Why do people sell cars at auction?
Discussion
It seems one of the lessons is that early legal action is important.
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk - Government's money claim online service is effective and efficiency, and pretty cheap. You can do it yourself with no problems; just have as many facts as possible, write a clear account of the issues, identify what you are owed, and press submit.
I've used it twice and been successful both times. Once was to sue a large multinational company for non-payment of salary: they forgot to file a defence, and the bailiffs went round to remove equipment to sell so I would receive my funds. I wish I'd been there - they were paid in cash to stop them taking things away.
Other was for a few £k; got paid as soon as they received notification of the action.
An alternative is to check your house insurance, as many have legal cover which extends to dealing with personal (not business) legal issues. Whilst the lawyers are typically large firms doing many cases, it's a free way to get letters sent, advice on your rights and the processes, and they can take you all the way through to the courts. I've used them too (suing a previous accountant for incorrect advice) and again was successful.
Sometimes too you have to let things go - the amount of money concerned isn't worth the time and stress spent on it. And sometimes the injustices need following up regardless of the financial sums involved.
Good luck to anyone who has valid claims; in the case in this thread, legal action isn't likely to help much given the company has gone into administration, but be sure to be in contact with the administrators. You could also report the directors for fraud to ~Companies House, who might strike them off the directors register. But I've no experience of this.
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk - Government's money claim online service is effective and efficiency, and pretty cheap. You can do it yourself with no problems; just have as many facts as possible, write a clear account of the issues, identify what you are owed, and press submit.
I've used it twice and been successful both times. Once was to sue a large multinational company for non-payment of salary: they forgot to file a defence, and the bailiffs went round to remove equipment to sell so I would receive my funds. I wish I'd been there - they were paid in cash to stop them taking things away.
Other was for a few £k; got paid as soon as they received notification of the action.
An alternative is to check your house insurance, as many have legal cover which extends to dealing with personal (not business) legal issues. Whilst the lawyers are typically large firms doing many cases, it's a free way to get letters sent, advice on your rights and the processes, and they can take you all the way through to the courts. I've used them too (suing a previous accountant for incorrect advice) and again was successful.
Sometimes too you have to let things go - the amount of money concerned isn't worth the time and stress spent on it. And sometimes the injustices need following up regardless of the financial sums involved.
Good luck to anyone who has valid claims; in the case in this thread, legal action isn't likely to help much given the company has gone into administration, but be sure to be in contact with the administrators. You could also report the directors for fraud to ~Companies House, who might strike them off the directors register. But I've no experience of this.
xcentric said:
It seems one of the lessons is that early legal action is important.
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk - Government's money claim online service is effective and efficiency, and pretty cheap. You can do it yourself with no problems; just have as many facts as possible, write a clear account of the issues, identify what you are owed, and press submit.
I've used it twice and been successful both times. Once was to sue a large multinational company for non-payment of salary: they forgot to file a defence, and the bailiffs went round to remove equipment to sell so I would receive my funds. I wish I'd been there - they were paid in cash to stop them taking things away.
Other was for a few £k; got paid as soon as they received notification of the action.
An alternative is to check your house insurance, as many have legal cover which extends to dealing with personal (not business) legal issues. Whilst the lawyers are typically large firms doing many cases, it's a free way to get letters sent, advice on your rights and the processes, and they can take you all the way through to the courts. I've used them too (suing a previous accountant for incorrect advice) and again was successful.
Sometimes too you have to let things go - the amount of money concerned isn't worth the time and stress spent on it. And sometimes the injustices need following up regardless of the financial sums involved.
Good luck to anyone who has valid claims; in the case in this thread, legal action isn't likely to help much given the company has gone into administration, but be sure to be in contact with the administrators. You could also report the directors for fraud to ~Companies House, who might strike them off the directors register. But I've no experience of this.
Probably one of the most useful post on this threadhttps://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk - Government's money claim online service is effective and efficiency, and pretty cheap. You can do it yourself with no problems; just have as many facts as possible, write a clear account of the issues, identify what you are owed, and press submit.
I've used it twice and been successful both times. Once was to sue a large multinational company for non-payment of salary: they forgot to file a defence, and the bailiffs went round to remove equipment to sell so I would receive my funds. I wish I'd been there - they were paid in cash to stop them taking things away.
Other was for a few £k; got paid as soon as they received notification of the action.
An alternative is to check your house insurance, as many have legal cover which extends to dealing with personal (not business) legal issues. Whilst the lawyers are typically large firms doing many cases, it's a free way to get letters sent, advice on your rights and the processes, and they can take you all the way through to the courts. I've used them too (suing a previous accountant for incorrect advice) and again was successful.
Sometimes too you have to let things go - the amount of money concerned isn't worth the time and stress spent on it. And sometimes the injustices need following up regardless of the financial sums involved.
Good luck to anyone who has valid claims; in the case in this thread, legal action isn't likely to help much given the company has gone into administration, but be sure to be in contact with the administrators. You could also report the directors for fraud to ~Companies House, who might strike them off the directors register. But I've no experience of this.
So said:
Guys, this is an interesting and important thread. But it would be a lot easier to read with some paragraphs, not just a solid block of text.
Completely off thread but i think you may have a point, when i read my own posts i sometimes read the same sentence twice or even miss one altogether and most of them are not exactly short. Not to good on the pc and still using one finger ,ad the fact that i suffer from dyslexia i've got a job knowing where the full stops and comers go let alone paragraphs , What takes you guys five minutes can sometimes take me an hour but i will have a go , lets just say room for improvement .Thanks for pointing this out .Edited by rat rod on Saturday 13th June 18:56
rat rod said:
Cheib said:
Adamski007 said:
I'm in the middle of a Coys nightmare... It started yesterday when I was pulled over by four police cars on the A11, a full-on synchronised tactical swoop. It was impressive. I learned that my car, which I bought at a Coys auction in February, had been reported stolen. It transpired that while I paid for the car in full (Coys wouldn't have let me drive it away if I hadn't) they never passed the money on to the previous owner. And then they went into administration and by the sounds of things liquidation. The previous owner, having received no money and been given the run around, had no idea where his car was and reported it stolen.
The police are on it and know I bought the car in good faith but they say I cannot drive the car until the civil action has been resolved, and that doesn't sound like a matter of days to me. To make matters worse, I have finally been put in touch the the previous owner and his lawyer has advised him it's a criminal matter and not to take the car off the stolen register. He says Coys told him it didn't sell. Apparently he also agreed a £30k reserve on it, and I bought it on the hammer at £21k.
It's all a massive ballache. I just want to be able to drive the car again. Has anyone had experience of this sort of thing?
Oh FFS I am sorry to read this what a nightmare. It’s s shame that when Coys was still trading the issues with Coys couldn’t be disseminated via this forum. On a Porsche forum 911 UK they’ve got a much more community minded approach. The police are on it and know I bought the car in good faith but they say I cannot drive the car until the civil action has been resolved, and that doesn't sound like a matter of days to me. To make matters worse, I have finally been put in touch the the previous owner and his lawyer has advised him it's a criminal matter and not to take the car off the stolen register. He says Coys told him it didn't sell. Apparently he also agreed a £30k reserve on it, and I bought it on the hammer at £21k.
It's all a massive ballache. I just want to be able to drive the car again. Has anyone had experience of this sort of thing?
Edited by rat rod on Friday 12th June 21:18
Cheib said:
I was referring to Coys which there were threads on there about too. Sorry you got caught up in Gmund ! At least those two and SCoM are no longer with us.
Sorry didn't realise you were referring to Coy's,i should have baring in mind that was the subject. No i haven't read that one on the 911 UK forum. I dodged a bullet with Andrew Mearns at Gmund ,lucky for me , I fell for a RSR clone which he said Tuthill's Porsche had done all the work on, it was on his stand at the N,E.C and i offered him a straight swop with my manual Gallardo knowing full well being a dealer he will want some money to change. He wanted £20k difference so i said i will have a think about it,the following day he rang me and said he would deal at £10k and before i could call him back he lelf a message saying that he would do the swop.after all. So in less than 24 hours he came down £20k. I phoned Tuthill's and they couldn't recall the car at all and it didn't help as i didn't know the previous owners name,.by then i 'd taken my rose tinted glass's off and decided not to deal. If the car was on sale or return it would be highly likely that the owner would not have been paid especially around that time even allowing for the fact that he had sold the Gallardo to the trade for considerably less than the price of the RSR . I'm in no doubt that i would now be fighting for the title of the RSR with my Gallardo long gone ! As you say at least they've gone ,we just got to be on guard for the next ones. rat rod said:
Completely off thread but i think you may have a point, when i read my own posts i sometimes read the same sentence twice or even miss one altogether and most of them are not exactly short. Not to good on the pc and still using one finger ,ad the fact that i suffer from dyslexia i've got a job knowing where the full stops and comers go let alone paragraphs , What takes you guys five minutes can sometimes take me an hour but i will have a go , lets just say room for improvement .Thanks for pointing this out .
You are doing just fine rat, write any way you like its not school on here!Edited by rat rod on Saturday 13th June 18:56
cayman-black said:
rat rod said:
Completely off thread but i think you may have a point, when i read my own posts i sometimes read the same sentence twice or even miss one altogether and most of them are not exactly short. Not to good on the pc and still using one finger ,ad the fact that i suffer from dyslexia i've got a job knowing where the full stops and comers go let alone paragraphs , What takes you guys five minutes can sometimes take me an hour but i will have a go , lets just say room for improvement .Thanks for pointing this out .
You are doing just fine rat, write any way you like its not school on here!Edited by rat rod on Saturday 13th June 18:56
Edited by rat rod on Sunday 14th June 20:41
rat rod said:
Thanks cayman-black much appreciated ,Now they have recognised Dyslexia as a learning disorder and actually put a name to it life has been made a lot easier especially for the young.It's a long long time since i've been at school and it was not really recognised let alone put a name to it ,oh ye remember the word thick a few times.Kids can be so cruel ,lucky i've got thick skin that has helped me though life,no pun intended.
You are in good company with Jackie Stewart my friend.Edited by rat rod on Sunday 14th June 20:41
cgt2 said:
rat rod said:
Thanks cayman-black much appreciated ,Now they have recognised Dyslexia as a learning disorder and actually put a name to it life has been made a lot easier especially for the young.It's a long long time since i've been at school and it was not really recognised let alone put a name to it ,oh ye remember the word thick a few times.Kids can be so cruel ,lucky i've got thick skin that has helped me though life,no pun intended.
You are in good company with Jackie Stewart my friend.Edited by rat rod on Sunday 14th June 20:41
Adamski007 said:
"The new owner had a knock at the door from the police saying that the Ferrari 330 GTC he now owned was reported stolen, same as this case, the owner reported the car as stolen as he hasn't been payed by Coy's,after a Solicitor's letter or two the new owner did get title to the car and i was told the poor guy who lost the Ferrari was prosecuted for wasting police time to add salt into the wound."
Well, if the previous owner gets told to drop the report of stealing that would be a huge relief to me and I can drive my car again. He can go after Coys for fraud and I hope he wins but I'm really stressed out about being drawn into this having done nothing wrong. I bought the car at a price I was happy with, paid for it on the day, and am 100% happy with the car, it's wonderful... and then learned yesterday the previous owner had reported it stolen.
Horrendous situation for both you and the vendor.Well, if the previous owner gets told to drop the report of stealing that would be a huge relief to me and I can drive my car again. He can go after Coys for fraud and I hope he wins but I'm really stressed out about being drawn into this having done nothing wrong. I bought the car at a price I was happy with, paid for it on the day, and am 100% happy with the car, it's wonderful... and then learned yesterday the previous owner had reported it stolen.
You should get some professional, insured advice. However, I would anticipate that you should be deemed to have good title to the car. The auction house was acting as agent for the vendor, and any dispute about that contract is between those parties.
Best of luck.
rat rod said:
Cheib said:
I was referring to Coys which there were threads on there about too. Sorry you got caught up in Gmund ! At least those two and SCoM are no longer with us.
Sorry didn't realise you were referring to Coy's,i should have baring in mind that was the subject. No i haven't read that one on the 911 UK forum. I dodged a bullet with Andrew Mearns at Gmund ,lucky for me , I fell for a RSR clone which he said Tuthill's Porsche had done all the work on, it was on his stand at the N,E.C and i offered him a straight swop with my manual Gallardo knowing full well being a dealer he will want some money to change. He wanted £20k difference so i said i will have a think about it,the following day he rang me and said he would deal at £10k and before i could call him back he lelf a message saying that he would do the swop.after all. So in less than 24 hours he came down £20k. I phoned Tuthill's and they couldn't recall the car at all and it didn't help as i didn't know the previous owners name,.by then i 'd taken my rose tinted glass's off and decided not to deal. If the car was on sale or return it would be highly likely that the owner would not have been paid especially around that time even allowing for the fact that he had sold the Gallardo to the trade for considerably less than the price of the RSR . I'm in no doubt that i would now be fighting for the title of the RSR with my Gallardo long gone ! As you say at least they've gone ,we just got to be on guard for the next ones. Cheib said:
No problem and glad you missed the Gmund mare. I looked at a car Tuthill had done some work on earlier this year....not a “full Tuthill” but they were very happy to talk me through what they had done in a lot of detail. The Coys stuff was going on for quite a while...amazing how they stayed in business so long.
Ye i'd be the one on here now asking advise.The car i was looking at disappeared off his web site so i think the owner may have got wind of what was going on and took it back as i noticed the cars that had been sold had that across their photo's ,Tuthill's were helpful and friendly but just couldn't remember the car which i thought odd as it had a carbon fibre doors, bonnet and roof with gutter delete extended arches, full roll bar and light weight interior so not a small job buy any means.Have been keeping my eyes open just in case it's advertised elsewhere. With Coy 's it wasn't a case of will it rather than when. I suppose it wouldn't make any difference whether the cars were sold under or over the reserve as the venders wouldn't get the funds anyway.Feel for them they were like lambs to the slaughter .A guy i sold a Galaxie race car to entered and sold it at that auction and he won't get paid for it,l wish he had contacted me first, Buy selling under the agreed reserve that is so blatant as to what they were up to,l can't believe they can get away with it but i expect they will yet again ,even the showroom is still open ! rat rod said:
Ye i'd be the one on here now asking advise.The car i was looking at disappeared off his web site so i think the owner may have got wind of what was going on and took it back as i noticed the cars that had been sold had that across their photo's ,Tuthill's were helpful and friendly but just couldn't remember the car which i thought odd as it had a carbon fibre doors, bonnet and roof with gutter delete extended arches, full roll bar and light weight interior so not a small job buy any means.Have been keeping my eyes open just in case it's advertised elsewhere. With Coy 's it wasn't a case of will it rather than when. I suppose it wouldn't make any difference whether the cars were sold under or over the reserve as the venders wouldn't get the funds anyway.Feel for them they were like lambs to the slaughter .A guy i sold a Galaxie race car to entered and sold it at that auction and he won't get paid for it,l wish he had contacted me first, Buy selling under the agreed reserve that is so blatant as to what they were up to,l can't believe they can get away with it but i expect they will yet again ,even the showroom is still open !
It seems remarkable to me that the owners of the cars in the showroom weren't queuing up to collect them on the day the news broke! Looks (from the outside) like business as usual!But then I was surprised that the business continued at all after the episode a few years ago. Even with the power of the internet it appears that many people don't do much due diligence on entities to whom they effectively entrust tens of thousands of pounds.
will_ said:
It seems remarkable to me that the owners of the cars in the showroom weren't queuing up to collect them on the day the news broke! Looks (from the outside) like business as usual!
But then I was surprised that the business continued at all after the episode a few years ago. Even with the power of the internet it appears that many people don't do much due diligence on entities to whom they effectively entrust tens of thousands of pounds.
Lockdown probably did them a favour as by the time the vendors had realised they were not getting paid they were legally closed.They made themselfs invisible when they wanted to be at the best of times.The only reason i knew that my old Galaxie was sold in the that auction was that i received a phone call from the buyer checking on the cars history and telling me that he thought Coy's were a bunch of crooks and most unhelpful and that was before they went into liquidation.But then I was surprised that the business continued at all after the episode a few years ago. Even with the power of the internet it appears that many people don't do much due diligence on entities to whom they effectively entrust tens of thousands of pounds.
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