Driver training - who's the daddy?
Discussion
So I'm thinking of doing some training in the new year, since I'm still a little wary of the 911 having previously thrown the elise around with gay abandon.
I've done some homework and read threads, and this isn't a basic 'how do i get training?' question, but I'd be interested in what people think of the relative merits of these guys...
Don Palmer
Jeremy Edwards at Drivetrain
John Lyons HPC
Rob Gravett
Any comments appreciated, and hopefully it'll be useful to others too...
I've done some homework and read threads, and this isn't a basic 'how do i get training?' question, but I'd be interested in what people think of the relative merits of these guys...
Don Palmer
Jeremy Edwards at Drivetrain
John Lyons HPC
Rob Gravett
Any comments appreciated, and hopefully it'll be useful to others too...
If you haven't ever done any training then any training will be beneficial. I've used Don Palmer twice - he's a driving god, but like different people get on better with different personalities so the only way you'll know is to try.
Don't think that one session will ever be enough though!
Don't think that one session will ever be enough though!
Don Palmer - good limit handling coaching (also consider www.carlimits.com - covers material slightly differently so both are good).
John Lyon - apparently one of the best roadcraft instructors, some find him a bit hard to get on with (he is ex-military, you probably know the type). I plan to use him in the near future. Also consider www.cadence.co.uk for roadcraft instruction, I found them very impressive.
Dunno about the others. Of note is that both Don Palmer, and Cadence act as gate keepers to the HPC (John used to, but had a falling out).
markxw said:
What about that Bernard Aubry guy too? I'm interested basically on at the limit and general track driving a bit more than roadcraft, though that's useful too...
I wouldn't underestimate the value of roadcraft. I'd focussed on limit handling and wish I'd done a bit more road craft earlier on now. Just one roadcraft lesson and I'm considerably safer and quicker on the road.
In answer to your question though, train with all of them! Learning limit handling takes a lot of instruction and a lot of wheel time, so no point worrying too much who you pick first off - you'll be doing a lot more lessons afterwards if you want to get good.
www.carlimits.com comes highly recommended - I have done 3 days there and have learnt a lot each time.
Rufus said:
You're missing Andy Walsh... Mike Franey...
It all depends on what you want to do.... Road or track?
Andy Walsh = www.carlimits.com
Andy Walsh IS Carlimits.....
I have done a sesh with Don Palmer... incidentally during the day Mike Franey turned up and I let him have a blast in my car. Kin ell! Wot a wheel man.
And I have done two sessions with Andy Carlimits Walsh.
Both concentrated on car handling and the physics of what the car was trying to do and how the driver can affect the physics with steering input, brake and throttle balance.
That means bugger all about road signs, wet leaves and milkfloats round the corner and all about smokin' tyres, spins and glowin' brakes.
I, like you, did a bit of research and Andy/Don were the limit handling/track biased higher reccomendations. So I tried both. They have very different styles but basically deliver the same message. Andy did seem to get on with things a bit more and is about half the cost.
I thoroughly reccomend either and would suggest you try them both and see how you get on.
I have done a sesh with Don Palmer... incidentally during the day Mike Franey turned up and I let him have a blast in my car. Kin ell! Wot a wheel man.
And I have done two sessions with Andy Carlimits Walsh.
Both concentrated on car handling and the physics of what the car was trying to do and how the driver can affect the physics with steering input, brake and throttle balance.
That means bugger all about road signs, wet leaves and milkfloats round the corner and all about smokin' tyres, spins and glowin' brakes.
I, like you, did a bit of research and Andy/Don were the limit handling/track biased higher reccomendations. So I tried both. They have very different styles but basically deliver the same message. Andy did seem to get on with things a bit more and is about half the cost.
I thoroughly reccomend either and would suggest you try them both and see how you get on.
Rufus said:
... Mike Franey...
An incredibly skillful driver, a great instructor, a former international racer and a truly good guy.
With no disrespect to the others mentioned above, (except for one, whom I wouldn't touch with a bargepole),
if you're serious about your road driving, Mike is THE man.
flemke said:
... Mike Franey...
An incredibly skillful driver, a great instructor, a former international racer and a truly good guy.
With no disrespect to the others mentioned above, (except for one, whom I wouldn't touch with a bargepole),
if you're serious about your road driving, Mike is THE man.
Do you have contact or website details?
Dan
Probably one the most respected race driver coaches is Rob Wilson.
He is contracted to a number of F1 teams and raced for Cirtek this year.
I don' have his number handy, but if you called Cirtek 01455 841741, they will give you it.
A super guy with a sensible approach to his work and Invoicing..!
Enjoy..!
Graham
He is contracted to a number of F1 teams and raced for Cirtek this year.
I don' have his number handy, but if you called Cirtek 01455 841741, they will give you it.
A super guy with a sensible approach to his work and Invoicing..!
Enjoy..!
Graham
Rob Wilson is simply the best guy - full stop
Kimi, Nigel, DC, me - have all been scared sh**less whist sitting next to Mr Wilson
What the guy can do with a car is amazing and what's more how he then imparts that knowledge to you
Btw he does tend to hit you if you don't do what he says
Kimi, Nigel, DC, me - have all been scared sh**less whist sitting next to Mr Wilson
What the guy can do with a car is amazing and what's more how he then imparts that knowledge to you
Btw he does tend to hit you if you don't do what he says
Mark,
Bernard A. is a roadcraft guy.
As woof says, Rob W. is strictly a circuit man. Having spent some time with him myself, I would say that what Rob has to teach to his several students who are current Formula One drivers is not necessarily what most of us on PH need. He has some good tips to offer, but IMHO you need to spend a lot of time with him in order to absorb his system and make it work for you. For example, he told me that in '04, X (a world-famous F1 driver) did 600 laps of Bruntingthorpe with him.
If you only want circuit driving, then Rob or John Bussell could be quite good. If you or anyone else wants a mixture of road driving and car control, then I would go with Mike F.
Bernard A. is a roadcraft guy.
As woof says, Rob W. is strictly a circuit man. Having spent some time with him myself, I would say that what Rob has to teach to his several students who are current Formula One drivers is not necessarily what most of us on PH need. He has some good tips to offer, but IMHO you need to spend a lot of time with him in order to absorb his system and make it work for you. For example, he told me that in '04, X (a world-famous F1 driver) did 600 laps of Bruntingthorpe with him.
If you only want circuit driving, then Rob or John Bussell could be quite good. If you or anyone else wants a mixture of road driving and car control, then I would go with Mike F.
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