1972 Saab 99 L - Green
Discussion
Lovely car.
My best mate at school's mum had one of similar vintage in the late 80s as her daily, but hers was beige. Not nearly as nice to look at as this one, but fond memories of being driven about in it and remember it being incredibly comfortable.
The other thing that sticks in my mind was the huge, bright red 'FASTEN SEAT BELTS' light that used to come on on the dash. Very aircraft-like.
Yours looks to be in better condition than hers was 35 years ago.
My best mate at school's mum had one of similar vintage in the late 80s as her daily, but hers was beige. Not nearly as nice to look at as this one, but fond memories of being driven about in it and remember it being incredibly comfortable.
The other thing that sticks in my mind was the huge, bright red 'FASTEN SEAT BELTS' light that used to come on on the dash. Very aircraft-like.
Yours looks to be in better condition than hers was 35 years ago.
Limpet said:
The other thing that sticks in my mind was the huge, bright red 'FASTEN SEAT BELTS' light that used to come on on the dash. Very aircraft-like.
Yours looks to be in better condition than hers was 35 years ago.
Hmm was that a 90 by any chance? I haven't see that cool feature (which we ahve on the 900) on a 99, but I may be mistaken. School run cars definitely stay in the mind. My freind's mum had a red volvo 240 estate, mega mileage even then, with Radio 4 unchangeable.Yours looks to be in better condition than hers was 35 years ago.
MitsuJa said:
Something just popped up on a FB group and I remembered this.
I'm keen to keep the Saab cover art theme running on this one.Long day on the 99 today, we took it for a drive together yesterday and my wife wanted to cure a few issued (squeaky alternator belt, D pillar trim detrioration.
I took the opportunity to get stuck in under the bonnet - there is a slight oil leak, and the cam gasket was solid so I had secured a NOS cork item from the eBay. It looks like some of the oil was weeping from the bolts themselves, which have a rubber and brass washer over the cam cover. I couldn't track these down.
We took off HT leads, a few ancilliaries and were greeted with this....
Yikes. That is a significant sludge. It almost looks as if someone Hammerited under the cam cover. the gasket was rock solid, and there is evidence of previous 'scrapings' at the inside of the cover, but this explains the low mileage!
Bit worried about the 'glazed' cam lobes - any seasoned experts care to comment?
I could have sat there for hours wiping it all off carefully, but instead I tackle the biggest areas, careful not to let any chunks get back into the engine, and resolved to try one of those engine flushers. Now, before you all start folding your arms and rolling your eyes, I think this is the exact age of engine, and right problem, with ample tolerances, for an experiment.
Cover back on with new gasket and a slight buttering of Hylomar. Tap repair kit provided rubber washers.
My wife spotted some evidence of super slack chain that has hit either side of the head (!). She filed it down carefully (don't worry, we're fulshing the oil in a moment).
She cleaned up the mating surfaces and the cover went back on.
I put in a Wynn's Engine Flush. Ran it for 20 minutes as instructed. Even thoguh the oil was 200 miles old, it watch pitch black and some fair amount of chunkiness (2-3mm pieces) came out. More changes required and the cam will be coming off for a repaint in the summer - any tips on how to purge this filth ("Careful now") would be well received.
Next up, coolant. It wasnt much better...
Delicious. We ran what we could through various points, but ultimately this radiator needs a recore. New elbow top hose mercifully available.
Blue antifreeze added, new clamps where possible. Some old hoses remain.
While I fidled with all this and muttered about the absence of service history, my wife took out the rotten D pillar trims. The were completely shot and trailing foam and mouse bedding at every speedbump.
To get the seats down for a proper clean, we actually checked the original manual - the whole loading bay goes flat.
Alternator belt was flapping wildly, so a 12mm and 13mm took up the slack. I always use a hammer as a leaver if working alone.
Fresh oil and a little clean, it was all running nicely and looking a little better.
Thereafter followed an afternoon of 2 bucket washing, 3 microfibre polishing and 4 very tired hands. Interior hoovered, cleaned, glass vinegared, trim dressed and chrome polished. It is looking better, but the old green paint is definitely showing its age with persistent mist patches. Modern polishes, SRP and EGP from Autoglym) helped, but are just not getting it right. Recommendations for older cellulose (?) paint rejuvinators welcome.
After all that I of course neglected to take a picture of the whole car.
I took the opportunity to get stuck in under the bonnet - there is a slight oil leak, and the cam gasket was solid so I had secured a NOS cork item from the eBay. It looks like some of the oil was weeping from the bolts themselves, which have a rubber and brass washer over the cam cover. I couldn't track these down.
We took off HT leads, a few ancilliaries and were greeted with this....
Yikes. That is a significant sludge. It almost looks as if someone Hammerited under the cam cover. the gasket was rock solid, and there is evidence of previous 'scrapings' at the inside of the cover, but this explains the low mileage!
Bit worried about the 'glazed' cam lobes - any seasoned experts care to comment?
I could have sat there for hours wiping it all off carefully, but instead I tackle the biggest areas, careful not to let any chunks get back into the engine, and resolved to try one of those engine flushers. Now, before you all start folding your arms and rolling your eyes, I think this is the exact age of engine, and right problem, with ample tolerances, for an experiment.
Cover back on with new gasket and a slight buttering of Hylomar. Tap repair kit provided rubber washers.
My wife spotted some evidence of super slack chain that has hit either side of the head (!). She filed it down carefully (don't worry, we're fulshing the oil in a moment).
She cleaned up the mating surfaces and the cover went back on.
I put in a Wynn's Engine Flush. Ran it for 20 minutes as instructed. Even thoguh the oil was 200 miles old, it watch pitch black and some fair amount of chunkiness (2-3mm pieces) came out. More changes required and the cam will be coming off for a repaint in the summer - any tips on how to purge this filth ("Careful now") would be well received.
Next up, coolant. It wasnt much better...
Delicious. We ran what we could through various points, but ultimately this radiator needs a recore. New elbow top hose mercifully available.
Blue antifreeze added, new clamps where possible. Some old hoses remain.
While I fidled with all this and muttered about the absence of service history, my wife took out the rotten D pillar trims. The were completely shot and trailing foam and mouse bedding at every speedbump.
To get the seats down for a proper clean, we actually checked the original manual - the whole loading bay goes flat.
Alternator belt was flapping wildly, so a 12mm and 13mm took up the slack. I always use a hammer as a leaver if working alone.
Fresh oil and a little clean, it was all running nicely and looking a little better.
Thereafter followed an afternoon of 2 bucket washing, 3 microfibre polishing and 4 very tired hands. Interior hoovered, cleaned, glass vinegared, trim dressed and chrome polished. It is looking better, but the old green paint is definitely showing its age with persistent mist patches. Modern polishes, SRP and EGP from Autoglym) helped, but are just not getting it right. Recommendations for older cellulose (?) paint rejuvinators welcome.
After all that I of course neglected to take a picture of the whole car.
All this talk of hitting heads, mating and flushing... no wonder you were both knackered!
Anyway, I couldn't make a purile observation without something valuable, so perhaps you might consider Bilt Hamber Auto Balm suitable for the older paint.
I've got an open one, I think, and I'm unlikely to use any more so am happy to send it to you or you can collect if you're in Wandsworth or SW20.
Anyway, I couldn't make a purile observation without something valuable, so perhaps you might consider Bilt Hamber Auto Balm suitable for the older paint.
I've got an open one, I think, and I'm unlikely to use any more so am happy to send it to you or you can collect if you're in Wandsworth or SW20.
It's a good morning. Bug updates for you, darkyoung and some of my other favorites!
The sludgy oil residue looks unpleasant. I'm interested to see if the cleaner works, as I would have assumed that would need mechanical cleaning...
As for the paint, I like a car that shows a bit of age....
The sludgy oil residue looks unpleasant. I'm interested to see if the cleaner works, as I would have assumed that would need mechanical cleaning...
As for the paint, I like a car that shows a bit of age....
They all look a bit like that with the cam cover removed. I seriously wouldn't worry about it. If you do want to clean it of course that's not an issue.
Definitely worth replacing the leaky gasket though.
+1 for not using additives. They always have some terrible downside not listed on the back of the packet.
The oil strainer design on these cars is quite a bit different to what you get on later cars and it will still work with bigger chunks of rubbish in the sump than anything in any of your pictures were any of it to get into the oil pan. It's a smaller square filter with big holes and it sits quite a long way off the bottom of the pan. The chamber it sits in is long and narrow so there is always a good deep well of oil for it to draw from. Many cars have the strainer right on the bottom of the pan where it can get clogged up.
Definitely worth replacing the leaky gasket though.
+1 for not using additives. They always have some terrible downside not listed on the back of the packet.
The oil strainer design on these cars is quite a bit different to what you get on later cars and it will still work with bigger chunks of rubbish in the sump than anything in any of your pictures were any of it to get into the oil pan. It's a smaller square filter with big holes and it sits quite a long way off the bottom of the pan. The chamber it sits in is long and narrow so there is always a good deep well of oil for it to draw from. Many cars have the strainer right on the bottom of the pan where it can get clogged up.
Only just stumbled upon this but it's chock-full of win for me - I grew up in Worcestershire, went to school in Bewdley, and my old man had 96 V4 and then a 99 EMS when I was a kid.
He used to take his to Baynhall, the other side of Worcester, so I presume Arthur Moore was gone by then as they would have been handier. (And more fun for my boy racer old man to get to!)
Look forward to following this one.
He used to take his to Baynhall, the other side of Worcester, so I presume Arthur Moore was gone by then as they would have been handier. (And more fun for my boy racer old man to get to!)
Look forward to following this one.
'In 1983 Arthur Moore and Sons Central Garage Great Witley ceased trading . . .'
From here - https://witleysoralhistory.com/view-archive/people...
We moved to Hartlebury in 1985, so we just missed them.
From here - https://witleysoralhistory.com/view-archive/people...
We moved to Hartlebury in 1985, so we just missed them.
Thanks all - the additive was a bit of an experiment but good to hear the strainer setup is robust. I am hoping I haven't made anything worse, and at the very least the fresh oil and new gasket on should be beneficial.
The chain tensioner I think needs adjustment too.
AutoBalm looks ideal, thank you for the suggestion and offer! I will let you know.
The chain tensioner I think needs adjustment too.
AutoBalm looks ideal, thank you for the suggestion and offer! I will let you know.
PistonBroker said:
Only just stumbled upon this but it's chock-full of win for me - I grew up in Worcestershire, went to school in Bewdley, and my old man had 96 V4 and then a 99 EMS when I was a kid.
He used to take his to Baynhall, the other side of Worcester, so I presume Arthur Moore was gone by then as they would have been handier. (And more fun for my boy racer old man to get to!)
Look forward to following this one.
The SAAB habit was frequently handed down in families or from role modelsHe used to take his to Baynhall, the other side of Worcester, so I presume Arthur Moore was gone by then as they would have been handier. (And more fun for my boy racer old man to get to!)
Look forward to following this one.
My parents had a 95 V4, a 99, several 900s & ultimately a 9000. One of my primary teachers had a 95, several 96s, a 99 EMS, routinely wore a SAAB rally jacket - and used to hand out copies of the SAAB owners’ club magazine for reading practice in class!Inevitably my first car was a 99, followed by many many more over the years.
Loving this thread - and trying to resist looking at SAABs on eBay
Spinakerr said:
Limpet said:
The other thing that sticks in my mind was the huge, bright red 'FASTEN SEAT BELTS' light that used to come on on the dash. Very aircraft-like.
Yours looks to be in better condition than hers was 35 years ago.
Hmm was that a 90 by any chance? I haven't see that cool feature (which we ahve on the 900) on a 99, but I may be mistaken. School run cars definitely stay in the mind. My freind's mum had a red volvo 240 estate, mega mileage even then, with Radio 4 unchangeable.Yours looks to be in better condition than hers was 35 years ago.
The chain tensioner is automatic. It takes up the slack.
One side of the chain will be lose, on the side where the tensioner is.
The other side where the crankshaft sprocket is pulling the camshaft sprocket it will be tight.
The risk of a timing chain system being too loose is rattling due to the chain slopping around and hitting things. The other is jumping time, if the chain is loose enough to jump off the sprocket and change the timing.
The noise you would be able to hear if it was a big issue. Some noise is okay as the chain has to pass the guides and will rub on them under normal circumstances. If the guides and the tensioner are especially worn the noise could get a lot louder and then it would be a good idea to do something.
I wouldn't expect it to jump time unless there was a lot of noise from a very loose chain slapping about.
One side of the chain will be lose, on the side where the tensioner is.
The other side where the crankshaft sprocket is pulling the camshaft sprocket it will be tight.
The risk of a timing chain system being too loose is rattling due to the chain slopping around and hitting things. The other is jumping time, if the chain is loose enough to jump off the sprocket and change the timing.
The noise you would be able to hear if it was a big issue. Some noise is okay as the chain has to pass the guides and will rub on them under normal circumstances. If the guides and the tensioner are especially worn the noise could get a lot louder and then it would be a good idea to do something.
I wouldn't expect it to jump time unless there was a lot of noise from a very loose chain slapping about.
The duplex chain on the 2.0 is significantly better than the single chains on the 1.7 and 1.85 99 engines , I don't remember a 2.0 chain failing completely on the B20 engine . The B201 engine was a different matter , with a dreadful chocolate tensioner that was superceded very quickly after early failures .
The 99 has had an eventful few weeks - nothing bad, but plenty to write home, or rather to PH, about.
The previous owners said the car was fouling plug on short journeys ... well, its definitely fulfilling that brief. Three cyclinders at the start of April after a few local trips, I pulled the plugs and sure enough:
Brass brush applied, back to normal operation. Definitely running more than rich, so we booked it in to TR Autos, who completed an inspection a few weeks earlier on the transmission tunnel rust.
The car drove wonderfully down to Somerset, though my 'pace car' of the Rover 75 (pre van damage) noted that the speedo must be under reading by about 5%! Good thing I kept it to max indicated 55, 70 might have put me in the yellow flashbox of misery. Notable, the paintwork was looking decent after recent careful application of potions...
TR have had the car now for a fair few weeks, and the rust repair went to plan:
Thankfully, Tommy at TR reports no other grot in the undercarraige, which means I have the (Verona) green light to get busy with underseal and gloopy waxy stuff throughout.
Sadly, all is not well with the carb - the initial gas analyser recorded 12% CO2 (splutter!) as the jet and adjustment screws had been fiddled to destruction. Amazingly, the Stromberg 175CD was still running, but after trying two quick fixes - diaphragm and jet, the car was running sweetly but then started creeping up on the analyser after a few drives. Bottom line - the carb needs rebuilding, and we won't be seeing the 99 for a little while yet.
Fortunately, everything else on the car seems to be as we had assessed it, so when it does dome back we'll be good to go for the summer, and hopefully with the absolute minimum of noxious gasses.
We had known the carb was an issue - it is on any old car, and havign it rebuilt now by the Saab sensei is probably the wisest decision. Please note, oh brethren of the floatchambers - this is not the 'standard' 175 you staple to a range rover or vintage Jag, no - this of course has some Saab auto adjustingness about it. So rebuild it is.
The previous owners said the car was fouling plug on short journeys ... well, its definitely fulfilling that brief. Three cyclinders at the start of April after a few local trips, I pulled the plugs and sure enough:
Brass brush applied, back to normal operation. Definitely running more than rich, so we booked it in to TR Autos, who completed an inspection a few weeks earlier on the transmission tunnel rust.
The car drove wonderfully down to Somerset, though my 'pace car' of the Rover 75 (pre van damage) noted that the speedo must be under reading by about 5%! Good thing I kept it to max indicated 55, 70 might have put me in the yellow flashbox of misery. Notable, the paintwork was looking decent after recent careful application of potions...
TR have had the car now for a fair few weeks, and the rust repair went to plan:
Thankfully, Tommy at TR reports no other grot in the undercarraige, which means I have the (Verona) green light to get busy with underseal and gloopy waxy stuff throughout.
Sadly, all is not well with the carb - the initial gas analyser recorded 12% CO2 (splutter!) as the jet and adjustment screws had been fiddled to destruction. Amazingly, the Stromberg 175CD was still running, but after trying two quick fixes - diaphragm and jet, the car was running sweetly but then started creeping up on the analyser after a few drives. Bottom line - the carb needs rebuilding, and we won't be seeing the 99 for a little while yet.
Fortunately, everything else on the car seems to be as we had assessed it, so when it does dome back we'll be good to go for the summer, and hopefully with the absolute minimum of noxious gasses.
We had known the carb was an issue - it is on any old car, and havign it rebuilt now by the Saab sensei is probably the wisest decision. Please note, oh brethren of the floatchambers - this is not the 'standard' 175 you staple to a range rover or vintage Jag, no - this of course has some Saab auto adjustingness about it. So rebuild it is.
Edited by Spinakerr on Monday 1st May 22:01
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