Suggestions for a first supercar
Discussion
The Selfish Gene said:
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
now that sir is a brilliant post. The (petrolhead) voice of experience.
Bravo and what fine cars you have.
Edited to add - it's nice to hear someone actually be upbeat and positive about cars on a car forum.
I'm off to look at the classified
Thanks! And get out their hunting! Look forward to hearing what you find! now that sir is a brilliant post. The (petrolhead) voice of experience.
Bravo and what fine cars you have.
Edited to add - it's nice to hear someone actually be upbeat and positive about cars on a car forum.
I'm off to look at the classified
Nice post Durzel and I certainly get the 'your time here is short' mantra. Everyone's situation is different but the point about if you work hard to buy something then you had better enjoy it is spot on, people who worry about putting miles on a car as it will devalue it make me laugh, whats the point of having it then?! Going to the ring at the end of Sep for two days with the Vantage, had it on track earlier this month as well....using it as intended!
Durzel said:
I don't personally dwell on "car as percentage of net worth" tbh.
The acid test for me with things like this, and generally, is quite simply - will other aspects of my life suffer from owning this (i.e. will I be able to afford to do the other things I currently enjoy), will I be able to enjoy it properly (i.e. will the anticipated running costs or depreciation weigh heavily on my mind to the point where it gives me any pause for thought about turning the key and driving it), etc.
Beyond that I fall back to the logic of "money comes and goes, time only goes".
That said - I didn't have this attitude prior to my father passing away. I had spent most of my adult life saving, eschewing holidays, etc. It's fair to say that I've squandered a few years where I could've had experiences that were rewarding spiritually, but also expensive.
That is not to say that the spectre of depreciation and running costs doesn't factor into my thought process, but it doesn't stop me anymore. I bought a 458 a couple of years ago making peace with the idea that I would lose ~£20k in depreciation / dealer flip, and I actually broke even on it and would actually have made a profit had I not had to buy 4 shocks for it. Buying the right car (if used) is critical, as has been said above.
The only thing I would say, with any purchase of anything really, is that the absolute worst thing you can do is buy it and not be able to enjoy it properly. If you stretch yourself so much that it becomes a burden, or you can't afford a warranty and live in fear of anything going wrong on it, or how each mile might reduce the value of it, so much so that you feel on edge owning it - then it is absolutely the worst thing you can do. Don't let a dream car be an anchor around your neck.
Bang on!The acid test for me with things like this, and generally, is quite simply - will other aspects of my life suffer from owning this (i.e. will I be able to afford to do the other things I currently enjoy), will I be able to enjoy it properly (i.e. will the anticipated running costs or depreciation weigh heavily on my mind to the point where it gives me any pause for thought about turning the key and driving it), etc.
Beyond that I fall back to the logic of "money comes and goes, time only goes".
That said - I didn't have this attitude prior to my father passing away. I had spent most of my adult life saving, eschewing holidays, etc. It's fair to say that I've squandered a few years where I could've had experiences that were rewarding spiritually, but also expensive.
That is not to say that the spectre of depreciation and running costs doesn't factor into my thought process, but it doesn't stop me anymore. I bought a 458 a couple of years ago making peace with the idea that I would lose ~£20k in depreciation / dealer flip, and I actually broke even on it and would actually have made a profit had I not had to buy 4 shocks for it. Buying the right car (if used) is critical, as has been said above.
The only thing I would say, with any purchase of anything really, is that the absolute worst thing you can do is buy it and not be able to enjoy it properly. If you stretch yourself so much that it becomes a burden, or you can't afford a warranty and live in fear of anything going wrong on it, or how each mile might reduce the value of it, so much so that you feel on edge owning it - then it is absolutely the worst thing you can do. Don't let a dream car be an anchor around your neck.
Edited by Durzel on Friday 31st August 10:49
WDISMYL said:
There are clearly some fresh faced chaps on here who have only experienced a zero interest rate market and have concluded from ten years worth of data that they are safe sticking their money in supercars.
They probably believed Gordon Brown’s “no more boom and bust” rally cry too.
Supercars are commodities. They produce no yield (other than smiles!) and are expensive to carry - maintenance, insurance, cost of capital (close to zero obviously at the moment but now trending up) and storage. They have and always will behave like commodities, which means volatile bull and bear cycles.
Abundance of low finance costs has extended the current bull run and no one truthfully knows when it will end. But it’s also true that it’s usually the guys who think there is a known bottom who define the eventual bottom when they are forced to sell!
Don’t buy at a level where you will be forced to sell on a downturn. Bear markets in supercars are vicious and take no prisoners. There will be another one.
If you would be forced to sell at any given price point don’t buy a supercar.
+1They probably believed Gordon Brown’s “no more boom and bust” rally cry too.
Supercars are commodities. They produce no yield (other than smiles!) and are expensive to carry - maintenance, insurance, cost of capital (close to zero obviously at the moment but now trending up) and storage. They have and always will behave like commodities, which means volatile bull and bear cycles.
Abundance of low finance costs has extended the current bull run and no one truthfully knows when it will end. But it’s also true that it’s usually the guys who think there is a known bottom who define the eventual bottom when they are forced to sell!
Don’t buy at a level where you will be forced to sell on a downturn. Bear markets in supercars are vicious and take no prisoners. There will be another one.
If you would be forced to sell at any given price point don’t buy a supercar.
jakesmith said:
Gen 1 R8 V10 manual seems such a good option.
£60k to buy, got to be cheap to run compared to the others
Limited depreciation potential as a cheaper buy and manual v10 got to hold value for future
Understated and exotic
Got to be a bargain
I sure hope you're right. £60k to buy, got to be cheap to run compared to the others
Limited depreciation potential as a cheaper buy and manual v10 got to hold value for future
Understated and exotic
Got to be a bargain
This is mine:
I believe people forgot the most important thing! We are only here for a limited period of time...and my God once you past you're 30's feels like time is flying too fast! Just like a supercar accelerates to 60mph!
Go and enjoy your life..whatever that means to you?! Cars,holidays,womens etc
Bought my Gallardo nearly 2 years ago and it took me 10 years of hard work..paid cash and i don't even care that i have dropped 100k on a car.I loved every minute with her and still do! Mind you i'm well off your wages!
But i must warn you...all roads leads to a V12
Go and enjoy your life..whatever that means to you?! Cars,holidays,womens etc
Bought my Gallardo nearly 2 years ago and it took me 10 years of hard work..paid cash and i don't even care that i have dropped 100k on a car.I loved every minute with her and still do! Mind you i'm well off your wages!
But i must warn you...all roads leads to a V12
todea20 said:
I believe people forgot the most important thing! We are only here for a limited period of time...and my God once you past you're 30's feels like time is flying too fast! Just like a supercar accelerates to 60mph!
Go and enjoy your life..whatever that means to you?! Cars,holidays,womens etc
Bought my Gallardo nearly 2 years ago and it took me 10 years of hard work..paid cash and i don't even care that i have dropped 100k on a car.I loved every minute with her and still do! Mind you i'm well off your wages!
But i must warn you...all roads leads to a V12
Same here, currently have an LP560-4 spyder and finding my eye drawn to murci's and aventadors Go and enjoy your life..whatever that means to you?! Cars,holidays,womens etc
Bought my Gallardo nearly 2 years ago and it took me 10 years of hard work..paid cash and i don't even care that i have dropped 100k on a car.I loved every minute with her and still do! Mind you i'm well off your wages!
But i must warn you...all roads leads to a V12
markj113 said:
Same here, currently have an LP560-4 spyder and finding my eye drawn to murci's and aventadors
Gallardo still gets a lot of attention and they have aged very well but i need to own an aventador in this lifeBtw we are having a gallardo meeting at the end of september if you would like to join!
johnwilliams77 said:
Juno said:
Porsche GT3
Nissan GTR NISMO Very Rare
Audi V10 Manual
All the above should have good residuals and be reasonable to run!
GTR and ‘reasonable to run’ in the same sentence? Nissan GTR NISMO Very Rare
Audi V10 Manual
All the above should have good residuals and be reasonable to run!
IMO the NISMO has epic presence https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
Edited by Juno on Sunday 9th September 14:47
Juno said:
Yes very cheap to run I've had 7,use a specialist like Kaizer GTR,great work and very reasonable! I'm very eclectic with my car collection and the GTR puts as smile on my face as big as any other car,the Nismo is epic and will hold a strong residual as well!
IMO the NISMO has epic presence https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
Very cheap compared to what? A nissian micra or a McLaren f1?IMO the NISMO has epic presence https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
Edited by Juno on Sunday 9th September 14:47
A few friends have complained about cost of servicing/brakes and tyres. They shouldn’t complain about tyres though as those are a cost for any performance car.
johnwilliams77 said:
Very cheap compared to what? A nissian micra or a McLaren f1?
A few friends have complained about cost of servicing/brakes and tyres. They shouldn’t complain about tyres though as those are a cost for any performance car.
Very cheap to run compared to the other cars that you would be considering or cars as being suggested in this post!A few friends have complained about cost of servicing/brakes and tyres. They shouldn’t complain about tyres though as those are a cost for any performance car.
Or
Very cheap if comparing cars from 80-120k as alternative competition taking into consideration comparable performance.
You can get Alcon 400mm discs and pagid pads very reasonably priced, sure if you submit to a main dealer you might get a bigger bill for brakes!
Here we go, if you’re friends are finding things to expensive send them here KAIZER GTR
https://kaizermotor.co.uk
https://kaizermotor.co.uk
jakesmith said:
Trev450 said:
I sure hope you're right. This is mine:
I really want to buy one of these, sell the Maserati and the Boxster and buy an r8. Can’t afford the c10 tho This is mine:If you enjoy driving consider an Exige 350 sport or 410 if budget allows. They are amazing to drive but not as refined as a McLaren however they are more engaging with the manual box. I drove my 12C around Europe 3 times with no problems and in supreme comfort. It was very quick but I do prefer driving my Exige 350 sport as its more engaging. The 12C is a good choice but buy with a warranty and pay the £5kpa to keep it going. Other than a £1k service per year that will be all it costs. Expect a few weeks or even months per year away at the dealer though having niggles sorted, you may be lucky and have no faults but you could have a few but the warranty will mean the costs are zero.
The Exige is more fun but not for 2 on a European or long trip. I managed London to Edinburgh in my 350 but many would not, the 12C excels at long distance touring. So what I am saying is if you want it for an occasional hoon or trip of up to 4 hours an Exige is just as good and gets as many admiring glances and thumbs up as a supercar, and that is 100% true. If you want to take your partner on long trips or to fancy destinations get a 12C. I also have a Ferrari, F355, I haven't gelled with it and won't get another Ferrari, I have driven several different Ferrari s and they are not drivers cars IMHO. A Huracan or 911 would be a better bet than a Ferrari, for me anyway, but I still prefer an Exige to drive......
The Exige is more fun but not for 2 on a European or long trip. I managed London to Edinburgh in my 350 but many would not, the 12C excels at long distance touring. So what I am saying is if you want it for an occasional hoon or trip of up to 4 hours an Exige is just as good and gets as many admiring glances and thumbs up as a supercar, and that is 100% true. If you want to take your partner on long trips or to fancy destinations get a 12C. I also have a Ferrari, F355, I haven't gelled with it and won't get another Ferrari, I have driven several different Ferrari s and they are not drivers cars IMHO. A Huracan or 911 would be a better bet than a Ferrari, for me anyway, but I still prefer an Exige to drive......
Late to this particular party, but if £120k is a hard limit, that rules out a lot of supercars. Difficulty is that the market is currently very inflated so if there is an adjustment due to a bad Brexit or whatever, you could lose a big chunk very quickly unexpectedly. Especially at the Ferrari lower end, the £70k - £100k Ferraris. Probably all a good 20% or more than they should be. The most realistically priced cars, and hence the safest depreciation wise I would have thought, are probably the early Gallardos, they've been £70k for about 8 years by my reckoning. Whereas the equivalent aged Ferraris have essentially doubled in price.
But then if you're fancying a Gallardo, you could save a packet and buy yourself an R8 V10 that's 5 years newer for £25k less. I came out of a 997 GTS for one and don't regret it.
I struggle with current prices for 355s, 360s, and 430s, and they''ll all be old cars with increased maintenance reqs, which could be a nasty combo if prices drop. Plus everything other than the 430 is slow by modern supercar standards (your Porsche will feel quicker) which may or may not be an issue. So 599 seems like better value if you're going the less modern route, but again potentially pricey to look after.
"Sensible" choice in my head would be a California from a main dealer with warranty for ~£100K. Given your circumstances (money to spend but want a cap on running costs), it seems a good fit.
Or a left field choice would be an early V12 Vantage and a slush fund.
Wouldn't personally go near an old Macca without a mahussive slush fund.
So:
early Gallardo for most accurately priced / least depreciation risk option
early R8 V10 for Gallardo experience for less money
cheap 599 for "proper" supercar that feels less overpriced than its contempories
dealer California with warranty for running cost peace of mind
early V12 Vantage for the left field hairy chested manual gearbox choice
For £120k I'd buy and early 599 and keep a £20k fund
For £100k I'd buy the Cali from the dealer
For £75k I'd get the V12 Vantage, but it'd be a very close call with the Gallardo
For "spend as little as poss but upgrade from Porsche" I'd go early R8 V10 manual
But then if you're fancying a Gallardo, you could save a packet and buy yourself an R8 V10 that's 5 years newer for £25k less. I came out of a 997 GTS for one and don't regret it.
I struggle with current prices for 355s, 360s, and 430s, and they''ll all be old cars with increased maintenance reqs, which could be a nasty combo if prices drop. Plus everything other than the 430 is slow by modern supercar standards (your Porsche will feel quicker) which may or may not be an issue. So 599 seems like better value if you're going the less modern route, but again potentially pricey to look after.
"Sensible" choice in my head would be a California from a main dealer with warranty for ~£100K. Given your circumstances (money to spend but want a cap on running costs), it seems a good fit.
Or a left field choice would be an early V12 Vantage and a slush fund.
Wouldn't personally go near an old Macca without a mahussive slush fund.
So:
early Gallardo for most accurately priced / least depreciation risk option
early R8 V10 for Gallardo experience for less money
cheap 599 for "proper" supercar that feels less overpriced than its contempories
dealer California with warranty for running cost peace of mind
early V12 Vantage for the left field hairy chested manual gearbox choice
For £120k I'd buy and early 599 and keep a £20k fund
For £100k I'd buy the Cali from the dealer
For £75k I'd get the V12 Vantage, but it'd be a very close call with the Gallardo
For "spend as little as poss but upgrade from Porsche" I'd go early R8 V10 manual
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