tyre question.. myth or reality.....
Discussion
i know this has been discussed beore, but i really want to get to the bottom of this.....
the p zero tyre comes with 'L', 'R01', 'N' and now 'AM' stamps on he side.....
for lambo, audi, porsche and aston respectively......
i know the side wall stiffness for the 'N' tyres is different, so you wouldn;t put those on your lambo.....
but seriously, are the 'L' and 'R01' tyres really any different.... same parent company, many mechanical similarites, same side wall stiffness......
the p zero tyre comes with 'L', 'R01', 'N' and now 'AM' stamps on he side.....
for lambo, audi, porsche and aston respectively......
i know the side wall stiffness for the 'N' tyres is different, so you wouldn;t put those on your lambo.....
but seriously, are the 'L' and 'R01' tyres really any different.... same parent company, many mechanical similarites, same side wall stiffness......
The difference will be in the raw rubber compound, although you'll find that OEM tyres will be subtly different to those you'd then buy to replace them with at a specialist.
I don't know the exact 'tune' of difference between those mentioned, but I can't imagine it's a huge amount due to the very similar natures of their mechanical demands
Your best bet is to speak with the UK arm of the company and see if they'll provide you with a technical explanation
I don't know the exact 'tune' of difference between those mentioned, but I can't imagine it's a huge amount due to the very similar natures of their mechanical demands
Your best bet is to speak with the UK arm of the company and see if they'll provide you with a technical explanation
did speak to a lady on customer services pirelli uk and her response was yes, there is a specific L tyre for lambo's but then couldn;t explain why it was any different to the r01......
given the similarites of both cars, esp the v10 rs8 and the gallardo, i really can;t see there being specific compound developments.... more likely the compound was tuned using the gallardo, and then audi came along and said thanks very much....
given the similarites of both cars, esp the v10 rs8 and the gallardo, i really can;t see there being specific compound developments.... more likely the compound was tuned using the gallardo, and then audi came along and said thanks very much....
pasted from the pirelli website......
A reference point for the Ultra High Performance segment, it is characterised by an asymmetric tread pattern. Ideal for all top of the range sports and high-powered cars, it can also be considered for powerful mid-range vehicles.
A milestone in the development of the Pirelli range, P ZERO™ has been chosen as original equipment for the most performance orientated and powerful models on the market. Its asymmetric tread pattern improves braking performance and enhances handling and control. Excellent in wet conditions with improved safety in potential aquaplaning situations.
Its new nano-composite compound ensures maximum grip and stability. The structural integrity of the tyre improves steering response, which is essential in sports driving, and also ensures uniform tread wear.
The special “S-shaped” grooves in the tread area deliver lower cabin noise levels, enhancing driver comfort.
Key Homologations:
Alfa Romeo, Aston Martin, Audi, Bentley, BMW, Ferrari, Ford, GM, Jaguar, Lamborghini, Lotus, Maserati, Mercedes, MINI, Porsche, Seat, Volkswagen
agree that the compound will have been dveloped and improved over the years, but are they really going to fine tune the compound for each manfacturer.... not a brilliant business model if they do as the R&D costs will far outweigh any premium for a few 'L' marked tyres....
A reference point for the Ultra High Performance segment, it is characterised by an asymmetric tread pattern. Ideal for all top of the range sports and high-powered cars, it can also be considered for powerful mid-range vehicles.
A milestone in the development of the Pirelli range, P ZERO™ has been chosen as original equipment for the most performance orientated and powerful models on the market. Its asymmetric tread pattern improves braking performance and enhances handling and control. Excellent in wet conditions with improved safety in potential aquaplaning situations.
Its new nano-composite compound ensures maximum grip and stability. The structural integrity of the tyre improves steering response, which is essential in sports driving, and also ensures uniform tread wear.
The special “S-shaped” grooves in the tread area deliver lower cabin noise levels, enhancing driver comfort.
Key Homologations:
Alfa Romeo, Aston Martin, Audi, Bentley, BMW, Ferrari, Ford, GM, Jaguar, Lamborghini, Lotus, Maserati, Mercedes, MINI, Porsche, Seat, Volkswagen
agree that the compound will have been dveloped and improved over the years, but are they really going to fine tune the compound for each manfacturer.... not a brilliant business model if they do as the R&D costs will far outweigh any premium for a few 'L' marked tyres....
Can't answer if there is any difference but I do know when I asked a Pirelli engineer at a track day he gave me the specific codes for replacing my Gallardo tyres and told me it did matter which ones I ordered. Not a sales guy so I guess he was looking at it from a technical perspective.
I was at the launch of the Michelin Pilot Super Sport tyres a couple of years ago and spent some time talking to one of their development guys about this. We spoke about Porsche in particular as I remarked that it was surprising that we were testing the tyres on 911's even though they weren't N rated. Here's what he told me...
What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
voicey said:
I was at the launch of the Michelin Pilot Super Sport tyres a couple of years ago and spent some time talking to one of their development guys about this. We spoke about Porsche in particular as I remarked that it was surprising that we were testing the tyres on 911's even though they weren't N rated. Here's what he told me...
What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
many thanks, totally get the 'n' thing..... but audi and lambo being significantly different....What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
even the UTQG codes are the same, whatever that means.....and the tyre weights....
Edited by 70proof on Friday 4th January 12:41
70proof said:
voicey said:
I was at the launch of the Michelin Pilot Super Sport tyres a couple of years ago and spent some time talking to one of their development guys about this. We spoke about Porsche in particular as I remarked that it was surprising that we were testing the tyres on 911's even though they weren't N rated. Here's what he told me...
What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
many thanks, totally get the 'n' thing..... but audi and lambo being significantly different....What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
even the UTQG codes are the same, whatever that means.....and the tyre weights....
Edited by 70proof on Friday 4th January 12:41
Also, as much as the two cars are based on similar architecture, there's a lot of variables on there that can change chassis/handling characteristics that could be controlled by the tyre performance
70proof said:
voicey said:
I was at the launch of the Michelin Pilot Super Sport tyres a couple of years ago and spent some time talking to one of their development guys about this. We spoke about Porsche in particular as I remarked that it was surprising that we were testing the tyres on 911's even though they weren't N rated. Here's what he told me...
What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
many thanks, totally get the 'n' thing..... but audi and lambo being significantly different....What happens is a tyre company develops a new tyre and hands it over to the manufacturers to approve. Companies like Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc work with the manufacturer on developing the tyre to work a specific way with their cars. They can specify compound changes so the tyre gives the driving experience they want.
This means that an "L" rated tyre will be different to an "N" rated tyre despite looking exactly the same.
even the UTQG codes are the same, whatever that means.....and the tyre weights....
Edited by 70proof on Friday 4th January 12:41
I found that finding a right and left correct Corsa for my Scuderia was a nightmare, and ended up being ripped off royally by the dealer. Over £500 for 1 tyre. Ouch.
You'll also get more variation from the geo being bashed about from potholes etc than you will from L or R rated versions of the same basic tyre.
sure it is all marketing bull...... 
take my alpina, factory fit were the ps2 tyre, which is nolonger made, ps3 and psss are very different, so the online booklets have now been changed to suit!!!! p zero now standard fit with psss an option!!!!
on the gallardo front... the p zero system tyre was changed in 2009, with a change in compound, so i doubt any tyres with the 1637200 ip code are being produced, and the latest p zero 1920800 tyre is lighter and has a different utqg rating.....
take my alpina, factory fit were the ps2 tyre, which is nolonger made, ps3 and psss are very different, so the online booklets have now been changed to suit!!!! p zero now standard fit with psss an option!!!!
on the gallardo front... the p zero system tyre was changed in 2009, with a change in compound, so i doubt any tyres with the 1637200 ip code are being produced, and the latest p zero 1920800 tyre is lighter and has a different utqg rating.....
graeme4130 said:
It'll be very subtle, but lambo and audi chassis engineers will be very sensitive about adhesion release levels and NVH etc, so there's quite a bit you can tune with compounds and other things like matching conicity etc
Also, as much as the two cars are based on similar architecture, there's a lot of variables on there that can change chassis/handling characteristics that could be controlled by the tyre performance
accepted and valid point......Also, as much as the two cars are based on similar architecture, there's a lot of variables on there that can change chassis/handling characteristics that could be controlled by the tyre performance
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