McLaren 12c not selling?
Discussion
mpbcs said:
I was planning on not taking the wife out in the car as I get awful earache on those occasions!
Don't as she will just nag and say its too fast, noisy and hard to get in and out.Also when I was looking at those cars the dark grey was 5k more than the ice silver one.
Looking at the website both cars have had the upgrade done now so at least now you will be able to know where you are going
Chrism355 said:
The main issue with the MP4 is indeed no predecessor and that Mclaren had no PR department to promote the car, in their arrogance they thought they could do a better job, just look how well the spider has been promoted by the press, the car is indeed a great car but needs help finding its foothold in the market a fact the new PR company understand and are showing Mclaren how to do this.
The MP4 does not need the ccb's as the air brake gives a much better brake balance to the car
I just don't think they have got this right yet with the PR. also Sone obviously found their customer services was poor also. The MP4 does not need the ccb's as the air brake gives a much better brake balance to the car
Must say I agree, although the carbon brakes are not needed, they are a nice piece of kit sitting behind the wheels. It has a carbon tub so why not treat it to a nice set of carbon brakes
I read somewhere that they are changing the design of the front bumper???
I count myself lucky - I 'only' lost £59,450 on my MP4 when I sold it three months ago for export. Had it stayed in the UK I would have expected to see another £10k added to that depreciation figure.
My car was one of the very first to be made and delivered so was exactly 1 year old when sold, but if I were selling it now I would be happy to get £130k for it.
I would have kept the car had it not spent more time being repaired than driven! (Shame, as when I did drive it it was a fab car).
As for new prices v 458, at the time (last year) my MP4 was £6k dearer than the 458 coupe I spec'ed with same equipment, mainly due to CCB being standard on 458. Servicing added another £1k in my ownership time, which is FOC on the 458.
My car was one of the very first to be made and delivered so was exactly 1 year old when sold, but if I were selling it now I would be happy to get £130k for it.
I would have kept the car had it not spent more time being repaired than driven! (Shame, as when I did drive it it was a fab car).
As for new prices v 458, at the time (last year) my MP4 was £6k dearer than the 458 coupe I spec'ed with same equipment, mainly due to CCB being standard on 458. Servicing added another £1k in my ownership time, which is FOC on the 458.
mpbcs said:
It would be good if they upgraded the front end to look like the 'HS' and then gave that as a free upgrade!! Even if they didn't I'd be tempted to pay for the better looking front end.
If you get the car, ask Mclaren to fish out the MSO brochure and get a quote on the HS front bumper. Might be a bit optimistic to get that as a free upgrade though...Would say rybrook and london had some cars that were, let's just say, somewhat optimistically priced earlier in the year. Romans for example had a black car around september that was listed at 8k below a fairly similar spec rybrook car. Not that it stopped that particular rybrook car from getting shifted fairly swiftly however if I'm not wrong.
red_duke said:
Maff said:
I count myself lucky - I 'only' lost £59,450 on my MP4 when I sold it three months ago for export.
Does this indicate anyone buying an early 12C with the intention of flipping it for a profit got a shock? I think it is tough for many car manufacturers right now, let alone one new-ish to road car production. On that note, does anyone know if unit production is down significantly, comparing F430 and 458 production like for like?
baileyconstruct said:
I did ask Graypauls about the average cost of the 458's they sold and it was 205k which is 35k over list. [/footnote]
Well, no car has been supplied in UK at basic list price.Im told that the actual invoiced price including options on a UK 458 has never been under 190K.
It seems that a big factor in used 458's is the seats now.
If its 165K or less its got the crap seats with the fag packet design as opposed to the stunning carbon race seats with funky trim and stitching. I think of all the options this is the critical one for the future. Im already at he point where without the carbon seats I dismiss it.
The Mclaren is a very different product and lacks the presence of the Ferrari as well as the heart.
Technologically brilliant but not a Ferrari and never will be.
I test drove the 12c when they arrived and hated it.
I did have a 430 Scud at the time so not comparing apples with apples but none the less I left unimpressed.
giggle said:
The Mclaren is a very different product and lacks the presence of the Ferrari as well as the heart.
Technologically brilliant but not a Ferrari and never will be.
I test drove the 12c when they arrived and hated it.
I did have a 430 Scud at the time so not comparing apples with apples but none the less I left unimpressed.
I agree the Ferrari looks and sounds better, but found that when testing the 2 back to back the mclaren was the easier car to jump into and just 'go' much like you can with my gt3. It also felt smaller and more wieldy and had much more torque. Having 'done' the Ferrari experience I am tempted to try something different and will almost certainly be on the list for a 458scud when it appears as I prefer to go for a limited edition or race variant of a car that is produced in numbers.Technologically brilliant but not a Ferrari and never will be.
I test drove the 12c when they arrived and hated it.
I did have a 430 Scud at the time so not comparing apples with apples but none the less I left unimpressed.
red_duke said:
Does this indicate anyone buying an early 12C with the intention of flipping it for a profit got a shock?
those who flipped it early (within months) made some money, there was a thread here about someone selling there's within a few weeks making a tidy some, from then on, premiums rapidly disappeared, think reliability issues meant many on the w/list were happy to wait (figuring best to let the iris system be fixed) then pay a margin for an early car...70proof said:
think reliability issues meant many on the w/list were happy to wait (figuring best to let the iris system be fixed) then pay a margin for an early car...
Good point. The Internet grapevine must be very damaging to manufacturers. Problems with the early cars became widely known and must have put potential purchasers off; particularly those teetering between a 12C and a 458.Presumably the free power upgrade and fixed Iris electronics this year have brought a smile to owner's faces, but there's been no feedback to that effect on these forums. I wonder if these free fixes and upgrades were made available to second and third hand owners?
Edited by red_duke on Sunday 30th December 15:13
red_duke said:
Good point. The Internet grapevine must be very damaging to manufacturers. Problems with the early cars became widely known and must have put potential purchasers off; particularly those teetering between a 12C and a 458.
Presumably the free power upgrade and fixed Iris electronics this year have brought a smile to owner's faces, but there's been no feedback to that effect on these forums. I wonder if these free fixes and upgrades were made available to second and third hand owners?
That's a good point a out no feedback on the upgrades. Anybody had this yet and can comment?Presumably the free power upgrade and fixed Iris electronics this year have brought a smile to owner's faces, but there's been no feedback to that effect on these forums. I wonder if these free fixes and upgrades were made available to second and third hand owners?
Edited by red_duke on Sunday 30th December 15:13
Having had one for a week I can't help thinking there are a relative bargain now. I can't comment on pre upgrades as my friend had the car prior to me but there have been no issues so far, sat nav, doors, Bluetooth etc all work well. Infact sat nav system is really good. I don't know what the car was like prior to the 616hp upgrade.
The cabin is a really special place to be. Carbon and alacantara upgrades work well. Sports exhaust system sound good when you want it to. Easy car to drive slowly too, but also really comes alive should you wish it too.
I have not seen many photos that make it look good, the car does not seem to photograph well but in the flesh it's really good looking. Feels smaller than you would expect too.
The cabin is a really special place to be. Carbon and alacantara upgrades work well. Sports exhaust system sound good when you want it to. Easy car to drive slowly too, but also really comes alive should you wish it too.
I have not seen many photos that make it look good, the car does not seem to photograph well but in the flesh it's really good looking. Feels smaller than you would expect too.
red_duke said:
Good point. The Internet grapevine must be very damaging to manufacturers. Problems with the early cars became widely known and must have put potential purchasers off; particularly those teetering between a 12C and a 458.
Presumably the free power upgrade and fixed Iris electronics this year have brought a smile to owner's faces, but there's been no feedback to that effect on these forums. I wonder if these free fixes and upgrades were made available to second and third hand owners?
yep upgrades available to 2nd hand owners and are applied by chassis number. Or more accurately applied by each dealership according to chassis number, so probably london has the most cars to get through so it's not impossible an earlier chassis with london might get upgraded later than one elsewhere where the dealer had supplied fewer cars.Presumably the free power upgrade and fixed Iris electronics this year have brought a smile to owner's faces, but there's been no feedback to that effect on these forums. I wonder if these free fixes and upgrades were made available to second and third hand owners?
Edited by red_duke on Sunday 30th December 15:13
APOLO1 said:
The upgraded 12c, as in 13 MY, has no equal....
Maybe in terms of tech, but a 2004 gallardo will turn more heads, and sounds savage with the right exhaust. Fast enough for most people too. Plus the depreciation is glacial, some early cars seem to be actually rising slightly. baileyconstruct said:
Streetrod said:
Bit of an odd statement as there are only 18 MP4 for sale in the classifieds and the prices seem to cover a reasonably wide price range. Compare them to the Ferrari 458's of which 80 are for sale and I think you will see a similar pattern in pricing, so I would conclude that nothing unusual is happening here.
Factor in the recent release of the spyder versions of both cars and this will have a softening effect on the coupe's values
These car will depreciate, that is a fact, if you expect to buy into this market and not have that happen then you are kidding yourself
How can my statement be odd??? The fact is I have commented on the fact that the cars being advertised are in majority the same cars that i noticed advertised in late July and August. I merely have stated that back then they were 165k plus. Factor in the recent release of the spyder versions of both cars and this will have a softening effect on the coupe's values
These car will depreciate, that is a fact, if you expect to buy into this market and not have that happen then you are kidding yourself
I appreciate there are more 458 for sale but seem they sell quickly.
I realise the cars will depreciate but out of the 18 cars on there 11 are the same. Both of the ones at mclaren London have been advertised and I drove the light silver one back in late August. Also the one at graypaul and mclaren Manchester.
It was merely an observation.
Edited by baileyconstruct on Saturday 29th December 17:57
The Mac market has to mature and find its feet, let’s not forget the car has only been out for a year and a half. On the positive side McLaren themselves are happy as they are exceeding their sales projection numbers with things ramping up with the introduction of the Spyder.
I would expect a styling upgrade and Scud like spec to be offered towards the end of 2013 with a switch to a variation of the HS nose. By that time the P1 with be out and McLaren will be looking to capitalise on the halo effect. I think Ferrari will do the same with the 458 when it launches the Enzo replacement. These are just guesses by the way but it seems like a reasonable way to keep the cars on the boil.
As for prices, I think they will settle, just not sure where, the world is still an uncertain place, lets see what 2013 brings
jgy6000 said:
Really? Not from what i have seen. Infact its the complete opposite, where did you hear this?
Does anybody have a reliable link/source on sale figures?I must say I loved the 12c but was worried at the time on depreciation. I looked at my car which I have had for 3 months and they are still at the same pricing level, maybe slightly higher than what I paid.
I am no fool and realise I will lose money, but just felt the 458 , at the time would limit the loss.
I had a feeling the 12c would drop like a stone, and I still think they will go to 135-140 by Feb. they have no natural buffer to them accept the 911 Porsche Turbo.
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