Is the 993 next?
Discussion
ian_uk said:
The talk on this thread about low mileage cars is not applicable to the 90% of the 993s that are not.
Taking an average car; where will the 993 be in five or ten years time price wise compared to the 964 and 3.2. Will it be considered better and worth more or not? How about compared to the pre 74 cars currently riding high?
Ian.
As a 993-owner, with previous postings on desirability and high price on Continent compared to UK, I would say less than pre-impact bumper (rarity) and on a par or better than 964 and impact-bumper cars (Turbo excluded). It's a fast GT that soaks up the miles, but must be kept in good nick and will never appeal to the out-and-out speed merchants. It's also been owned by a certain type (because of that) who can afford to maintain a 993, which is either a plus or a minus depending on your opinion. Taking an average car; where will the 993 be in five or ten years time price wise compared to the 964 and 3.2. Will it be considered better and worth more or not? How about compared to the pre 74 cars currently riding high?
Ian.
When new, it was an expensive, company director's BMW/Merc alternative, too, hence blue/silver, many autos and typical older buyers. Except for David Beckham, of course. It also still looks 'new' to the uninitiated so you don't get the benefit of "I own a classic" if that's what you want.
Budget £3k a year to get a 85,000 mile 'good' £25k car in 2013 into top shape over 10 years at 5,000 miles a year with everything done. So, total outlay £55k for what will be a 135k miles example in 2023. I believe it will be worth more than that, and will have the benefit of more 'modern' driving, handling and comfort over that time.
What is low mileage on a 993?
On a regular mainstream car it's 12k per year.
Many ferraris are 1k per year.
My 993 has averaged less than 4k per year but has done 65k now. When I was looking to buy I considered sub 40k as low miles and cars with 60k plus as not particularly low miles at all, despite the age.
The problem with buying any ultra low miles sports car is the fear of devaluing it through use. You then fall into one of two positions- use it and don't worry about it or cherish and polish but don't use much if at all. If you adopt the second position, what's the point ? If you take the first position why buy low miles at a massive premium when you can get the same experience for thousands less?
I don't understand it myself, though I do try to use mine when I can.
None of these 911's are cheap to run. Because 993's hail from a period where you didn't need a lap top to service your car, many owners are empowered to work on these cars themselves. Many do this to a pretty high standard to boot. I think the 993 appeals to that sort of owner. I can't see many 997 owners opening the engine cover unless it's to show the nice OPC man that they know how to do it.
The 997 has 20k service intervals ( I think) so I guess most owners could save money in comparison to say a 993 in the short to medium term on service bills. However, the 993 is now largely depreciation prooff. If you have a tidy car, with sensible miles, it's not dropping much below £20k...ever. Due to comparative oversupply, where does depreciation end for a tidy 997?
My brother in law has a lovely gen 2 cab. I'd like one but I'm not wealthy enough to feel comfortable owning a car which is still doing hundreds of pounds a month, each month, in depreciation. Maybe they too bottom out at £30k if under 30k miles?
I've speculated before that the Gen 2 will be 'the next' 993. Classic looks, no engine reliability issues and made for a relatively brief period. The 993 was 1994-1997. Gen 2 was what late 2008 to 2011?
I really like my 993, though it's not the best drivers car I ever owned. That said, I wouldn't like to be parted from it, which is why I've owned it 4 years, longer than I've owned anything over the past 25 years.
I do think the price parity point is interesting. 997 Gen 2', 997 S Gen 1' 993' 996 turbo, Gt3' 964 C2...given similar mileage and condition how long till you have the choice of all for around £30k or has that dY arrived ?
On a regular mainstream car it's 12k per year.
Many ferraris are 1k per year.
My 993 has averaged less than 4k per year but has done 65k now. When I was looking to buy I considered sub 40k as low miles and cars with 60k plus as not particularly low miles at all, despite the age.
The problem with buying any ultra low miles sports car is the fear of devaluing it through use. You then fall into one of two positions- use it and don't worry about it or cherish and polish but don't use much if at all. If you adopt the second position, what's the point ? If you take the first position why buy low miles at a massive premium when you can get the same experience for thousands less?
I don't understand it myself, though I do try to use mine when I can.
None of these 911's are cheap to run. Because 993's hail from a period where you didn't need a lap top to service your car, many owners are empowered to work on these cars themselves. Many do this to a pretty high standard to boot. I think the 993 appeals to that sort of owner. I can't see many 997 owners opening the engine cover unless it's to show the nice OPC man that they know how to do it.
The 997 has 20k service intervals ( I think) so I guess most owners could save money in comparison to say a 993 in the short to medium term on service bills. However, the 993 is now largely depreciation prooff. If you have a tidy car, with sensible miles, it's not dropping much below £20k...ever. Due to comparative oversupply, where does depreciation end for a tidy 997?
My brother in law has a lovely gen 2 cab. I'd like one but I'm not wealthy enough to feel comfortable owning a car which is still doing hundreds of pounds a month, each month, in depreciation. Maybe they too bottom out at £30k if under 30k miles?
I've speculated before that the Gen 2 will be 'the next' 993. Classic looks, no engine reliability issues and made for a relatively brief period. The 993 was 1994-1997. Gen 2 was what late 2008 to 2011?
I really like my 993, though it's not the best drivers car I ever owned. That said, I wouldn't like to be parted from it, which is why I've owned it 4 years, longer than I've owned anything over the past 25 years.
I do think the price parity point is interesting. 997 Gen 2', 997 S Gen 1' 993' 996 turbo, Gt3' 964 C2...given similar mileage and condition how long till you have the choice of all for around £30k or has that dY arrived ?
highway said:
The wing on that GT2 detracts from the understated looks of the base car. Personally, I'm no lover of the rivets into the arches either. These cars do as much for me as Imprezas and Evos, which is nothing.
Its not pretty, I grant you that, but my god its just harder than a hard thing! Like The Hulk getting angry!
Edited by mollytherocker on Wednesday 16th October 21:24
Wozy68 said:
mollytherocker said:
Its not pretty, I grant you that, but my god its just harder than a hard thing! Like The Hulk getting angry!
I'm not keen on the 993 in red ........... but that looks looooooovely . When I win the lotto I'll have two, one in red and one in MBM
I'm a bit partial to a 993 GT2.I'm not keen on the 993 in red ........... but that looks looooooovely . When I win the lotto I'll have two, one in red and one in MBM
Unfortunately my wallet isn't.
,you are.
highway said:
The wing on that GT2 detracts from the understated looks of the base car. Personally, I'm no lover of the rivets into the arches either. These cars do as much for me as Imprezas and Evos, which is nothing.
As they say. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Personally I don't find the narrow bodied 993 a particularly good looking 911. Take a narrow bodied 964 running RS ride height, 17" cup 1's and teardrop mirrors it knocks it into a cocked hat. The 993 C2S and C4S IMO opinion look better with their turbo haunches. The 993 turbo does not do it for me. Always looked like the rear whale tail had started to melt. For me the 911GT or GT2 is the daddy. Not that it makes any difference but the arches are held on with double sided tape and stainless steel allen bolts. I love the look and the beautifully sculptured speedline wheels.But the great thing about these cars is that when you sit behind the wheel be it a 993 C2 or a 993 GT2 they fit like a comfortable pair of slippers. The only difference is the level of performance. I really liked my other halfs C2S tip. A far more relaxing drive than the GT2. The flip side was in the time it took the S to get to 70 you would be well over double that in the GT2. Sadly in truth the C2S was the more useable car
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