguar steve said:
I tend to use mine mostly for long distances too.
Asking prices do appear to be firming a little for what present on paper as good examples, I only paid £3k for mine with thirty one thousand on the clock about ten years ago and I expect I could sell it for a smudge more than that now at double the miles and age.
Thing is 'tho absolutely nothing else in the Jaguar range appeals so I have no idea what I'd replace it with.
Beautiful car in a great colour. I agree that values for 4 litre and SC cars in good condition are (were) firming up nicely as they did a few years ago for the X300. I don't think a poor spec 3.2 is ever going to be worth a great deal though, but it's normal for the top models to make up most of the survivors.Asking prices do appear to be firming a little for what present on paper as good examples, I only paid £3k for mine with thirty one thousand on the clock about ten years ago and I expect I could sell it for a smudge more than that now at double the miles and age.
Thing is 'tho absolutely nothing else in the Jaguar range appeals so I have no idea what I'd replace it with.
There isn't anything to replace it really, is there. For most of it's life the only cars even sort of present in the XJs niche (but far more costly) were things like the Maseratri Quattroporte, and for decades there were enough people for whom the shortcomings and foibles of the XJ were worth overlooking for the looks (inside and out), unique ride/handling balance, and other unique attributes to support the model.
With the the X350 and X351 they moved much more decisively into the 7 series/S-Class/A8 field, stopped making them beautiful, and totally lost their niche. Turns out the market for a "British S-Class that isn't as good as an S-Class" wasn't that big.
I'd say the 1st gen CLS was in a similar space, but it's ugly as sin, and I suppose the likes of the BMW 6 series GC?
Great thread to read and cars which are close to my heart.. Had most iterations of the X308, from the base spec 3.2 to the fully loaded XJRs.
And bar the V12, had most of the X300s as well.
Whilst I prefer certain styling queues on the X300 - the dashboard and dials, the wood panels in a more square shape, square-edged front indicators with double bulbs, and the rear light units having double bulbs for the side lights (sad, I know), the X308 is definitely the more refined and smoother car to drive.
Wonderful wafting machines. And the 4.0 AJV8 can lift its skirt when asked. Even the 240 BHP 3.2 is adequate.
I do believe the the XJ Jags have some of the nicest alloy wheel designs (BBS Milans, XJR Pentas, XJR Asteroids, even the 16" base spec wheels look good). In addition, they are graced with some of the nicest colours - Romantic Purple, Madeira Red, Masons Black, Seafrost Silver, etc.
Good examples are getting thin on the ground these days, and people are beginning to appreciate how good a car they really are. There is big demand for these over in France and Germany, and my last few XJs have ended up over on the continent.
They are an iconic design - when you think of a Jag XJ, the X308 (and earlier XJs) is the shape you think of. Just as with a 911, there is the typical silhouette which comes to mind.
Enjoy the car - for the little outlay, they do give a great deal of satisfaction.
And bar the V12, had most of the X300s as well.
Whilst I prefer certain styling queues on the X300 - the dashboard and dials, the wood panels in a more square shape, square-edged front indicators with double bulbs, and the rear light units having double bulbs for the side lights (sad, I know), the X308 is definitely the more refined and smoother car to drive.
Wonderful wafting machines. And the 4.0 AJV8 can lift its skirt when asked. Even the 240 BHP 3.2 is adequate.
I do believe the the XJ Jags have some of the nicest alloy wheel designs (BBS Milans, XJR Pentas, XJR Asteroids, even the 16" base spec wheels look good). In addition, they are graced with some of the nicest colours - Romantic Purple, Madeira Red, Masons Black, Seafrost Silver, etc.
Good examples are getting thin on the ground these days, and people are beginning to appreciate how good a car they really are. There is big demand for these over in France and Germany, and my last few XJs have ended up over on the continent.
They are an iconic design - when you think of a Jag XJ, the X308 (and earlier XJs) is the shape you think of. Just as with a 911, there is the typical silhouette which comes to mind.
Enjoy the car - for the little outlay, they do give a great deal of satisfaction.
stickleback123 said:
I'd say the 1st gen CLS was in a similar space, but it's ugly as sin, and I suppose the likes of the BMW 6 series GC?
I'd disagree about the CLS mk1's beauty - to me it's the only CLS which deserved the title "4 door coupe", the next ones looking more like a regular saloon that been left in the bath too long. But you're absolutely right about the CLS/GC taking the same space - when the CLS was first developed the internal name for the project was "jag-fighter", allegedly.It's an interesting one - what more modern cars have that kind of ride quality? Having not driven many, I couldn't really say but by all accounts a lot of more modern cars are quite stiffly sprung and with the larger alloys.
Are there any moderately priced cars that put comfort over sportiness? As for my daily I like comfort! The Mx5 is for rattling my teeth.
Are there any moderately priced cars that put comfort over sportiness? As for my daily I like comfort! The Mx5 is for rattling my teeth.
Lewis's Friend said:
It's an interesting one - what more modern cars have that kind of ride quality? Having not driven many, I couldn't really say but by all accounts a lot of more modern cars are quite stiffly sprung and with the larger alloys.
Are there any moderately priced cars that put comfort over sportiness? As for my daily I like comfort! The Mx5 is for rattling my teeth.
There's very little difference in comfort and ride quality between my daily Skoda Roomster and my XJ8 however I prefer the cloth seats in the Skoda over the slippery leather ones in the XJ as they're more secure and supportive and the Skoda also copes a little better with badly rutted and potholed road surfaces than the XJ does.Are there any moderately priced cars that put comfort over sportiness? As for my daily I like comfort! The Mx5 is for rattling my teeth.
French cars always do comfort particularly well and if you've ever driven anything stiffly sprung on rural French D roads you'll know why that is so.
I've had several Citroen and Renault cars and vans as daily drivers and would say they've all either matched or bettered the ride quality and comfort of all the Jaguars I've owned at the same time but my vote for the best car I've ever experienced has to go to the Peugeot 508 our village taxi lady drives.
Her Space Shuttle mileage Pug rides beautifully and is superbly comfortable and absolutely beats the pants off any Jaguar I've ever been in or driven.
Gassing Station | Readers' Cars | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff