So, fitting bucket seats

[tertius]

markiii said:

So gt3 buckets waiting to go in my 997,

Genuine Porsche sliders ready,

Heavy duty brackets on the way

I can reuse the oem bolts to mount the runners to the floor but what rated bolts should I use to fasten runners to the brackets?

I have a bag full of (what I guess will be) the right bolts - PM me your address and I'll post you a few.

When I put buckets in my 993 I ended buying a bag of 100 ...

[markiii]

that would be fantastic thanks

I'll drop you a PM

[spyderman8]

Demon Tweaks have a number of Cobra seats on two-for-one, eg:

Cobra Imola Pro Fibreglass Seat - £562.50 + VAT
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/seats/cob...

Weight: 8kg each.

And, if it matters to you, the vast majority of both Sparco and Cobra seats are FIA approved.

Chris #88.

Edited by spyderman8 on Tuesday 29th January 15:21

[sundayjumper]

spyderman8 said:

Demon Tweaks have a number of Cobra seats on two-for-one...

two-for-one-and-a-half

[markiii]

for the record

11kgs for carbon seats + runners and brackets, 31kgs old seats + runners

[Gibbo205]

markiii said:

for the record

11kgs for carbon seats + runners and brackets, 31kgs old seats + runners

Is that per seat? What were your old seats, heated, adaptive and powered? Seems like a good weight saving!

[markiii]

comfort tombstones with only electric height and rake adjust

[Slippydiff]

markiii said:

for the record

11kgs for carbon seats + runners and brackets, 31kgs old seats + runners

I've quit posting on this forum to all intents and purposes, but when safety is involved, I feel I have to contribute.

The weight of your new seats will be the least of your worries should you have a "proper" shunt in them.
I did just that when I wrapped my Mk1 996 GT3 around a tree at the neck end of 70mph 18 months ago, I was lucky and walked away with two broken ribs (where they'd impacted the side of the genuine 996 GT3 seats)

I've no doubt whatsoever that had I been in one of the seats your about to fit, I'd either have been seriously injured or worse. And yes, I have studied the seats, and I've spoken with someone who fitted a pair to a car with a reputation far worse than yours. I've since told the owner of the car that he's risking his wellbeing every time he sits in them IMO.

I'll be totally frank with you, the bolts you use to fit the seats could be made out of chocolate, cheese, or cobalt/ chromium steel. It'll make no difference because the shell of the seat is weak and the attachment points for the side mounts a joke.

Not sure what you weigh, but if you should end up stopping quickly against a lampost, tree or crash barrier,due to an accident, consider the G forces involved, rest assured, you WILL regret scrimping on the cost/quality of your seats.

Of course, it's your choice, but ask yourself this, just how much do you value your health should the unthinkable ever happen ?

Edited by Slippydiff on Monday 11th February 19:55

[Zyp]

Slippydiff said:

I've quit posting on this forum to all intents and purposes, but when safety is involved, I feel I have to contribute.

The weight of your new seats will be the least of your worries should you have a "proper" shunt in them.
I did just that when I wrapped my Mk1 996 GT3 around a tree at the neck end of 70mph 18 months ago, I was lucky and walked away with two broken ribs (where they'd impacted the side of the genuine 996 GT3 seats)

I've no doubt whatsoever that had I been in one of the seats your about to fit, I'd either have been seriously injured or worse. And yes, I have studied the seats, and I've spoken with someone who fitted a pair to a car with a reputation far worse than yours. I've since told the owner of the car that he's risking his wellbeing every time he sits in them IMO.

I'll be totally frank with you, the bolts you use to fit could be made out of chocolate, cheese, or cobalt/ chromium steel. It'll make no difference because the shell of the seat is weak and the attachment points for the side mounts a joke.

Not sure what you weigh, but if you should end up stopping quickly against a lampost, tree, crash barrier,due to an accident, you WILL regret scrimping on the cost/quality of your seats.

Of course, it's your choice, but how much do you value your health should the unthinkable happen ?

Interesting post Slippy.

Is this because of the way the seat's made, the cheapness of the seat?

I had a heavy shunt in my Exige whilst sitting in the wafer thin Probax, and got off pretty lightly.

Can you expand just a wee bit more on your post please?

Thanks.

[FTW]

In the event of a crash the forces going through the seats are massive, the seat also holds you in place and therefore taking all the loading your body puts through it. The mounting points also take a lot of abuse in the event of a crash as well as the fixing.

I don't think the seats you are looking at are built to any specific safety standards unlike the original Porsche items or FIA bucket seats so who is to say they can withstand the loadings if the worst should happen.

I am about to fit some Bimarcos to the 986 S which are pretty cheap, fiberglass and FIA homologated.

I apologies if this is the same as telling your grandmother to suck eggs.

[Slippydiff]

Zyp said:

Interesting post Slippy.

Is this because of the way the seat's made, the cheapness of the seat?

I had a heavy shunt in my Exige whilst sitting in the wafer thin Probax, and got off pretty lightly.

Can you expand just a wee bit more on your post please?

Thanks.

There are lots of issues to consider, in the case of my accident, the car went off the road backwards at what I estimated was 70+mph, it flew through the air (rotating) down an embankment and hit a tree whilst airborne (low level by the time it impacted!) The force of the impact snapped the tree in two. The impact was a sideways and on the nearside.

Whilst the wheel and suspension took the brunt of the force initially, once they'd deformed/snapped (as the rear crossmember did) the bodyshell then took the majority of the impact. In the process the rear bulkhead deformed and buckled the opposite quarter panel outwards.

I was not wearing harnesses, only a seatbelt. The force of the impact and the speed of the de-acceleration shifted me sideways in the seat violently. The resulting coming together of my ribcage and the seat shell, broke two ribs.

Had I been in a comfort seat, I've no doubt my injuries would've been worse, but had I been in a seat that was not manufactured and tested to the standards of someone like Recaro or Cobra, I'm sure my injuries would've been worse still.

Of course, all this depends on the direction of travel the impact is sustained, back your car into a solid object at 50mph and you're totally reliant on the quality of your seat and it's mountings, do the same frontwards, and you'll be relying more heavily on your seat belt/harnesses than the seat.

In a sideways impact, you're heavily reliant on your seat and it's mountings.
My experience of the seats the OP is referring to indicated that the attachment points aren't up to the standard of the aformentioned manufacturers. IIRC the securing bolts went straight through the shell and (rather than having a threaded insert let into the actual moulding of the shell itself during the manufacturing process)

In the event of a high G impact, the fixing bolts, nuts and flat washers would most likely rip clean through the shell itself and leave the occupant flailing around inside the car (or worse still, outside the car)

I'd be asking the vendor if the seats meet the European standard for road car seats.
But irrspective of whether they do or they don't, I'd want FIA standard seats if I was upgrading the seats in a road car. Period.

If they've passed the FIA tests, you can be assured you've done all that's possible to preserve yourself in the event of a big shunt.

[mollytherocker]

A very useful post slippydiff and pretty sobering. Food for thought for anyone thinking of changing their seats.

I had never even considered that a club sport seat would be safer than a comfort seat in a GT3.

[Zyp]

Thanks.

I'd never even thought about the bolt/ fixings issue before.
Surely though, these seats can only be sold here if they have BS or TUV approved testing?

I think your mate Mrdemon alluded to the frailties of these types of seats earlier in the thread (or a different thread).

Edit - just read the beginning of the thread - my questions were already answered.

Edited by Zyp on Monday 11th February 20:58

[Slippydiff]

Crossmember :



Rear suspesnion :







Distorted O/S rear quarter (note "outdents" of spot welds)



Distorted rear bulkhead (note spot welds ripped apart)

[Slippydiff]

The above are self explanatory . . .

[FTW]

A solid 7.5/10 for that attempt slippy.

More work on the front end but the landing is solid.

I jest, never nice to see a fellow enthusiast involved in an accident.

[Slippydiff]

FTW said:

A solid 7.5/10 for that attempt slippy.

More work on the front end but the landing is solid.

I jest, never nice to see a fellow enthusiast involved in an accident.

Trust me, as it spun of the road backwards in the dark, it felt very much like a 10.

[Lagerlout]

Hmm. Pretty sure these are the same seats Ray West supplied to me for my Fiat Abarth. They seem pretty well made to me but I'll take another look when I get the car back. I was lead to believe these seats are made in Europe, can't recall where.

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0...

[Slippydiff]

Lagerlout said:

Hmm. Pretty sure these are the same seats Ray West supplied to me for my Fiat Abarth. They seem pretty well made to me but I'll take another look when I get the car back. I was lead to believe these seats are made in Europe, can't recall where.

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0...

A quick google search would seem to indicate there's a few companies making them now.

Cool Abarth BTW !

[Gibbo205]

Slippy

First things first, glad your still with us.

After your post, if I change the seats in my car I shall be stumping up the cash for some Porsche genuine GT2 or GT3 seats. Won't be messing about with any of this cheap seat stuff, simply as your post are spot on, its not worth risking lifes over.