RE: GT-R Laps 'Ring In 7min 30secs

[ZeeTacoe]

M400 NBL said:

Any pics of your Bugatti?

nope. that is only there to prove that what is put in these profiles isn't always true.

[housemaster]

Baddie said:

housemaster said:

Lets wait and see, both sides of this argument are simply conjecture, NO ONE contributing to this thread knows the FACTS about the test times, no point trying to construct reasons why it must be wrong or right if you ask me, it will all come out in the wash. On paper it seems and amazing achievement. For me a car is much more than paper, my RS4 bores me to death and paper was telling me how fantastic it was as many owners and fanboys keep trying to convince me.

Because a car laps the Ring in time X means nothing outside the pub in real terms...

"My RS4 bores me to death" is one of the more interesting things I've read on a car forum for some time.

I have only read about the RS4 and it sounds extremely competent next to current BM/Merc, and may even provoke affection on account of its fabulous engine. I have driven older Audi S4's and S3's that left me very impressed, but very very unmoved. Neither car had anything to do with me. It's like paying for a very beautiful escort who smiles for the benefit of onlookers, and you know you should be pleased they're on your arm, but actually its all a bit false.

I recently sold an E39 Sport 530i. Fabulous car in every objective sense but dull enough to explode your head, unless you were driving fit to have an accident.

My (second) E34 M5 however.... Today I decided to nail it out of every T-junction just because the roads were a bit damp, and the way the tail slewed gracefully around into perfect alignment reminded me what a genuine flatterer this car is. It's not a false laugh at my jokes, it's genuinely comfortable with my ham-fistedness, it's suave enough mechnical company to make me feel like Schumacher or Alesi, it's a Countess of performance cars. Apparently it's well over a minute slower than a Veyron or a GT3 around the 'Ring.

Mine is the face of concern...

Edited by Baddie on Friday 2nd May 23:57

"I have driven older Audi S4's and S3's that left me very impressed, but very very unmoved."

And that sums up the RS4 for me. It is a great road car, let me be very clear about that and amazing at getting you from A to B but it is perhaps to competent and for me this is why I find it boring. No question its quick, no question is capable, but it does what it does with a numbness that leaves me cold.

[Baddie]

housemaster said:

Baddie said:

housemaster said:

Lets wait and see, both sides of this argument are simply conjecture, NO ONE contributing to this thread knows the FACTS about the test times, no point trying to construct reasons why it must be wrong or right if you ask me, it will all come out in the wash. On paper it seems and amazing achievement. For me a car is much more than paper, my RS4 bores me to death and paper was telling me how fantastic it was as many owners and fanboys keep trying to convince me.

Because a car laps the Ring in time X means nothing outside the pub in real terms...

"My RS4 bores me to death" is one of the more interesting things I've read on a car forum for some time.

I have only read about the RS4 and it sounds extremely competent next to current BM/Merc, and may even provoke affection on account of its fabulous engine. I have driven older Audi S4's and S3's that left me very impressed, but very very unmoved. Neither car had anything to do with me. It's like paying for a very beautiful escort who smiles for the benefit of onlookers, and you know you should be pleased they're on your arm, but actually its all a bit false.

I recently sold an E39 Sport 530i. Fabulous car in every objective sense but dull enough to explode your head, unless you were driving fit to have an accident.

My (second) E34 M5 however.... Today I decided to nail it out of every T-junction just because the roads were a bit damp, and the way the tail slewed gracefully around into perfect alignment reminded me what a genuine flatterer this car is. It's not a false laugh at my jokes, it's genuinely comfortable with my ham-fistedness, it's suave enough mechnical company to make me feel like Schumacher or Alesi, it's a Countess of performance cars. Apparently it's well over a minute slower than a Veyron or a GT3 around the 'Ring.

Mine is the face of concern...

Edited by Baddie on Friday 2nd May 23:57

"I have driven older Audi S4's and S3's that left me very impressed, but very very unmoved."

And that sums up the RS4 for me. It is a great road car, let me be very clear about that and amazing at getting you from A to B but it is perhaps to competent and for me this is why I find it boring. No question its quick, no question is capable, but it does what it does with a numbness that leaves me cold.

Exactly. Even fairly ordinary new cars are so capable of pulling the numbers, but at the same time so proficient at supressing NVH and driver-induced oversteer they suppress the driver too. I drove an S4 some years ago now but even then it had a turbo V6 engine that could pull from 1500 to 7000 rpm with an almost flat delivery and a quattro system that always got the power down. My mate got bored of it though in less than a year and bought an Elise. He then got bored of the Elsie's noise and build and bought an M Coupe - he's happy now.

I have no doubt the GTR is an amazing achievement, can handle transients like nothing else, and may even teach Porsche a lesson here or there. It just does not appeal to me. If I drove one quickly and smoothly down a good road does that have anything at all to do with what I'm doing? Absolutely not. Is the car going that fast because its a phenomenal piece of technology? Yes. Does fast in itself equal driving pleasure? I used to get huge thrills from opposite-locking round wet roundabouts at less than 15 mph in an old Land Rover on crossply off road tyres. I felt like Sainz or Mikola.

Rally cars, Audis, and the GTR are weapons, as much as the Bentley Le Mans car (that thing looks violent even at a standstill) in that they are there to get a job done, not to entertain. They bludgeon tarmac into submission through deployment of shock and awe. But the toys take precedence over the pilot. I once drove a 1974 308GT4 with incredible natural poise and soulful steering, I've driven a 1968 E-type that made you feel like Hill, but I do not have the ability to make a GTR dance on a public road. My E34 M5 on the other hand...

The Audis are more competent all weather cars, but I really don't lust after one.

I'm a GTR fan, big time, but to admire it with someone else behind the wheel.

Edited by Baddie on Sunday 4th May 23:01

Edited by Baddie on Sunday 4th May 23:08

[Trommel]

I see Sutcliffe in Autocar is in league with the pub-chat brigade, claiming the car was on slicks or similar.

[Godzilla]

I'm amazed he can get away with that. Don't think he's going to be on Nissan's Christmas card list this year!

I know Dirk Schoysman who ran the 7:59 and IIRC he said the car was "derestricted" to about 350hp but was otherwise standard.

[Trommel]

Godzilla said:

I know Dirk Schoysman who ran the 7:59 and IIRC he said the car was "derestricted" to about 350hp but was otherwise standard.

That R33 didn't have standard tyres either. That means, down the pub, that it was a farsand beehaitchpee and was carbon fibrous with F1 spoilers, just like this new one at the Nuremburger is like. Cheating Japs innit.

[Trommel]

From the horse's mouth:

http://www.drivers-republic.com/news/news_article_14_05_08.cfm 

[Maxwedge]

Tadge J. Juechter, Corvette's chief engineer, announced this morning that Jim Mero, GM's development engineer, drove the ZR1 around the Nurburgring in 7:26.4