head gasket on a mk1 golf
Discussion
deltaf said:
Whyd ya need to remove the manifolds then? Just disconnect the exhaust at the downpipe, and take the head off complete with both intake and exhaust attached......easy enough to do...just "phone a friend" (if ya have any available ) to help you lift it off the block. Sorted.
hah, very funny ;
Having a bit of a problem. I can't see any way of undoing the inlet manifold bolts with the head in the car. You just can't get enough leverage in the tiny space available. The manifold is a solid piece all the way to the centre box, it won't come out past the drive shafts and bulkhead while it is attached to the head.
Is it possible to remove the exhaust manifold bolts with the inlet manifold in place?
Desperately looking for suggestions at the moment, as I just can't see how it is possible to remove the inlet manifold!
Well, all changed now.
Both sets of manifolds bolts were a real bitch to get to.
It turns out that the Mk1 Golf Haynes manual is absolute rubbish, I know they don't hev the best reputation but i've seen a few and they pretty much have good information, just a bit idiosyncratic in their layout and descriptions. The mk1 Golf manual is easily the worst i've seen, little things like having no information about anything seems to have slipped past the editors.
Cue much swearing when trying to put the injectors back in, the fact that they pulled out with the rubber seal in the head, doesn't mean you can push them back in with the rubber seal still in the head, as doing that pushes the seals down into the cylinder. Time to take the head off again...
Everything is back in place, however I have a slight problem. She doesn't run anymore
Tried turning her over but she didn't even attempt to fire, I noticed that I hadn't reconnected the cold start valve, so i'm hoping that is the reason and now it's totally flooded. I'm more resigned to the fact that the timing has probably gone completely out though, as the fuel system has re-pressurised and i've double checked that everything is connected up as it should be.
I don't see how the timing got knocked out so much that it won't even fire though, as I was a bad boy and didn't even take out the cam shaft, just pulled the head and replaced the gasket. The cam stayed in the same position, the crank stayed in the same position, the adjustable pulley stayed in the same position.
I don't suppose anybody has any genius ideas?
Both sets of manifolds bolts were a real bitch to get to.
It turns out that the Mk1 Golf Haynes manual is absolute rubbish, I know they don't hev the best reputation but i've seen a few and they pretty much have good information, just a bit idiosyncratic in their layout and descriptions. The mk1 Golf manual is easily the worst i've seen, little things like having no information about anything seems to have slipped past the editors.
Cue much swearing when trying to put the injectors back in, the fact that they pulled out with the rubber seal in the head, doesn't mean you can push them back in with the rubber seal still in the head, as doing that pushes the seals down into the cylinder. Time to take the head off again...
Everything is back in place, however I have a slight problem. She doesn't run anymore
Tried turning her over but she didn't even attempt to fire, I noticed that I hadn't reconnected the cold start valve, so i'm hoping that is the reason and now it's totally flooded. I'm more resigned to the fact that the timing has probably gone completely out though, as the fuel system has re-pressurised and i've double checked that everything is connected up as it should be.
I don't see how the timing got knocked out so much that it won't even fire though, as I was a bad boy and didn't even take out the cam shaft, just pulled the head and replaced the gasket. The cam stayed in the same position, the crank stayed in the same position, the adjustable pulley stayed in the same position.
I don't suppose anybody has any genius ideas?
Told ya (about the gasket) :P
I rebuilt the engine, fiited it and gearbox, clutch, new suspension all round... all went smoothly - and I put that down to not owning a Haynes manual!
No ideas why yours aint starting though, sorry.
You really sure about not moving the camshaft?
Easy to check the crankshaft to camshaft - you know there is an indent/mark on the flywheel, visible through the little inspection cover on top of bellhousing?
Cheers, Phil
I rebuilt the engine, fiited it and gearbox, clutch, new suspension all round... all went smoothly - and I put that down to not owning a Haynes manual!
No ideas why yours aint starting though, sorry.
You really sure about not moving the camshaft?
Easy to check the crankshaft to camshaft - you know there is an indent/mark on the flywheel, visible through the little inspection cover on top of bellhousing?
Cheers, Phil
deltaf said:
Check the cam timing again. Have you got fuel pressure? :scratcchin:
Undone the fuel hose slightly just after the filter, after running the pump for a few seconds, and fuel pee'd out. Whether the fuel is getting past there and into the injectors I don't know, but I don't see why it wouldn't be. I only pulled out the injectors and put them back in, nothing else fancy.
I'm pretty sure it's going to end up being the timing, although i'm certain nothing moved when the head was off...
I don't want to do any damage though, as I've got big valves and I've been told that it's possible to break something if you start fiddling. Any chance of a crash course on setting the timing? I'm still very much in the learning phase of my mechanic career, but i'm not afraid to give things a go. Ordinarily i'd trust the directions in the Haynes manual, but not after today
>> Edited by trooper1212 on Saturday 25th September 23:07
Have you had a plug lead off and connected to a spare spark plug to check that you've got a spark? Did you mark the spark plug leads so that you're sure they're on the right plugs?
I think on a Mk.1 the timing belt also does the intermediate shaft that drives the dizzy - obviously it's important that this hasn't moved either.
Should really have the necessary covers off, set the crank at TDC, and see if the marks on the intermediate shaft sprocket and the camshaft sprocket are in the right place. Haynes may be crap, but should at least give info. on the rough timing marks.
If all the above is OK, and you've said fuel pressure is OK, then you must have forgotten an electrical connection somewhere. Have a good root around and check that there isn't a spare wire here or there!
Best of luck
I think on a Mk.1 the timing belt also does the intermediate shaft that drives the dizzy - obviously it's important that this hasn't moved either.
Should really have the necessary covers off, set the crank at TDC, and see if the marks on the intermediate shaft sprocket and the camshaft sprocket are in the right place. Haynes may be crap, but should at least give info. on the rough timing marks.
If all the above is OK, and you've said fuel pressure is OK, then you must have forgotten an electrical connection somewhere. Have a good root around and check that there isn't a spare wire here or there!
Best of luck
Nel is correct.
The intermediate shaft drives the dizzy.(beat me to it mate! dam!)
To set the cam timing, set number 1 cylinder at TDC, using either the pulley end mark or the tdc mark at the gearbox end.
Then take a look at the back of the cam sprocket.
Theres usually a small dimple that should be level with the top of the gasket surface at the front of the car. If its the other side(ie the rear of the car) its 180 degrees out, just turn the engine over another rev and it should line up.
Then when both are lined up take a look at the intermediate shaft pulley.
Theres also a dimple on that but its on the front face.
It should be lined up close to the one on the crank pulley, ie, opposite it like this (crank pulley)-> <-(intermediate shaft pulley).
Then pull off the dizzy cap and have a look at which way the rotor is facing.
It should be pointing towards Number 1 cylinder.
If it is then put on the timing belt , making sure not to disturb the settings. This will be close enough to get it to fire/run.
****last resort, pain in the ass job***
If the rotor isnt lined up, then youll have to remove the dizzy and line it up with the number one segment on the cap while pushing it back into place AND getting it to engage in the oil pump drive. It will require some guesswork to do this bit as when the dizzy is pushed home, the rotor will turn, putting the ignition timing out again, which will require a re-set to get it right.
Not recommended if youve any doubts about your skills!
HTH.
The intermediate shaft drives the dizzy.(beat me to it mate! dam!)
To set the cam timing, set number 1 cylinder at TDC, using either the pulley end mark or the tdc mark at the gearbox end.
Then take a look at the back of the cam sprocket.
Theres usually a small dimple that should be level with the top of the gasket surface at the front of the car. If its the other side(ie the rear of the car) its 180 degrees out, just turn the engine over another rev and it should line up.
Then when both are lined up take a look at the intermediate shaft pulley.
Theres also a dimple on that but its on the front face.
It should be lined up close to the one on the crank pulley, ie, opposite it like this (crank pulley)-> <-(intermediate shaft pulley).
Then pull off the dizzy cap and have a look at which way the rotor is facing.
It should be pointing towards Number 1 cylinder.
If it is then put on the timing belt , making sure not to disturb the settings. This will be close enough to get it to fire/run.
****last resort, pain in the ass job***
If the rotor isnt lined up, then youll have to remove the dizzy and line it up with the number one segment on the cap while pushing it back into place AND getting it to engage in the oil pump drive. It will require some guesswork to do this bit as when the dizzy is pushed home, the rotor will turn, putting the ignition timing out again, which will require a re-set to get it right.
Not recommended if youve any doubts about your skills!
HTH.
Checked spark and that is ok.
Rotated the crank so that piston no.1 is at TDC (assuming piston no.1 is at the pulley side of the engine!) At this point the timing mark on the inside of the cam pulley is lined up with the rocker gasket. I have another mark on the OUTSIDE of the pulley which is about 150 degrees out when the inner pulley mark is ligned up, but i'm sure the inner mark is the correct one to be using.
When piston no.1 is at TDC, the dizzy point seems to be 10 degrees before point 1 on the cap, I haven't moved the bottom end of the engine at all when the head was off, so if this has been misaligned I don't know why. Does the dizzy point need to be aligned with point 1 on the cap at TDC whne it isn't under pressure, or when it is? I can spring it into position, but it springs back to 10 degrees off when i let go.
It's not even trying to kick, just turning over with nothing.
All leads are connected and in the right order.
Rotated the crank so that piston no.1 is at TDC (assuming piston no.1 is at the pulley side of the engine!) At this point the timing mark on the inside of the cam pulley is lined up with the rocker gasket. I have another mark on the OUTSIDE of the pulley which is about 150 degrees out when the inner pulley mark is ligned up, but i'm sure the inner mark is the correct one to be using.
When piston no.1 is at TDC, the dizzy point seems to be 10 degrees before point 1 on the cap, I haven't moved the bottom end of the engine at all when the head was off, so if this has been misaligned I don't know why. Does the dizzy point need to be aligned with point 1 on the cap at TDC whne it isn't under pressure, or when it is? I can spring it into position, but it springs back to 10 degrees off when i let go.
It's not even trying to kick, just turning over with nothing.
All leads are connected and in the right order.
well, half success.
Rotating the dizzy has given me a running engine, but she won't idle, so I assume it's blown an air hose off somewhere under the airbox (as it did that before)
The rocker cover gasket was pissing out oil onto the exhaust manifold due to one of the studs being crossthreaded, which i've now dropped down into the engine bay and i can't find.
I think i'm giving up for the day...
Rotating the dizzy has given me a running engine, but she won't idle, so I assume it's blown an air hose off somewhere under the airbox (as it did that before)
The rocker cover gasket was pissing out oil onto the exhaust manifold due to one of the studs being crossthreaded, which i've now dropped down into the engine bay and i can't find.
I think i'm giving up for the day...
Nice one!
Sounds like finally it was the ignition timing. Having got the car running with approximate static timing, I would strongly advise you, if you haven't aready done so, to set the ignition timing more precisely with a strobe. The consequences of not doing this can be as drastic as pre-ignition and piston melt down if you drive it hard.
Happy motoring!
Sounds like finally it was the ignition timing. Having got the car running with approximate static timing, I would strongly advise you, if you haven't aready done so, to set the ignition timing more precisely with a strobe. The consequences of not doing this can be as drastic as pre-ignition and piston melt down if you drive it hard.
Happy motoring!
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