first supercar
Discussion
Pat H said:
Nope, I quite agree.
I'm not trying to sell the Aston (or an Alfa 4C) as a supercar, cos they aren't.
Just as a stop gap until the market regains some sort of balance.
If you have any sort of eye on future values, then now is not the time to dump £60-100,000 in an old Ferrari.
Absolutely this...I'm not trying to sell the Aston (or an Alfa 4C) as a supercar, cos they aren't.
Just as a stop gap until the market regains some sort of balance.
If you have any sort of eye on future values, then now is not the time to dump £60-100,000 in an old Ferrari.
I'm going to watch the values over the next 12 month to see where they're at,
I've decided its pretty much between 3 cars
1. tdf blue 360 with crema seats 6 spd manual
2. f430 6spd manual
3. verde ithaca gallardo 6spd manual
obviously the oddball is the RS3 but its also probably more likely to get thugs trying to get it at 3am,
the only porsche i would entertain is a 964 turbo s (bad boys) but completely out of my price range or the gt3 rs or gt2 but nowhere near my budget and never will be so no point even thinking about them
I've decided its pretty much between 3 cars
1. tdf blue 360 with crema seats 6 spd manual
2. f430 6spd manual
3. verde ithaca gallardo 6spd manual
obviously the oddball is the RS3 but its also probably more likely to get thugs trying to get it at 3am,
the only porsche i would entertain is a 964 turbo s (bad boys) but completely out of my price range or the gt3 rs or gt2 but nowhere near my budget and never will be so no point even thinking about them
I agree that new cars are getting too fast which takes some of the fun away unfortunately. I do a lot of Autobahn driving, so there at least you can use the power, but even then the cars are so fast from say 150 to 270 (do not usually want to drive faster than that anymore), that it is a rather short rush.
My favourite Ferrari was still the 355, which I had to sell in I think 2010 - I got 27k for it at the time (at least it was my daily driver, so I got some use out of it). Having said that the running costs - even at independents - were quite something. I think most Ferraris are a little overvalued at the moment and - at least in Germany - not that many seem to be selling at current asking prices. So I'd definitely at least mentally prepare for depreciation. I think the Scuderia I bought last autumn is now (c. 6k km later) probably worth at least 20k less than at the time (plus whatever margin the dealer wants, as private sales of these cars are probably difficult - many people will likely want finance as I did and a private purchase is then just too much hassle imo). I tried to sell the 355 privately at the time and it was just a lot of tyre kickers etc, so gave up eventually and just sold it back to the supplying dealer.
I think - relatively speaking - the 360 might be a sweet spot in terms of maintenance, driving dynamics and current prices. I also think they have aged quite well. Nonetheless I would assume that running costs are still not insignificant at this age. Stuff like balljoints need regular replacing and at some point the gearbox might need work, which would likely be rather expensive if it happens (I think no Ferrari warranty available for cars of that age). They don't have that many electronics, but those are something that regularly needs attention as well (I have accepted fault lights as a regular occurrence and usually just reset by disconnecting the battery ...).
With regards to the F1 gearbox - I have not driven a 360, but I much prefer the one in the Scud to the DCT in the FF - it is just more involving to drive, so I assume the slower version in the 360 might actually be good fun, as you have to drive it like a manual car to a large degree (I still much prefer a gated manual, but at current prices thanks to the manual hype I think those might have even more to lose given the higher entry price).
From what I have read cars like the 308/328 are much easier to service and any decent mechanic can do a good job on those, which should reduce costs. A 328 Targa in black/cream was the first Ferrari I ever sat in and it was very very awesome (rose tinted spectacles maybe). As above, if something big goes wrong, it will still cost a lot to rectify.
I think a maintenance budget of say 3k a year at an independent is probably ok as a long term average. But if something big goes wrong, you might easily have a year where you need to come up with 10k (or more).
Another aspect to consider is, if - like one of my cars - you have a no fault accident, you then have a car with history and those are very difficult to sell in Ferrari world (disproportionate value impact).
My favourite Ferrari was still the 355, which I had to sell in I think 2010 - I got 27k for it at the time (at least it was my daily driver, so I got some use out of it). Having said that the running costs - even at independents - were quite something. I think most Ferraris are a little overvalued at the moment and - at least in Germany - not that many seem to be selling at current asking prices. So I'd definitely at least mentally prepare for depreciation. I think the Scuderia I bought last autumn is now (c. 6k km later) probably worth at least 20k less than at the time (plus whatever margin the dealer wants, as private sales of these cars are probably difficult - many people will likely want finance as I did and a private purchase is then just too much hassle imo). I tried to sell the 355 privately at the time and it was just a lot of tyre kickers etc, so gave up eventually and just sold it back to the supplying dealer.
I think - relatively speaking - the 360 might be a sweet spot in terms of maintenance, driving dynamics and current prices. I also think they have aged quite well. Nonetheless I would assume that running costs are still not insignificant at this age. Stuff like balljoints need regular replacing and at some point the gearbox might need work, which would likely be rather expensive if it happens (I think no Ferrari warranty available for cars of that age). They don't have that many electronics, but those are something that regularly needs attention as well (I have accepted fault lights as a regular occurrence and usually just reset by disconnecting the battery ...).
With regards to the F1 gearbox - I have not driven a 360, but I much prefer the one in the Scud to the DCT in the FF - it is just more involving to drive, so I assume the slower version in the 360 might actually be good fun, as you have to drive it like a manual car to a large degree (I still much prefer a gated manual, but at current prices thanks to the manual hype I think those might have even more to lose given the higher entry price).
From what I have read cars like the 308/328 are much easier to service and any decent mechanic can do a good job on those, which should reduce costs. A 328 Targa in black/cream was the first Ferrari I ever sat in and it was very very awesome (rose tinted spectacles maybe). As above, if something big goes wrong, it will still cost a lot to rectify.
I think a maintenance budget of say 3k a year at an independent is probably ok as a long term average. But if something big goes wrong, you might easily have a year where you need to come up with 10k (or more).
Another aspect to consider is, if - like one of my cars - you have a no fault accident, you then have a car with history and those are very difficult to sell in Ferrari world (disproportionate value impact).
Well I’m going to start looking shortly I did want a 355 and the chase sequence in goldeneye wetted my apetite but when I’ve seen a few on the road they don’t intrigue me! The 360 430 and the gallardo I love their silhouette and their rooflines the only thing with the manuals is they look stuck on like an afterthought whereas the gallardos was extremely nice! I haven’t driven an e gear gallardo but the paddles look quite awkward and not very nice and I would prefer an F1 gearbox f430 BUT it’s the whole value thing as it was he last manual car before the 458! Scud or challenge stradale would be my ultimate wish list but out of my range! I genuinely wish I’d bought a few years ago as I’d be laughing now!
Aged 40 (4 years ago) I had a similar itch which needed scratching. Was deciding between a Gallardo and a 550. In the end it was an easy choice as I couldnt fit in the Lambo! Also felt the 550 would be more special yet more practical. Im not mechanically minded, nor wealthy so was petrified of what would happen in regards to ownership, repair costs etc.
Took the plunge for a 550 at £52k. Kept for 2 years and then sold. I was lucky as prices rocketed soon after so I made a good profit though they kept rising for at least another year before seemingly falling back to the £90k mark now. As the last full manual model Ferrari made Im sure its a good investment even in these times. It delivered the sense of occasion I wanted but wasnt as shouty as other supercars which I also liked. I will admit that a lot of the time I owned it I was nervous. Driving in London/every warning light/strange sound etc brought butterflies and panic. Looking back it was pretty reliable, well built and if Im honest I miss it terribly. I did 1500 miles to Scotland and back before selling and it was just incredible. A memory I will cherish. So much so Id love another if I could ever afford one. I guess its a love/hate relationship but no other car has come close in terms of ownership. As they seem a similar price to 360/430 etc Id seriously consider, but dont go for red! I keep drooling over this one! https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
If anyone is bored I did a little video of my Scotland trip! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_-ph74EXpY And a very amateur review of my 550! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG2acpghrqw&t=...
It cost me about £2k in running costs I think. Cooling hose and thermocouple cable only issues really. Mine had the FHP which was a nightmare with London speed bumps so had to have it raised slightly.
Took the plunge for a 550 at £52k. Kept for 2 years and then sold. I was lucky as prices rocketed soon after so I made a good profit though they kept rising for at least another year before seemingly falling back to the £90k mark now. As the last full manual model Ferrari made Im sure its a good investment even in these times. It delivered the sense of occasion I wanted but wasnt as shouty as other supercars which I also liked. I will admit that a lot of the time I owned it I was nervous. Driving in London/every warning light/strange sound etc brought butterflies and panic. Looking back it was pretty reliable, well built and if Im honest I miss it terribly. I did 1500 miles to Scotland and back before selling and it was just incredible. A memory I will cherish. So much so Id love another if I could ever afford one. I guess its a love/hate relationship but no other car has come close in terms of ownership. As they seem a similar price to 360/430 etc Id seriously consider, but dont go for red! I keep drooling over this one! https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
If anyone is bored I did a little video of my Scotland trip! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_-ph74EXpY And a very amateur review of my 550! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG2acpghrqw&t=...
It cost me about £2k in running costs I think. Cooling hose and thermocouple cable only issues really. Mine had the FHP which was a nightmare with London speed bumps so had to have it raised slightly.
Edited by Claret Badger on Wednesday 11th April 14:00
Claret Badger said:
Aged 40 (4 years ago) I had a similar itch which needed scratching. Was deciding between a Gallardo and a 550. In the end it was an easy choice as I couldnt fit in the Lambo! Also felt the 550 would be more special yet more practical. Im not mechanically minded, nor wealthy so was petrified of what would happen in regards to ownership, repair costs etc.
Took the plunge for a 550 at £52k. Kept for 2 years and then sold. I was lucky as prices rocketed soon after so I made a good profit though they kept rising for at least another year before seemingly falling back to the £90k mark now. As the last full manual model Ferrari made Im sure its a good investment even in these times. It delivered the sense of occasion I wanted but wasnt as shouty as other supercars which I also liked. I will admit that a lot of the time I owned it I was nervous. Driving in London/every warning light/strange sound etc brought butterflies and panic. Looking back it was pretty reliable, well built and if Im honest I miss it terribly. I did 1500 miles to Scotland and back before selling and it was just incredible. A memory I will cherish. So much so Id love another if I could ever afford one. I guess its a love/hate relationship but no other car has come close in terms of ownership. As they seem a similar price to 360/430 etc Id seriously consider, but dont go for red! I keep drooling over this one! https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
If anyone is bored I did a little video of my Scotland trip! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_-ph74EXpY And a very amateur review of my 550! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG2acpghrqw&t=...
It cost me about £2k in running costs I think. Cooling hose and thermocouple cable only issues really. Mine had the FHP which was a nightmare with London speed bumps so had to have it raised slightly.
Sounds good mate! I do like the 550/575Took the plunge for a 550 at £52k. Kept for 2 years and then sold. I was lucky as prices rocketed soon after so I made a good profit though they kept rising for at least another year before seemingly falling back to the £90k mark now. As the last full manual model Ferrari made Im sure its a good investment even in these times. It delivered the sense of occasion I wanted but wasnt as shouty as other supercars which I also liked. I will admit that a lot of the time I owned it I was nervous. Driving in London/every warning light/strange sound etc brought butterflies and panic. Looking back it was pretty reliable, well built and if Im honest I miss it terribly. I did 1500 miles to Scotland and back before selling and it was just incredible. A memory I will cherish. So much so Id love another if I could ever afford one. I guess its a love/hate relationship but no other car has come close in terms of ownership. As they seem a similar price to 360/430 etc Id seriously consider, but dont go for red! I keep drooling over this one! https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
If anyone is bored I did a little video of my Scotland trip! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_-ph74EXpY And a very amateur review of my 550! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG2acpghrqw&t=...
It cost me about £2k in running costs I think. Cooling hose and thermocouple cable only issues really. Mine had the FHP which was a nightmare with London speed bumps so had to have it raised slightly.
Edited by Claret Badger on Wednesday 11th April 14:00
ghost83 said:
Definitely has to be crema sport seats tbh I have black leather now and hate it
If you want TDF with crema sport seats you may be lucky, or you may be after a unicorn......Say 900 RHD cars in the UK, of that maybe 50 are TDF, 30 plus are probably F1 and of the remaining manuals, 5 might have sports seats and they come in 3 sizes.
I passed on a TDF manual just before I bought mine with sports seats (Crema with blue centres though), 13k mile, £46k in 2012. I'm not sure I've noticed one since for sale.
My comment on try on an F1 was based on your previous comment about it being slow etc....... A lot of nonsense is propagated by people who've never had one/driven one. I felt exactly the same until I tried one and now I wouldn't trade for a manual.
mike01606 said:
If you want TDF with crema sport seats you may be lucky, or you may be after a unicorn......
Say 900 RHD cars in the UK, of that maybe 50 are TDF, 30 plus are probably F1 and of the remaining manuals, 5 might have sports seats and they come in 3 sizes.
I passed on a TDF manual just before I bought mine with sports seats (Crema with blue centres though), 13k mile, £46k in 2012. I'm not sure I've noticed one since for sale.
My comment on try on an F1 was based on your previous comment about it being slow etc....... A lot of nonsense is propagated by people who've never had one/driven one. I felt exactly the same until I tried one and now I wouldn't trade for a manual.
Well I will try one but after having my first auto in my current car (dsg) I haven’t been a fan and blue centres is a beautiful combo! There’s one with blue centres on autotrader at a Ferrari dealer! Please don’t upset me with prices at 46k I am seriously kicking myself over it lolSay 900 RHD cars in the UK, of that maybe 50 are TDF, 30 plus are probably F1 and of the remaining manuals, 5 might have sports seats and they come in 3 sizes.
I passed on a TDF manual just before I bought mine with sports seats (Crema with blue centres though), 13k mile, £46k in 2012. I'm not sure I've noticed one since for sale.
My comment on try on an F1 was based on your previous comment about it being slow etc....... A lot of nonsense is propagated by people who've never had one/driven one. I felt exactly the same until I tried one and now I wouldn't trade for a manual.
kbooker said:
Pat H said:
Nope, I quite agree.
I'm not trying to sell the Aston (or an Alfa 4C) as a supercar, cos they aren't.
Just as a stop gap until the market regains some sort of balance.
If you have any sort of eye on future values, then now is not the time to dump £60-100,000 in an old Ferrari.
Absolutely this...I'm not trying to sell the Aston (or an Alfa 4C) as a supercar, cos they aren't.
Just as a stop gap until the market regains some sort of balance.
If you have any sort of eye on future values, then now is not the time to dump £60-100,000 in an old Ferrari.
Prior to the recent rapid increases in prices, there were typically fewer than 15 for sale.
I think that tells you all you need to know about how this will end.
Pat H said:
When I checked yesterday, there were 45 F328s for sale in the PH classifieds. A lot of them have been for sale for a fair while.
Prior to the recent rapid increases in prices, there were typically fewer than 15 for sale.
I think that tells you all you need to know about how this will end.
yeah its a buyers market and they won't sell at over inflated pricesPrior to the recent rapid increases in prices, there were typically fewer than 15 for sale.
I think that tells you all you need to know about how this will end.
ghost83 said:
as the title which to go for that you aren't really going to lose money on?
I'm currently stuck on whether to buy myself a new RS3 next september OR going down the supercar route
if looking at ferrari does the colour make a real difference to value?
will gallardos go up in value?
i see the 12c is currently heading south in value with prices around 88-90k are these likely to go down more before recovering if so how far?
im liking the look of the ferrari 308, 348, theres a lovely looking black 360 spyder on auto trader with the cream sports seats, i think a 430 is out of my price range as is a 550/575
I've driven a gallardo 6spd and a mclaren 12c and loved both (preferred the lambo for noise and drama)
any car must be a manual and does colour dictate if not wanting to lose massive money, OR is the bubble going to burst and it be best waiting? (i nearly bought a 355 when they were around 35k and kicking myself now, and back in 2011 i could have had a 996 turbo for 20k and again they've gone up in value)
i don't see the porsche as "special" though (sorry to any owners) so which ones are to have and whats to avoid? whats to look for? some ppl say the 348 is a dog of a car but i wouldn't know what to look for
cheers in advance
You’re a total bullsI'm currently stuck on whether to buy myself a new RS3 next september OR going down the supercar route
if looking at ferrari does the colour make a real difference to value?
will gallardos go up in value?
i see the 12c is currently heading south in value with prices around 88-90k are these likely to go down more before recovering if so how far?
im liking the look of the ferrari 308, 348, theres a lovely looking black 360 spyder on auto trader with the cream sports seats, i think a 430 is out of my price range as is a 550/575
I've driven a gallardo 6spd and a mclaren 12c and loved both (preferred the lambo for noise and drama)
any car must be a manual and does colour dictate if not wanting to lose massive money, OR is the bubble going to burst and it be best waiting? (i nearly bought a 355 when they were around 35k and kicking myself now, and back in 2011 i could have had a 996 turbo for 20k and again they've gone up in value)
i don't see the porsche as "special" though (sorry to any owners) so which ones are to have and whats to avoid? whats to look for? some ppl say the 348 is a dog of a car but i wouldn't know what to look for
cheers in advance
t artist. A few months ago you were saying you were being paid less than minimum wage. Now you’re buying a Supercar. Do Jog on. The very definition of a troll. ghost83 said:
Hi guys I'm looking for legal advice here,
Atm I work for my father in the amusement machine supply sector and I'm very unhappy if I'm honest he's very controlling pays me utter crap and less than minimum wage and is just a nightmare all because I don't get on with his recent new wife (within the last few yrs, worked with him 17yrs) he promises payrises and other stuff then never delivers! (Eg got rid of 2 staff and told me if I did the extra work I'd get a significant payrise circa an extra £350 a month after tax but never got it and that was 3yr ago)
Atm I work for my father in the amusement machine supply sector and I'm very unhappy if I'm honest he's very controlling pays me utter crap and less than minimum wage and is just a nightmare all because I don't get on with his recent new wife (within the last few yrs, worked with him 17yrs) he promises payrises and other stuff then never delivers! (Eg got rid of 2 staff and told me if I did the extra work I'd get a significant payrise circa an extra £350 a month after tax but never got it and that was 3yr ago)
And my finances are sorted?!?
Point been what? I was taken advantage of by family and now it’s all sorted! And I’ve had a massive increase in my wages!
Edit: my promised rise was 350 and I ended up with an extra £1k after tax and been promoted within his company
People’s circumstances do change you know!
Lol!
And I’m hardly gonna bullst over a 12-20yr old car lol
Further edit: I’ve currently got 20k in savings my current car will sell and give me a further 20k and looking to finance the rest but between now and then will be increasing my savings! My life has completely changed! I’m taking my family to Florida next month and just enjoying myself! But time will tell won’t it! I will see what’s on my drive in the next 12-18 month!
Point been what? I was taken advantage of by family and now it’s all sorted! And I’ve had a massive increase in my wages!
Edit: my promised rise was 350 and I ended up with an extra £1k after tax and been promoted within his company
People’s circumstances do change you know!
Lol!
And I’m hardly gonna bulls
t over a 12-20yr old car lolFurther edit: I’ve currently got 20k in savings my current car will sell and give me a further 20k and looking to finance the rest but between now and then will be increasing my savings! My life has completely changed! I’m taking my family to Florida next month and just enjoying myself! But time will tell won’t it! I will see what’s on my drive in the next 12-18 month!
Edited by ghost83 on Wednesday 11th April 23:52
And my finances are sorted?!?
Point been what? I was taken advantage of by family and now it’s all sorted! And I’ve had a massive increase in my wages!
Edit: my promised rise was 350 and I ended up with an extra £1k after tax and been promoted within his company
People’s circumstances do change you know!
Lol!
And I’m hardly gonna bullst over a 12-20yr old car lol
Further edit: I’ve currently got 20k in savings my current car will sell and give me a further 20k and looking to finance the rest but between now and then will be increasing my savings! My life has completely changed! I’m taking my family to Florida next month and just enjoying myself! But time will tell won’t it! I will see what’s on my drive in the next 12-18 month!
Point been what? I was taken advantage of by family and now it’s all sorted! And I’ve had a massive increase in my wages!
Edit: my promised rise was 350 and I ended up with an extra £1k after tax and been promoted within his company
People’s circumstances do change you know!
Lol!
And I’m hardly gonna bulls
t over a 12-20yr old car lolFurther edit: I’ve currently got 20k in savings my current car will sell and give me a further 20k and looking to finance the rest but between now and then will be increasing my savings! My life has completely changed! I’m taking my family to Florida next month and just enjoying myself! But time will tell won’t it! I will see what’s on my drive in the next 12-18 month!
Edited by ghost83 on Wednesday 11th April 23:53
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