Mk2 Escort Rally Car for the road (all costs recorded)
Discussion
fttm said:
Nice car especially with the Millington installed . Using as a road car meh , you’ll soon get bored of the harsh ride , deafening noise and speeding tickets . Had a few rally cars including Gp4 BDG Escort which were all fun when used as intended, routine use they’d become a chore . Enjoy
That's true. I've had stripped out track cars before and one car I regret selling was a Westfield, which had a 270hp duratec, sequential gearbox, carbon panels and barely padded seats. Unfortunately getting caught in the rain really put me off the Westfield and it was frightening when it happened on the motorway. Aquaplaning, poor visibility low down and artic wheels look huge when you drive next to them. But the sound at 8500rpm through 54mm bodies was wonderful. 
The other cars at least had some rubber bushes! the escort is all metal, but I intend to change that.
Edited by Niponeoff on Thursday 30th March 07:43
fttm said:
Using as a road car meh , you’ll soon get bored of the harsh ride , deafening noise and speeding tickets .
Had a few rally cars including Gp4 BDG Escort which were all fun when used as intended, routine use they’d become a chore . Enjoy
Me too - bought for buttons 25+ years ago MK1 and Mk2 - great fun around the lanes for an hour but hard to hang onto your licence and mine were nothing like this spec Had a few rally cars including Gp4 BDG Escort which were all fun when used as intended, routine use they’d become a chore . Enjoy
Probably too late but OP if you want a mint car I'd sell this and buy another already done, particularly with you living abroad, this has financial disaster written all over it
KTMsm said:
fttm said:
Using as a road car meh , you’ll soon get bored of the harsh ride , deafening noise and speeding tickets .
Had a few rally cars including Gp4 BDG Escort which were all fun when used as intended, routine use they’d become a chore . Enjoy
Me too - bought for buttons 25+ years ago MK1 and Mk2 - great fun around the lanes for an hour but hard to hang onto your licence and mine were nothing like this spec Had a few rally cars including Gp4 BDG Escort which were all fun when used as intended, routine use they’d become a chore . Enjoy
Probably too late but OP if you want a mint car I'd sell this and buy another already done, particularly with you living abroad, this has financial disaster written all over it
Also, don't forget this is a genuine RS2000, which isn't easy to replace and should at least retain a bit more value.
Niponeoff said:
It's more about spending time in my garage when i'm home. I have another (fun) car and motorcycle for fun. This serves another part of my hobbies. Escorts are perfect for the home mechanic as they are simple and easy to work on.
Also, don't forget this is a genuine RS2000, which isn't easy to replace and should at least retain a bit more value.
I'm not arguing against Escorts but you've paid a high price for one that (basically) looks good, if you're going to dip it etc then (IME) you're better off starting with a worse car or just buying a better carAlso, don't forget this is a genuine RS2000, which isn't easy to replace and should at least retain a bit more value.
Good project OP.
KTMsm said:
I'm not arguing against Escorts but you've paid a high price for one that (basically) looks good, if you're going to dip it etc then (IME) you're better off starting with a worse car or just buying a better car
He bought the car then discovered the corrosion, and if sells it now he'll likely get a commensurately lower price for the vehicle. 'Should have bought a cheaper/better vehicle' is a bit redundant now.Olivera said:
Good project OP.
Also, working overseas means i only have a very small window to obtain a car, so selling this and buying another will be hard work and not guarantee something perfect.KTMsm said:
I'm not arguing against Escorts but you've paid a high price for one that (basically) looks good, if you're going to dip it etc then (IME) you're better off starting with a worse car or just buying a better car
He bought the car then discovered the corrosion, and if sells it now he'll likely get a commensurately lower price for the vehicle. 'Should have bought a cheaper/better vehicle' is a bit redundant now.I would have definitely negotiated cheaper if i went to view and saw the rust, no doubt about that, so i paid a high price, but i still like the car and for the purpose its intended, i think it will serve as a nice project.
So a bit more review.
I think the previous owner did a good job with the spec, but there are a lot of things that need tidying, which is why i intend to fully strip the car and rebuild.
Fittings - I've never seen so many fittings and hoses. For the water pipe to the turbo there are apx 6 fittings alone. Jig 6 out the block - swept 90, forged 90, straight, another 90, straight on a metal hose then into the turbo.
I don't know if anyone noticed the fuel swirl pot was fed through the return. The swirl pot being on the opposite side to the tank outlets means the pipes go all the way around the boot. But these aren't all single hoses, one is attached with 2 90's and a bulk head fitting.
There used to be an oil cooler under the boot floor so the old oil pipe run all the way into the boot, is looped together and runs back to the engine.
Various loose items such as oil catch can in the engine bay, fuel pump only screwed one side, battery tray held on with self tappers. There's a stretch of pipe out the rad with about 7 clamps on - I think I would have fabricated a pipe for those sensors and pipe returns.
The brake lines are braided but too long and strapped up in places. They also hang around the rear axle.
No rubber bushes anywhere - everything is metal rod ends, so I'll be putting rubber back in. This will make a massive difference on the road.
Wiring is a bit untidy in places, especially the front lights. These are also HID with ballasts so I need to review them for compliance. Might get proper LED units.
Most of the fasteners are those hi tensile black ones that instantly go rusty. Electric windows do work, but the passenger side can stick a bit.
No helper springs so the springs flop around when jacking it up and the seats are all loose. Also lots of overspray as the car was originally an X-Pack in white with a blue stripe before it got arched and painted blue.
The bonnet seems to catch when you open it and that rear view mirror is annoying.
All in all, nothing too hideous that cant be sorted out and I should at least have plenty of pipe and fittings when I come to rebuild it because that's the kind of thing you spend a fortune on! Although if I run the fuel hoses back through the car I'll be using PTFE hose to stop the fuel smell.
I think the previous owner did a good job with the spec, but there are a lot of things that need tidying, which is why i intend to fully strip the car and rebuild.
Fittings - I've never seen so many fittings and hoses. For the water pipe to the turbo there are apx 6 fittings alone. Jig 6 out the block - swept 90, forged 90, straight, another 90, straight on a metal hose then into the turbo.
I don't know if anyone noticed the fuel swirl pot was fed through the return. The swirl pot being on the opposite side to the tank outlets means the pipes go all the way around the boot. But these aren't all single hoses, one is attached with 2 90's and a bulk head fitting.
There used to be an oil cooler under the boot floor so the old oil pipe run all the way into the boot, is looped together and runs back to the engine.
Various loose items such as oil catch can in the engine bay, fuel pump only screwed one side, battery tray held on with self tappers. There's a stretch of pipe out the rad with about 7 clamps on - I think I would have fabricated a pipe for those sensors and pipe returns.
The brake lines are braided but too long and strapped up in places. They also hang around the rear axle.
No rubber bushes anywhere - everything is metal rod ends, so I'll be putting rubber back in. This will make a massive difference on the road.
Wiring is a bit untidy in places, especially the front lights. These are also HID with ballasts so I need to review them for compliance. Might get proper LED units.
Most of the fasteners are those hi tensile black ones that instantly go rusty. Electric windows do work, but the passenger side can stick a bit.
No helper springs so the springs flop around when jacking it up and the seats are all loose. Also lots of overspray as the car was originally an X-Pack in white with a blue stripe before it got arched and painted blue.
The bonnet seems to catch when you open it and that rear view mirror is annoying.
All in all, nothing too hideous that cant be sorted out and I should at least have plenty of pipe and fittings when I come to rebuild it because that's the kind of thing you spend a fortune on! Although if I run the fuel hoses back through the car I'll be using PTFE hose to stop the fuel smell.
boyse7en said:
Electric windows seems an odd addition for a rally-spec lightweight build...
Thought it would have fixed perspex windows on something like that
He probably did on a previous car and learnt his lesson! They're HOT. Like sitting in a greenhouse. They would have been straight out of the front doors even if it was a full on rally car. The weight saving isn't worth it imo.Thought it would have fixed perspex windows on something like that
I might put poly in the back with vents and also vent the front quarter windows. But opening fronts is a must.
So one item on my list is a sequential box.
I had an elite IL200 on my Westfield, so figured an IL300 would be a good option. If I buy new I'll just buy when required, but I always keep an eye out if I can find a bargain along the way.
A quaife 60G came up for sale which I got for 4k in the end, from a fairly reputable source too. This also came with the long lever and digital temp/gear display.
I still hadn't seen the car at this point, but it seemed like a good deal and I could always sell it on if not required, or put it in another Westfield.
This virtually mimics the MST spec on a previous PH thread, so if it's good enough for them, it definitely is for me.
I had an elite IL200 on my Westfield, so figured an IL300 would be a good option. If I buy new I'll just buy when required, but I always keep an eye out if I can find a bargain along the way.
A quaife 60G came up for sale which I got for 4k in the end, from a fairly reputable source too. This also came with the long lever and digital temp/gear display.
I still hadn't seen the car at this point, but it seemed like a good deal and I could always sell it on if not required, or put it in another Westfield.
This virtually mimics the MST spec on a previous PH thread, so if it's good enough for them, it definitely is for me.
So after spending 2 days with car in January I got back to the UK at the end of Feb and took it for a drive. I was still in two minds whether to keep the cossie or install the millington.
485hp must be quick, but my suspicions were that it wouldn't be. I've had fast cars and headline figures are fairly meaningless. Will it get the power down.
The answer is no. It's utterly hopeless. Ok, it was cold weather, but the roads were bone dry and I'm on 245 rears which is huge for an escort. It comes on boost so hard and ferocious that its virtually uncontrollable. The turbo is relatively laggy being a GT3071 but a lot of that was my hesitancy (fear) in planting the throttle.
I could use a smaller more modern turbo and better engine management, boost by gear, TC etc, but to be honest I don't think a turbo suits this car. I want a naturally aspirated screamer and it will be all the better for it, so the cossie is coming out.
It happens to be a pretty high spec engine too, so it's up for sale. In the right car it will be great.
485hp must be quick, but my suspicions were that it wouldn't be. I've had fast cars and headline figures are fairly meaningless. Will it get the power down.
The answer is no. It's utterly hopeless. Ok, it was cold weather, but the roads were bone dry and I'm on 245 rears which is huge for an escort. It comes on boost so hard and ferocious that its virtually uncontrollable. The turbo is relatively laggy being a GT3071 but a lot of that was my hesitancy (fear) in planting the throttle.
I could use a smaller more modern turbo and better engine management, boost by gear, TC etc, but to be honest I don't think a turbo suits this car. I want a naturally aspirated screamer and it will be all the better for it, so the cossie is coming out.
It happens to be a pretty high spec engine too, so it's up for sale. In the right car it will be great.
scottos said:
I opened the thread and thought this will be class, then saw the YB and almost rolled my eyes (sorry), it's just not for me.
BUT then the Millington picture, excellent
looking forward to seeing how you get on with it all!
No doubting the effectiveness of MD engine lumps, but from hours being stood next to forest tracks spectating stage rallies I find you can't beat the sound of BDA/BDG lumps, would be my choice of any powerplant in an Escort BUT then the Millington picture, excellent
looking forward to seeing how you get on with it all! 
Nice one op taking the plunge and getting stuck in, look forward to seeing how this progresses!
So that's settled, millington with a 60G.
First up, clutch. Settled on a helix with a sprung centre. More puks are less aggressive and the ceremetallic face means I can run a lighter pedal. This will be better on the road than the unsprung AP's etc.
First problem is I don't know what the thread is in the flywheel for the clutch. So I ordered 5/8 UNF and M8x1.0. Will be one or the other.
Unfortunately I mixed them up when I opened them and the one that fits was too short! Thought it was M8, so ordered longer. Then realised it was 5/8 but the length was slightly shorter than nominal!
So ordered more 5/8 and received UNC! I couldn't get this task completed in the two weeks I was off, so currently held on with the shorter bolts.
Must invest in thread gauges.
So that was £26.12 in bolts alone, so costly mistake.
First up, clutch. Settled on a helix with a sprung centre. More puks are less aggressive and the ceremetallic face means I can run a lighter pedal. This will be better on the road than the unsprung AP's etc.
First problem is I don't know what the thread is in the flywheel for the clutch. So I ordered 5/8 UNF and M8x1.0. Will be one or the other.
Unfortunately I mixed them up when I opened them and the one that fits was too short! Thought it was M8, so ordered longer. Then realised it was 5/8 but the length was slightly shorter than nominal!
So ordered more 5/8 and received UNC! I couldn't get this task completed in the two weeks I was off, so currently held on with the shorter bolts.
Must invest in thread gauges.
So that was £26.12 in bolts alone, so costly mistake.
You can also see the dirt plate, dowels from the local ford garage and an alloy quick release pinto bell housing.
Millington recommend Ark starter motors, but Frank Kelly uses wosp. I've used wosp in the past and like their stuff, so went down to competition supplies.
Had to fettle the dirt plate and starter motor to fit of course..
£237.60 - Starter motor, wosp LMS043 Pinto 110T
£12 - bell housing grommets
£7.49 - Bolts in SS for BH and starter
£7.59 - M8 A4 cap heads gearbox to BH
£6.72 - Pinto dowels
£42.83 - dirt plate from retroford
Millington recommend Ark starter motors, but Frank Kelly uses wosp. I've used wosp in the past and like their stuff, so went down to competition supplies.
Had to fettle the dirt plate and starter motor to fit of course..
£237.60 - Starter motor, wosp LMS043 Pinto 110T
£12 - bell housing grommets
£7.49 - Bolts in SS for BH and starter
£7.59 - M8 A4 cap heads gearbox to BH
£6.72 - Pinto dowels
£42.83 - dirt plate from retroford
Edited by Niponeoff on Friday 31st March 10:07
So I went for a Heavy Duty concentric slave from MST, this has a max travel of 18mm
The helix clutch plate has a maximum deflection of 6mm.
I put this in CAD and also measured the actuals for the flywheel, installed clutch and bearing face and the faces of the bell housing.
By my calculations i will need 9mm extra length for the bearing to be at 12mm standoff. I will need to test this of course, but it will do for now:
£15.00 - 3mm Clutch Slave Shim - Evans and Sons
£15.00 - 6mm Clutch Slave Shim - Evans and Sons
£155.40 - HD Concentric Slave - MST
£46.20 - HD Release Bearing - MST
Fortunately I have some M6 fasteners already. But I did get a stock of schnorr washers:
£7.36 - M6 x 50 Schnorr Washers
£7.58 - M8 x 50 Schnorr Washers
£4.61 - M10 x 20 Schnorr Washers
The helix clutch plate has a maximum deflection of 6mm.
I put this in CAD and also measured the actuals for the flywheel, installed clutch and bearing face and the faces of the bell housing.
By my calculations i will need 9mm extra length for the bearing to be at 12mm standoff. I will need to test this of course, but it will do for now:
£15.00 - 3mm Clutch Slave Shim - Evans and Sons
£15.00 - 6mm Clutch Slave Shim - Evans and Sons
£155.40 - HD Concentric Slave - MST
£46.20 - HD Release Bearing - MST
Fortunately I have some M6 fasteners already. But I did get a stock of schnorr washers:
£7.36 - M6 x 50 Schnorr Washers
£7.58 - M8 x 50 Schnorr Washers
£4.61 - M10 x 20 Schnorr Washers
So that's where I left it, currently tucked up in the garage.
I sold the other escort while I was away so can get on with stripping it when I return, or do a few burn outs in the cossie on a private road somewhere.
The previous owner said it was a YBD block which is from an RS500, however the block says 200 so is thick walled at least. When looking for the ID iI tried to clean it up with a rag and a screwdriver and proceeded to pop the core plug, so that needs replacing when I'm home, so another 4.80.
Engine cosworth for sale, current spec incase anyone is interested:
200 Block
6 long studs (cosworth)
Standard crank
Mains 0.50 Bigs 0.25
7:5:1 Cut out pistons
Standard Rods
GT3071 Turbo
2WD manifold
85 degrees thermostat
Updated belt tensioner/ stay
Big wing sump
Head mildly polished inlet only
BD10 inlet, standard exhaust
Dual springs, hydraulic lifters
Vernier pulleys
14mm plenum spacer, on standard plenum
larger throttle body
83lbs Siemens black injectors
Anembo engineering fuel rail
Bailey dump valve
RS500 style intercooler
Burton Power Lightened flywheel
AP racing 6 paddle clutch
Alternator
Transit connect starter motor
Weber L8 custom chip mapped by PJ Motorsport
Engine loom brand new, aircraft wire
No lambda, closed loop map, but wideband monitor available
Electronic ignition, coil and all the bits
NGK BCR8ES spark plugs
HKS boost controller + turbo timer + boost solenoid
Various silicon hoses for water, intake and intercooler, vacuum, swirlpots, oil catch cans, turbo lines, air filter, jubilee clips, pipe clamps, etc. I believe there is also a pre turbo water cooler.
6250rpm standard cosworth limit
2500 miles since build (have MOT's)
Also have an uprated T5 cosworth gearbox, stronger gears, synchros and baulk rings, hydraulic clutch, standard bell housing. Still like new. Built by the gearboxman in London.
I think its worth a few quid to the right person, I'll probaby end up selling it in parts, that's usually the way. But it will fund some of the next purchases. or i can keep it for a future project as it is a decent engine.
I sold the other escort while I was away so can get on with stripping it when I return, or do a few burn outs in the cossie on a private road somewhere.
The previous owner said it was a YBD block which is from an RS500, however the block says 200 so is thick walled at least. When looking for the ID iI tried to clean it up with a rag and a screwdriver and proceeded to pop the core plug, so that needs replacing when I'm home, so another 4.80.
Engine cosworth for sale, current spec incase anyone is interested:
200 Block
6 long studs (cosworth)
Standard crank
Mains 0.50 Bigs 0.25
7:5:1 Cut out pistons
Standard Rods
GT3071 Turbo
2WD manifold
85 degrees thermostat
Updated belt tensioner/ stay
Big wing sump
Head mildly polished inlet only
BD10 inlet, standard exhaust
Dual springs, hydraulic lifters
Vernier pulleys
14mm plenum spacer, on standard plenum
larger throttle body
83lbs Siemens black injectors
Anembo engineering fuel rail
Bailey dump valve
RS500 style intercooler
Burton Power Lightened flywheel
AP racing 6 paddle clutch
Alternator
Transit connect starter motor
Weber L8 custom chip mapped by PJ Motorsport
Engine loom brand new, aircraft wire
No lambda, closed loop map, but wideband monitor available
Electronic ignition, coil and all the bits
NGK BCR8ES spark plugs
HKS boost controller + turbo timer + boost solenoid
Various silicon hoses for water, intake and intercooler, vacuum, swirlpots, oil catch cans, turbo lines, air filter, jubilee clips, pipe clamps, etc. I believe there is also a pre turbo water cooler.
6250rpm standard cosworth limit
2500 miles since build (have MOT's)
Also have an uprated T5 cosworth gearbox, stronger gears, synchros and baulk rings, hydraulic clutch, standard bell housing. Still like new. Built by the gearboxman in London.
I think its worth a few quid to the right person, I'll probaby end up selling it in parts, that's usually the way. But it will fund some of the next purchases. or i can keep it for a future project as it is a decent engine.
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