Butchering a Bertone
Discussion
Greg_D said:
The market has spoken and the value seems set at somewhere between £50-70k. Surely someone would re-raise their hand at something similar???
Having looked on cc it appears that their fees are no -refundable and essentially constitute an introduction fee. There is nothing to suggest that there is any obligation either way to complete on the deal....
that’s surprisingly vague IMO.
You need to throw the ball back into cc’s court and get them to trace the buyer as it appears you can just sell it to someone else and matey boy would just lose his cc fee...
That’s how I read it!!!
Thanks for your feedback Greg, the market at auction suggests a value 60+fees average today which is a little disappointing and not really what I would have assumed but that is out of my hands and at least I have some guidance.Having looked on cc it appears that their fees are no -refundable and essentially constitute an introduction fee. There is nothing to suggest that there is any obligation either way to complete on the deal....
that’s surprisingly vague IMO.
You need to throw the ball back into cc’s court and get them to trace the buyer as it appears you can just sell it to someone else and matey boy would just lose his cc fee...
That’s how I read it!!!
It just seems a little strange that the winning bidders pays the commission then appears to have no intention to buy the car. Why would someone just throw away just over £3k?
I've checked the T&C's and there are grounds to ensure payment, in that any bid is irrevocable and legally binding etc but having spoke with the auction company their response was "It's pretty unheard of for a buyer to behave in this way."
I guess the best way forward may be as you suggest...
CarreraLightweightRacing said:
Thanks for your feedback Greg, the market at auction suggests a value 60+fees average today which is a little disappointing and not really what I would have assumed but that is out of my hands and at least I have some guidance.
It just seems a little strange that the winning bidders pays the commission then appears to have no intention to buy the car. Why would someone just throw away just over £3k?
I've checked the T&C's and there are grounds to ensure payment, in that any bid is irrevocable and legally binding etc but having spoke with the auction company their response was "It's pretty unheard of for a buyer to behave in this way."
I guess the best way forward may be as you suggest...
They must have some contact details like an email for the buyer? Get them to send an email saying that if no contact is made within 10 days then the car is no longer being sold to them and will be resold. It just seems a little strange that the winning bidders pays the commission then appears to have no intention to buy the car. Why would someone just throw away just over £3k?
I've checked the T&C's and there are grounds to ensure payment, in that any bid is irrevocable and legally binding etc but having spoke with the auction company their response was "It's pretty unheard of for a buyer to behave in this way."
I guess the best way forward may be as you suggest...
honda_exige said:
They must have some contact details like an email for the buyer? Get them to send an email saying that if no contact is made within 10 days then the car is no longer being sold to them and will be resold.
I've gone through all that, the winning bidder has 7 days to pay. It would appear they have had a change of mind, what has caused that I have no idea but I did notice the same guy bidding on multiple other cars at the same time, so he may have been hedging his bets and bought another car. I've tried contacting the buyer via email, phone... no answer. So it looks like time to consider other options now.My question was whether anyone has any experience where someone wins an auction pays the commission then simply walks away without so much as a word to the seller. I just can't fathom the logic behind that decision making unless the thrill of the chase and winning an auction is the main motivator.
RC1807 said:
If I had the funds, I'd snap it up, too.... However, I know how s
t the "homologation" people are in Luxembourg - it'd have to have TüV first so they've covered their arses! WTF. 
Anyway, best of luck with the sale and your treatment, OP.
It is TüV approved RC1807, HU/AU next due 02/2023. I have literally just completed this last week after spending around €15,000,- total to get it through this process and 18months work. It can be registered in Luxembourg no problem also only 1 hours drive from me t the "homologation" people are in Luxembourg - it'd have to have TüV first so they've covered their arses! WTF. Anyway, best of luck with the sale and your treatment, OP.
I was watching the auction to see what it would do, i was intrigued to see as the majority of people always say modifying a classic in such a way harms the value, this is another one for the ammo bag in the argument against that and im glad people see the value in it. I also had a hankering for a 996 like i've never had before, that's right up my street too!
I remember the Alfa went unsold at £70k first auction and then you stuck it up for sale at £78k, i was sure someone would have snapped it up at that if they were willing to bid up to and around £70k+ fees! Strange none of those bidding didnt snap it up. Like you say, maybe its the thrill off the bidding.
I'm not clued up on the TUV process but it seems crazy you've been able to get such a car through it, hats off to you! Health-wise, i hope you're managing as well as you can do so far.
I remember the Alfa went unsold at £70k first auction and then you stuck it up for sale at £78k, i was sure someone would have snapped it up at that if they were willing to bid up to and around £70k+ fees! Strange none of those bidding didnt snap it up. Like you say, maybe its the thrill off the bidding.
I'm not clued up on the TUV process but it seems crazy you've been able to get such a car through it, hats off to you! Health-wise, i hope you're managing as well as you can do so far.
scottos said:
I was watching the auction to see what it would do, i was intrigued to see as the majority of people always say modifying a classic in such a way harms the value, this is another one for the ammo bag in the argument against that and im glad people see the value in it. I also had a hankering for a 996 like i've never had before, that's right up my street too!
I remember the Alfa went unsold at £70k first auction and then you stuck it up for sale at £78k, i was sure someone would have snapped it up at that if they were willing to bid up to and around £70k+ fees! Strange none of those bidding didnt snap it up. Like you say, maybe its the thrill off the bidding.
I'm not clued up on the TUV process but it seems crazy you've been able to get such a car through it, hats off to you! Health-wise, i hope you're managing as well as you can do so far.
Thanks Scott, I don't see this as a modified car as such as it has been completely redesigned/re-engineered in every sense, not the typical bolt-on approach normally associated with modifying.I remember the Alfa went unsold at £70k first auction and then you stuck it up for sale at £78k, i was sure someone would have snapped it up at that if they were willing to bid up to and around £70k+ fees! Strange none of those bidding didnt snap it up. Like you say, maybe its the thrill off the bidding.
I'm not clued up on the TUV process but it seems crazy you've been able to get such a car through it, hats off to you! Health-wise, i hope you're managing as well as you can do so far.
Regarding the auctions; with the first auction it was much more straight forward, it basically didn't meet the reserve which I set, also the bidders contacted me asking for time as they had a house sale in progress, another selling a business... As I don't have the luxury of time, I had to consider other options. The auction company came back to me asking to run it again, so I did and dropped the reserve and this time it sold. If I had won, I'd have been over the moon, phoning up with an opened bottle of champagne in one hand, asking about collection etc within 5 minutes of the auction ending. I've still not heard a single word from the winning bidder. All very strange if you ask me.
Anyway I have to move on and find another solution now and rather quickly.
Perhaps a commission sale through a well known vendor with contacts, such as Tom Hartley Jr etc or the company that supplies Harry Metcalfe with the cars for his vids, or a European agent?
Surely, its sale is contingent on the likelihood of people being able to enjoy track days, rather than paying now and their asset sitting idle for an uncertain period of time.
It's a tricky one, for sure, as it's such a specialised tool.
Surely, its sale is contingent on the likelihood of people being able to enjoy track days, rather than paying now and their asset sitting idle for an uncertain period of time.
It's a tricky one, for sure, as it's such a specialised tool.
CarreraLightweightRacing said:
Thanks Scott, I don't see this as a modified car as such as it has been completely redesigned/re-engineered in every sense, not the typical bolt-on approach normally associated with modifying.
Regarding the auctions; with the first auction it was much more straight forward, it basically didn't meet the reserve which I set, also the bidders contacted me asking for time as they had a house sale in progress, another selling a business... As I don't have the luxury of time, I had to consider other options. The auction company came back to me asking to run it again, so I did and dropped the reserve and this time it sold. If I had won, I'd have been over the moon, phoning up with an opened bottle of champagne in one hand, asking about collection etc within 5 minutes of the auction ending. I've still not heard a single word from the winning bidder. All very strange if you ask me.
Anyway I have to move on and find another solution now and rather quickly.
Honestly the best thing you can do is let Misha Charoudin drive it for a YouTube video on the ring. You can say it's for sale and get 150k views and the video description can have your contact details via Instagram for eg. Regarding the auctions; with the first auction it was much more straight forward, it basically didn't meet the reserve which I set, also the bidders contacted me asking for time as they had a house sale in progress, another selling a business... As I don't have the luxury of time, I had to consider other options. The auction company came back to me asking to run it again, so I did and dropped the reserve and this time it sold. If I had won, I'd have been over the moon, phoning up with an opened bottle of champagne in one hand, asking about collection etc within 5 minutes of the auction ending. I've still not heard a single word from the winning bidder. All very strange if you ask me.
Anyway I have to move on and find another solution now and rather quickly.
After he drove my Honda powered Elise I've had multiple people offering to buy it even tho its not for sale.
I can ask him for you if you'd like.
honda_exige said:
Honestly the best thing you can do is let Misha Charoudin drive it for a YouTube video on the ring. You can say it's for sale and get 150k views and the video description can have your contact details via Instagram for eg.
After he drove my Honda powered Elise I've had multiple people offering to buy it even tho its not for sale.
I can ask him for you if you'd like.
You are up bright and early today After he drove my Honda powered Elise I've had multiple people offering to buy it even tho its not for sale.
I can ask him for you if you'd like.
I'm very grateful for you offering help and I think it is a great idea speaking with Misha, but I'm not sure he would appreciate being involved for this purpose. How would it work if he wrote it off; is it a case of you broke it you own it? To replace this car is next to impossible, so there is considerable risk, especially so at The NBR. I sent you a message earlier but these are the thoughts I've had since.
Michael @ Lusso prestige has sold some very decent modified Alfa and might be worth talking to.
https://www.lussoprestige.com/about-us/
https://www.lussoprestige.com/about-us/
CarreraLightweightRacing said:
You are up bright and early today
I'm very grateful for you offering help and I think it is a great idea speaking with Misha, but I'm not sure he would appreciate being involved for this purpose. How would it work if he wrote it off; is it a case of you broke it you own it? To replace this car is next to impossible, so there is considerable risk, especially so at The NBR. I sent you a message earlier but these are the thoughts I've had since.
Haha spot of insomnia, paying for it at work today I'm very grateful for you offering help and I think it is a great idea speaking with Misha, but I'm not sure he would appreciate being involved for this purpose. How would it work if he wrote it off; is it a case of you broke it you own it? To replace this car is next to impossible, so there is considerable risk, especially so at The NBR. I sent you a message earlier but these are the thoughts I've had since.
I wouldn't see it as using him, I mean weird cars like ours get plenty of views so it's mutual!
Insurance best discuss with him, I think normally it's a break it you bought it policy but obviously your car is substantially more expensive than mine!
I dropped you a direct message through your CLR FB page profile as I don't get direct messages through here.
Fantastic engineering and great thread!
Sorry to hear about your health issues and wish you the best in that department as well!
As someone constantly perusing the "classic Italian cars for sale" sites, there don't seem to be many photos of the underside of the car as she stands today and the state of the bodywork as such; there are obviously also bit of aero aids, spoilers etc that have been removed from the car but again, it's not that clear in text or photos what exactly comes with the car or not - you may well have provided that information so forgive, just an observation from an armchair mechanic and potential buyer type.
The thread and advert also refer to the car having a base map - what more needs doing in terms of further development to make road usable 9other than the remap)?
Has your mystery buyer made contact?
Sorry to hear about your health issues and wish you the best in that department as well!
As someone constantly perusing the "classic Italian cars for sale" sites, there don't seem to be many photos of the underside of the car as she stands today and the state of the bodywork as such; there are obviously also bit of aero aids, spoilers etc that have been removed from the car but again, it's not that clear in text or photos what exactly comes with the car or not - you may well have provided that information so forgive, just an observation from an armchair mechanic and potential buyer type.
The thread and advert also refer to the car having a base map - what more needs doing in terms of further development to make road usable 9other than the remap)?
Has your mystery buyer made contact?
arguti said:
Fantastic engineering and great thread!
Sorry to hear about your health issues and wish you the best in that department as well!
As someone constantly perusing the "classic Italian cars for sale" sites, there don't seem to be many photos of the underside of the car as she stands today and the state of the bodywork as such; there are obviously also bit of aero aids, spoilers etc that have been removed from the car but again, it's not that clear in text or photos what exactly comes with the car or not - you may well have provided that information so forgive, just an observation from an armchair mechanic and potential buyer type.
The thread and advert also refer to the car having a base map - what more needs doing in terms of further development to make road usable 9other than the remap)?
Has your mystery buyer made contact?
Thanks for your post Arguti, the bodywork/underside detail should all be pretty clear from the pictures on page one of this thread. There is no further corrosion from when all the original bodywork modifications were carried out. There are also around 400 pictures here which may help. Sorry to hear about your health issues and wish you the best in that department as well!
As someone constantly perusing the "classic Italian cars for sale" sites, there don't seem to be many photos of the underside of the car as she stands today and the state of the bodywork as such; there are obviously also bit of aero aids, spoilers etc that have been removed from the car but again, it's not that clear in text or photos what exactly comes with the car or not - you may well have provided that information so forgive, just an observation from an armchair mechanic and potential buyer type.
The thread and advert also refer to the car having a base map - what more needs doing in terms of further development to make road usable 9other than the remap)?
Has your mystery buyer made contact?
Me taking photos or making videos of any areas specifically would not be a problem. All the Aero kit was removed but can be refitted should someone wish to. My driveway is very steep and for TUV approval various elements were not permitted, hence me removing it.
In terms of mapping, I had the car mapped remotely from an AEM ECU specialist for F20C engines. I was driving with the lap top installed and he did all the mapping from The USA. This is fine for a base map and the car can be driving perfectly normally, I would just spend an hour or so on a dyno or live mapping on the road to get it absolutely perfect. It runs rich at idle so a bit of fuel needs to be pulled out in the lower rev range. This would be minimal outlay, probably only £150 and I have specialist contacts in the UK who can do this no problem.
In terms of further development, I would recommend a Geo to suit taste (either more track or road biased dependent on the user requirements). I have made a manual device to insert onto the throttle for cold start, so there is potential to fit the stock coldstart system, again pretty simple and cheap if someone wanted to do this. Also the level of NVH you want would be subject to fitting or removing dynomat/carpets. I fitted as much as I felt necessary but someone may prefer to have it completely stripped out or go to town and kit it out like a Bentley. So nothing complex, just a bit of finesse to suit personal requirements. All the development work has been completed now. It is both FIA and TUV compliant.
200Plus Club said:
Michael @ Lusso prestige has sold some very decent modified Alfa and might be worth talking to.
https://www.lussoprestige.com/about-us/
Thanks Chris, I contacted Michael today https://www.lussoprestige.com/about-us/
How about Bring A Trailer? It is quite US-centric in many ways but there are lots of cars that travel across from Europe and vice versa.
https://bringatrailer.com
There's an Alfa on at the moment although it nothing like yours ...
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-alfa-romeo-...
And this one sold in the last day or two as well ...
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-alfa-romeo-...
https://bringatrailer.com
There's an Alfa on at the moment although it nothing like yours ...
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-alfa-romeo-...
And this one sold in the last day or two as well ...
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1974-alfa-romeo-...
Edited by uk66fastback on Tuesday 23 March 13:06
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