Fiesta ST stage 3 build

[Scobblelotcher]

The graph is far better than I’d expected as smaller engines often have crazy lag when running big turbos.

Still as for the block longevity at these levels running on a standard block life is going to be massively shortened for sure. At more than double the power levels it’s a lottery how long it will last for. I’ve been tuning or more accurately paying others to tune my cars for more than 20 years and once you’ve significantly exceeded the figures the engine was setup to develop component life is shortened significantly and it can become a lottery how long things will survive for even if Bob down the pub has run one for 30,000 miles or whatever the figure is, most of it seems to come down to how it’s been looked after and run to some extent and with the remain being luck.

400 out of a 1.6 isn’t all that impressive really, you can boost engines to massive power if you don’t care how long they survive for.

[J4CKO]

The internals are fine until they become externals
Cant imagine another 100 bhp in mine without further mods.

[Dylanaledhall]

J4CKO said:

The internals are fine until they become externals
Cant imagine another 100 bhp in mine without further mods.

Hahaha too right

[Dylanaledhall]

So guys just a little update. Car has had it's service today. Plugs apparently look ok as it hasn't been too long since it's last service so I'll buy new ones when I go stage 3. I also got them to fit the new crossover and coolant pipe. Only downside is that the engine cover won't fit now with the new crossover and coolant pipe but some might like the look.

The only parts I need now consist of ;
- The hybrid turbo itself
- Recirc valve
- Actuator ( 11 psi )
- Hot side and Cold side pipes
- Turbo elbow

I think I'll buy this list all at the same time, no point buying an actuator if I don't have the turbo yet, same story for the hot side and Cold side pipes, apparently it's not reccomended to run them on a car that's not got stage 3 mapping. Still thinking what turbo would be the best option. The most popular is the X47R by far, closely followed by the S280. Overall I think I do prefer the X47R because of its proven reliability and the price, although the S280 can provide more power. I'll keep you guys posted

[Dylanaledhall]

A little update, I've got my eye on a few bits and bobs ( actuator, recirc, turbo elbow and a turbo itself). They are second hand but one hell of a bargain for a job lot of parts. I'll update you all if and when I decide to purchase them. If I do manage to snap them up, the only thing I need is a selection of boost pipes for around the intercooler and that should be all I need in order to go stage 3.

One thing I am looking at is a different exhaust set up. I do really like the milltek but it is way too quiet for my liking. I'm not looking for something obnoxious because I do want to stay civil with my neighbours. I was thinking of a Cobra sport system as opposed to the cobra venom ( apparently the cobra venom system is so loud it will fail an MOT). Another exhaust system I'm considering is the Yakuza Outlaw exhaust, looks and sounds mega apparently. I think a 3 inch system will fit the bill

I'll need to ask my mechanic if he knows anyone that will pass a car with a decat during an MOT , just because a decat system will obviously be louder, less restrictive and cheaper

[RC1807]

Is a 3" exhaust system a good idea? I thought, perhaps incorrectly, that if the pipe was *too* big it wouldn't benefit power.
I used to run an i5 2.5T with a GT3071R turbo and the system was 2.5" bore. That was certainly big and loud enough with a 200 cell sport cat and very large silencers!

[WCZ]

Dylanaledhall said:

A little update, I've got my eye on a few bits and bobs ( actuator, recirc, turbo elbow and a turbo itself). They are second hand but one hell of a bargain for a job lot of parts. I'll update you all if and when I decide to purchase them. If I do manage to snap them up, the only thing I need is a selection of boost pipes for around the intercooler and that should be all I need in order to go stage 3.

One thing I am looking at is a different exhaust set up. I do really like the milltek but it is way too quiet for my liking. I'm not looking for something obnoxious because I do want to stay civil with my neighbours. I was thinking of a Cobra sport system as opposed to the cobra venom ( apparently the cobra venom system is so loud it will fail an MOT). Another exhaust system I'm considering is the Yakuza Outlaw exhaust, looks and sounds mega apparently. I think a 3 inch system will fit the bill

I'll need to ask my mechanic if he knows anyone that will pass a car with a decat during an MOT , just because a decat system will obviously be louder, less restrictive and cheaper

nice!

do you have any recomendations of where to find these spare parts? I've been looking but it seems people seem to sell their cars modified and dont bother paying to have the original turbo put back on etc as it's a fair bit of work

[J4CKO]

Dylanaledhall said:

A little update, I've got my eye on a few bits and bobs ( actuator, recirc, turbo elbow and a turbo itself). They are second hand but one hell of a bargain for a job lot of parts. I'll update you all if and when I decide to purchase them. If I do manage to snap them up, the only thing I need is a selection of boost pipes for around the intercooler and that should be all I need in order to go stage 3.

One thing I am looking at is a different exhaust set up. I do really like the milltek but it is way too quiet for my liking. I'm not looking for something obnoxious because I do want to stay civil with my neighbours. I was thinking of a Cobra sport system as opposed to the cobra venom ( apparently the cobra venom system is so loud it will fail an MOT). Another exhaust system I'm considering is the Yakuza Outlaw exhaust, looks and sounds mega apparently. I think a 3 inch system will fit the bill

I'll need to ask my mechanic if he knows anyone that will pass a car with a decat during an MOT , just because a decat system will obviously be louder, less restrictive and cheaper

Sports cat all the way, by the time you start messing about possibly dropping MOT testers "a drink" or even worse, arsing about changing cats out once a year its not worth it, plus they tend to stink, even a sports cat is a bit pongy.

I have a mongoose, its a bit too loud for me but does some lovely burbling, I had resonated Cobra on my 350Z, that was ok but different car of course.

3 inch all the way for bigger power, mine had a Mountune on it and it wasnt up to the job being 2.5, apparently the force of the gasses was pushing it back as it hit the step from the 3 inch cat to the 2.5 system and getting very hot, so had to stump up for the new mongoose, just could do with it being a little more civilised, was quoted £250 to stick another box in but not done it yet.

Took some non car friends in it and they said "Why does it sound like that", I demonstrated why with a little pull in second gear, when you have a Ford Galaxy and a Kia something or other a stage 3 Fiesta ST comes as something as a shock

[Dylanaledhall]

RC1807 said:

Is a 3" exhaust system a good idea? I thought, perhaps incorrectly, that if the pipe was *too* big it wouldn't benefit power.
I used to run an i5 2.5T with a GT3071R turbo and the system was 2.5" bore. That was certainly big and loud enough with a 200 cell sport cat and very large silencers!

It's a bit of a talking point as some say they lost power when increasing the bore while some say they gained so it's a bit of a strange one but I think overall, the bigger the bore the less restriction.

For example, Sabre Tuning near Castle Combe will only tune cars to stage 3 level that are running a 3 inch system. No idea if it's down to how their mapping works or whether it's to do with getting the best results possible. Either way, it seems they have the best results with a larger diameter

[Dylanaledhall]

J4CKO said:

Sports cat all the way, by the time you start messing about possibly dropping MOT testers "a drink" or even worse, arsing about changing cats out once a year its not worth it, plus they tend to stink, even a sports cat is a bit pongy.

I have a mongoose, its a bit too loud for me but does some lovely burbling, I had resonated Cobra on my 350Z, that was ok but different car of course.

3 inch all the way for bigger power, mine had a Mountune on it and it wasnt up to the job being 2.5, apparently the force of the gasses was pushing it back as it hit the step from the 3 inch cat to the 2.5 system and getting very hot, so had to stump up for the new mongoose, just could do with it being a little more civilised, was quoted £250 to stick another box in but not done it yet.

Took some non car friends in it and they said "Why does it sound like that", I demonstrated why with a little pull in second gear, when you have a Ford Galaxy and a Kia something or other a stage 3 Fiesta ST comes as something as a shock

Haha bet it was a shock to them

My biggest concern decat wise is carbon monoxide poisoning. If it's done properly it's fine but a couple were killed in an ST because it was running a decat. I do like having a sports cat, it does lessen the hassle when it comes to an MOT

[Dylanaledhall]

WCZ said:

nice!

do you have any recomendations of where to find these spare parts? I've been looking but it seems people seem to sell their cars modified and dont bother paying to have the original turbo put back on etc as it's a fair bit of work

You will find things crop up on ebay from time to time just by searching (for example) st180 exhaust. But to be honest, your best bet will be in the fiesta groups on Facebook. Usually a few people will want to strip parts unless their car is going privately to an enthusiast or a performance dealer. Do bare in mind, some may not want to post therefore try and seek out parts closer to you or if you're willing to set up a courier I'm sure they'd be happy.

But yes, some don't bother stripping parts because of the hassle but for example a used sports cat can easily fetch £250-300. Some can't afford to leave those parts on the car. But like I said, maybe join some fiesta groups on Facebook there's always parts being listed, most of the time it's cars being stripped ready for resale . If you don't mind me asking, what specific parts are you after? Thanks

[J4CKO]

Dylanaledhall said:

J4CKO said:

Sports cat all the way, by the time you start messing about possibly dropping MOT testers "a drink" or even worse, arsing about changing cats out once a year its not worth it, plus they tend to stink, even a sports cat is a bit pongy.

I have a mongoose, its a bit too loud for me but does some lovely burbling, I had resonated Cobra on my 350Z, that was ok but different car of course.

3 inch all the way for bigger power, mine had a Mountune on it and it wasnt up to the job being 2.5, apparently the force of the gasses was pushing it back as it hit the step from the 3 inch cat to the 2.5 system and getting very hot, so had to stump up for the new mongoose, just could do with it being a little more civilised, was quoted £250 to stick another box in but not done it yet.

Took some non car friends in it and they said "Why does it sound like that", I demonstrated why with a little pull in second gear, when you have a Ford Galaxy and a Kia something or other a stage 3 Fiesta ST comes as something as a shock

Haha bet it was a shock to them

My biggest concern decat wise is carbon monoxide poisoning. If it's done properly it's fine but a couple were killed in an ST because it was running a decat. I do like having a sports cat, it does lessen the hassle when it comes to an MOT

Yeah, heard about that, absolutely tragic.

We used to manage back in the old days with cars that didnt have cats, makes me wonder if modern stuff is any different or was just a combination of circumstances, I remember going to car auctions in the eighties and nineties and having a banging headache, smelling fumes on your clothes and tasting it in your mouth.

[WCZ]

Dylanaledhall said:

If you don't mind me asking, what specific parts are you after? Thanks

was thinking about a hybrid turbo :> possibly sports cat too

[Volvolover]

I'd peak to your chosen tuner about exhaust bore, bigger is not always better, you want the right amount of backpressure for a start or you'll have the turbo leaking oil through the seals like a good un amongst other things. Its also dependent on cam timing, overlap, size of manifold primaries/secondaries etc. You need to keep the air speed up. Only increase bore size if it becomes a restriction


https://www.motorsport-developments.co.uk/tech_art...

[Dylanaledhall]

WCZ said:

was thinking about a hybrid turbo :> possibly sports cat too

Plenty of sports cats on Facebook marketplace, Fiesta ST owners group etc. I'm kind of gutted because I missed out on an X47R turbo, actuator and ported manifold for £530, someone outbid me at the last second at £540. bd . Hybrids are a bit harder to find but they are out there, best thing to do is search up either on ebay or Facebook and a couple may turn up. Even if you post in the ST owners group something like "Anyone selling a hybrid turbo?" Plenty of people should get back to you. I'm on the lookout too so if I see something I'll post it on here for you to see

[Dylanaledhall]

Volvolover said:

I'd peak to your chosen tuner about exhaust bore, bigger is not always better, you want the right amount of backpressure for a start or you'll have the turbo leaking oil through the seals like a good un amongst other things. Its also dependent on cam timing, overlap, size of manifold primaries/secondaries etc. You need to keep the air speed up. Only increase bore size if it becomes a restriction


https://www.motorsport-developments.co.uk/tech_art...

Cheers will give it a look

[Scobblelotcher]

Do many folk go down the twin scroll route? I’m wondering how much it may help running a bigger turbo on a smaller capacity engine?

[Volvolover]

Scobblelotcher said:

Do many folk go down the twin scroll route? I’m wondering how much it may help running a bigger turbo on a smaller capacity engine?

It helps enormously!

[Dylanaledhall]

Scobblelotcher said:

Do many folk go down the twin scroll route? I’m wondering how much it may help running a bigger turbo on a smaller capacity engine?

Never really crossed my mind, I know pumaspeed had a 500bhp fiesta st ( forged and running a different ecu) but no idea what turbo was in it, I'll show you some turbo kits they have available for the ST:




Mega money though I'm looking at the turbos below like the X47R , X57 and possibly X58 Evo in future. The Garrett turbo kits are more for the 450bhp+ builds but I'm not aiming to do that with this car, reason being it would be way too much money and I don't think this platform would handle the power that well. Even cupras can stuggle with 500bhp+ in slightly less than perfect conditions. This might be worth a read:

https://www.fiestastforum.com/threads/peron-p3xx-t...

[Scobblelotcher]

Thanks, twin scroll turbos in the right application can spool faster and create more power at lower and high rev ranges.

The thread you shared makes for interesting reading, twin scroll seems to work well with the Fiesta motor.

Ultimately peak power doesn’t matter as much if you fit a large turbo that doesn’t say get going until high in the rev range and leaves the car flat until high revs. When people talk about high power numbers with small/medium sized engines I always wonder how laggy they are and how usable the engine is running a big turbo.