Cheap Tyres: Nankang etc etc
Discussion
OK. So I'm doing some thinking. I do track days - and the ongoing condition of my tyres certainly reflects this. My current strategy has been to fit the car with Michelin Pilot Sport tyres.
They're good. Very good. They wear very well considering the punishment. They grip well. They're good in the wet and good in the dry. But, boy, does one pay for the privelige!
So this got me to thinking. I preferred the Michelin's to the Pirelli's I had on my last car...but *really* by how much????
So I'm thinking of two possible sets of replacements:
1) An all round set of Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tyres. (Anyone know what to pay??) I know they're supposed to be rubbish in the wet - but on dry track days I'll have fun with the extra grip. This is the expensive strategy as they won't last and they'll be as much as the regular Michelins.
2) Fit a set of Nankang tyres. Oh
. These are dirt cheap. About a third of the cost of Michelins/Pirellis etc.
Now I'm not expecting the same performance as the Michelins. I'm expecting the tyres to be *not too bad*. Lap times are relative on track days as one isn't racing and I can TRASH THREE SETS for the cost of the Cup tyres!
I know its an experiment.
Should I?
Has anyone else gone down a similar route? I'm not talking Colway remoulds here...these are new tyres - just made in Taiwan?
They're good. Very good. They wear very well considering the punishment. They grip well. They're good in the wet and good in the dry. But, boy, does one pay for the privelige!
So this got me to thinking. I preferred the Michelin's to the Pirelli's I had on my last car...but *really* by how much????
So I'm thinking of two possible sets of replacements:
1) An all round set of Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tyres. (Anyone know what to pay??) I know they're supposed to be rubbish in the wet - but on dry track days I'll have fun with the extra grip. This is the expensive strategy as they won't last and they'll be as much as the regular Michelins.
2) Fit a set of Nankang tyres. Oh
. These are dirt cheap. About a third of the cost of Michelins/Pirellis etc. Now I'm not expecting the same performance as the Michelins. I'm expecting the tyres to be *not too bad*. Lap times are relative on track days as one isn't racing and I can TRASH THREE SETS for the cost of the Cup tyres!
I know its an experiment.
Should I?
Has anyone else gone down a similar route? I'm not talking Colway remoulds here...these are new tyres - just made in Taiwan?
Don,
With a mid engined car that's famous for handling balance i think you're in a better position to try this than those of us who "push from behind the rear axle line".
Hey, i had some of the best car fun ever in a Capri on Colways. May not be quick, but because they slid so easily i really got to know how the car behaved when it let go.
VS
With a mid engined car that's famous for handling balance i think you're in a better position to try this than those of us who "push from behind the rear axle line".
Hey, i had some of the best car fun ever in a Capri on Colways. May not be quick, but because they slid so easily i really got to know how the car behaved when it let go.
VS
Don, price up Toyo Proxies T1 S or R,(R replaced S & is rated superior) standard fit on TVR I think & very well rated on other cars, way way cheaper than Mich too. These are perhaps you best bet.
Also & i dunno if you can get those in your size, but a mate imports jap stuff like Scoobys etc & he swears by Khumos (extasa I think) even on the higher powered Scoobydoo Impretzel STd type wagons & he rates them, soft wearing but grippy he says.
I was driving a bimmer with 'em on last week & were good, leauges above the bakalite slip-slidey-tastic Pirelli p6000s they replaced.
A Lizard fave- & again dunno if you can get these in your size, is Yokahama A539, cheap but decent (£160 a set fitted! but thats not quite for your sizes tho!) & i've used em for years on road cars (3 car in the current fleet have them on now!) & I had a just about legal set that I bunged on my Golf track car thinking a single track day would see the set out & I could bung on my 2nd hand Mich cup tyres.
However 4 track days & a sprint event later & the feckers still won't wear out & its not like I don't push them hard!
& the cups are still sat in the garage! & the yokos still have a bit of life left in them they are a great tyre for dry tracks when worn, not too sqealy & progresive slides & fine in pouring rain when newer.
Also bit more pricey but should be avail in your size in Yokahama AVS.
For track work, new Toyo 888 track tyre is geting good reports= looks a bit like a Dunlop Formula R tyre (not heard on any on porkers yet tho) way cheaper than cups- well they are in the smaller sizes anyway or what about those Dunlops supersport jobbies that lots of guys on here are useing?
Also & i dunno if you can get those in your size, but a mate imports jap stuff like Scoobys etc & he swears by Khumos (extasa I think) even on the higher powered Scoobydoo Impretzel STd type wagons & he rates them, soft wearing but grippy he says.
I was driving a bimmer with 'em on last week & were good, leauges above the bakalite slip-slidey-tastic Pirelli p6000s they replaced.
A Lizard fave- & again dunno if you can get these in your size, is Yokahama A539, cheap but decent (£160 a set fitted! but thats not quite for your sizes tho!) & i've used em for years on road cars (3 car in the current fleet have them on now!) & I had a just about legal set that I bunged on my Golf track car thinking a single track day would see the set out & I could bung on my 2nd hand Mich cup tyres.
However 4 track days & a sprint event later & the feckers still won't wear out & its not like I don't push them hard!
& the cups are still sat in the garage! & the yokos still have a bit of life left in them they are a great tyre for dry tracks when worn, not too sqealy & progresive slides & fine in pouring rain when newer. Also bit more pricey but should be avail in your size in Yokahama AVS.
For track work, new Toyo 888 track tyre is geting good reports= looks a bit like a Dunlop Formula R tyre (not heard on any on porkers yet tho) way cheaper than cups- well they are in the smaller sizes anyway or what about those Dunlops supersport jobbies that lots of guys on here are useing?
Ta for the thoughts, chaps.
BTW: I can get these Nankangs (or Kumhos) off of www.mytyres.co.uk
Anyone used 'em? They are CHEAP!
BUT - their prices don't include fitting so one will need to visit someone who can do the job (in my case with wife in tow driving the Vectra with the new tyres in it!
) . Does anyone have any experience of doing this - particularly in the Hampshire area...
Of course I could always call Micheldever and beat 'em up on the price of whatever's cheapest!
BTW: I can get these Nankangs (or Kumhos) off of www.mytyres.co.uk
Anyone used 'em? They are CHEAP!
BUT - their prices don't include fitting so one will need to visit someone who can do the job (in my case with wife in tow driving the Vectra with the new tyres in it!
) . Does anyone have any experience of doing this - particularly in the Hampshire area... Of course I could always call Micheldever and beat 'em up on the price of whatever's cheapest!
iguana said:
Don, price up Toyo Proxies T1 S or R,(R replaced S & is rated superior) standard fit on TVR I think & very well rated on other cars, way way cheaper than Mich too. These are perhaps you best bet.
Good thinking, sir. At mytyres these are £140 vs £240 for the Michelin's.
Damn - I really like the Pilot Sport tyres - but given that they recieve something of a battering at my hands I've got to think seriously about tyres I can trash...
Don, I've used www.mytyres.co.uk on several occassions for tyres for my Audi quattro. I get them delivered straight to National Tyres who put them on for £9 per tyre. The tyres are delivered direct from Germany and take about a week or so to arrive. Never had any problems so far.
Don I know a man in a little shed (literally!) in Thatcham who sells 2nd hand tyres & if you take tyres to him he will fit tyres for you & fit em to ya car too- hes swapped round my slicks & other tyres on various wheels etc lots cheaper than a big place too.
Think Headly tyres on the A339 will fit tyres you take them- best call to check tho- more expensive than the man in the shed tho!
Micheldever don't seem to be as competitive on tyre prices as they used to be years back tho.
Think Headly tyres on the A339 will fit tyres you take them- best call to check tho- more expensive than the man in the shed tho!
Micheldever don't seem to be as competitive on tyre prices as they used to be years back tho.
Have run both Nankangs and Kumhos on previous cars; Nankangs on an Intergrale and Kumhos on a VW Corrado. Both set were on the cars when I bought them.
The Nankangs weren't terribly good, got loads of wash out understeer and they wore really quickly as a result. The Kumhos were far better and I'd be quite happy to buy them again as an alternative to a premier brand tyre (eg Michelin, Pirelli, Conti, etc).
The Nankangs weren't terribly good, got loads of wash out understeer and they wore really quickly as a result. The Kumhos were far better and I'd be quite happy to buy them again as an alternative to a premier brand tyre (eg Michelin, Pirelli, Conti, etc).
Fitting cheap crappy tyres to your car then going off to do trackdays is an utter waste of time and money. You might as well go the whole hog and ditch the Porker in favour of a Ford Focus or similar, after all they both have 4 wheels and a steering wheel.
The Pilot Sport cup tyres are a very specialised tyre designed solely for race track use, (they happen to be road legal to make it easier to get to and from trackdays). They allow every bit of the suspension on your car to be used to it`s full extent and to do it`s job properly.
Fitting rubbish to your wheels is like spending £1,500 on a reasonable Hi Fi system then gone down to Woolworths for some speakers.
Do not confuse the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tyres with normal Piolt Sports. They are a totally different tyre.
If you want to experiment (and there are plenty of options out there), make sure you are buying a track / race tyre. The Dunlops for instance seem to be excellent value al the moment.
Henry
The Pilot Sport cup tyres are a very specialised tyre designed solely for race track use, (they happen to be road legal to make it easier to get to and from trackdays). They allow every bit of the suspension on your car to be used to it`s full extent and to do it`s job properly.
Fitting rubbish to your wheels is like spending £1,500 on a reasonable Hi Fi system then gone down to Woolworths for some speakers.
Do not confuse the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tyres with normal Piolt Sports. They are a totally different tyre.
If you want to experiment (and there are plenty of options out there), make sure you are buying a track / race tyre. The Dunlops for instance seem to be excellent value al the moment.
Henry
Henry-F said:
Fitting cheap crappy tyres to your car then going off to do trackdays is an utter waste of time and money. You might as well go the whole hog and ditch the Porker in favour of a Ford Focus or similar, after all they both have 4 wheels and a steering wheel.
Well that told me!
Henry-F said:
The Pilot Sport cup tyres are a very specialised tyre designed solely for race track use, (they happen to be road legal to make it easier to get to and from trackdays). They allow every bit of the suspension on your car to be used to it`s full extent and to do it`s job properly.
Interesting. I asked a Michelin guy at the Festival whether or not I could get away with using Cup tyres as an everyday tyre - his response was: "Well...OK...but don't go out on wet days..." Sounds about right to me. I could almost do exactly that as the car is purely for entertainment - other than the days it pisses down on the way to the track...
Henry-F said:
Fitting rubbish to your wheels is like spending £1,500 on a reasonable Hi Fi system then gone down to Woolworths for some speakers.
Very true. I don't want to fit rubbish. I just don't want to pay through the nose for tyres I will trash if I don't have to. Don't get me wrong - I like Michelin tyres and prefer them to most other "premium" brands in my experience so far...its just that £900 for all four corners (when it happens on a regular basis) makes the teeth itch somewhat...when I know I could get something nearly as good for half the money...
Henry-F said:
Do not confuse the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tyres with normal Piolt Sports. They are a totally different tyre.
I'm not. I have used the road tyre Pilot Sport for some years now. I have never tried the Cup tyres - it would be an experiment for me to see if they're "worth" it...
Henry-F said:
If you want to experiment (and there are plenty of options out there), make sure you are buying a track / race tyre. The Dunlops for instance seem to be excellent value al the moment.
Henry
Hmmmn. Another option! If one were to use the Dunlop track day tyres - would be similarly unwise to try and use them every day? Probably.... choices choices
Don said:
Ta for the thoughts, chaps.
BTW: I can get these Nankangs (or Kumhos) off of www.mytyres.co.uk
Anyone used 'em? They are CHEAP!
I've had a [186mph rated?] nankang explode at almost 100mph recently on my M5, other that that they were surprising good tyre providing loads of grip in the dry, nice stiff sidewall compared to Goodyear F1's [absolutely hate them], i'm guessing kumos would be similar, I probably damaged or cut mine while powersliding and generally acting the cock [as that what they were bought for] so I wouldn't let it turn you off buying them for trackdays etc.
ive got kumho v70 ecstas on my integra and they are awesome, but they are not that cheap in the sizes required for 911s.
As for the Dunlops, I got a set of SSRs fitted for £450 on my gt3. recently. They are brilliant track tyres and only slightly slower than Mich cups around most circuits..
Didnt know Nankang did track tyres.>>>?>?
As for the Dunlops, I got a set of SSRs fitted for £450 on my gt3. recently. They are brilliant track tyres and only slightly slower than Mich cups around most circuits..
Didnt know Nankang did track tyres.>>>?>?
Michelin pilot sport cups actually last quite a long time. I can trash a set of road tyres in one day but because the MPSCs don't overheat I'll get 10-12 days. I've never actually worn them through to the cords as they seem to get harder with every heat cycle.
Dunlop DO1Js come with far more tread in the first place (IIRC 9mm) and wear at a slightly faster rate but I'm expecting about 10 days from the set I have on. They are a couple of hundred £s cheaper than MPSCs.
Dunlop DO1Js come with far more tread in the first place (IIRC 9mm) and wear at a slightly faster rate but I'm expecting about 10 days from the set I have on. They are a couple of hundred £s cheaper than MPSCs.
Except that the Khumos people fit to their road cars are just standard road tyres, not khumo`s track version.
The cheapest way to run track tyres is to get two sets of wheels. Fit your pilot s/c or Dunlop (D-01 may not be available anymore although they were excellent with big stable tread blocks), track tyres to one set. Fit good road tyres to another. That way you get better rubber for the road, (road tyres are more stable throughout temperature ranges and road conditions), not only that but they will probably be half the price and last 4 times as long on the road.
By running your track tyres on the road you are putting them through more heat cycles (and once they`ve done 3 or 4 cycles they are going downhill fast). You also have a less safe car on the road. When we use track tyres we also adjust the car for prevailing conditions but for you to pull into the services and adjust roll bars, ride height, low speed bump, rebound and tyre pressures everytime it starts to rain is a tad impractical !
Henry
The cheapest way to run track tyres is to get two sets of wheels. Fit your pilot s/c or Dunlop (D-01 may not be available anymore although they were excellent with big stable tread blocks), track tyres to one set. Fit good road tyres to another. That way you get better rubber for the road, (road tyres are more stable throughout temperature ranges and road conditions), not only that but they will probably be half the price and last 4 times as long on the road.
By running your track tyres on the road you are putting them through more heat cycles (and once they`ve done 3 or 4 cycles they are going downhill fast). You also have a less safe car on the road. When we use track tyres we also adjust the car for prevailing conditions but for you to pull into the services and adjust roll bars, ride height, low speed bump, rebound and tyre pressures everytime it starts to rain is a tad impractical !
Henry
iguana said:I've used him to for part worns and he's a top bloke. Never occured to me that he'd fit new mail order tyres too... how much does he charge for that Alex?
Don I know a man in a little shed (literally!) in Thatcham who sells 2nd hand tyres & if you take tyres to him he will fit tyres for you & fit em to ya car too- hes swapped round my slicks & other tyres on various wheels etc lots cheaper than a big place too.
Mark
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