Fuel lines and fittings

[stevieturbo]

What setup did the original car have ? I'm sure it had air filters of some sort, so what was that arrangement like ?

edit....looks like a single carb setup originally.

I'd say 38mm pipe is more than enough for each runner on the engine. I'm sure it's not a massive power house.

If the 90 deg bends must stay, or are easiest. Route them to each bank neater, and then a base with inlets/trumpets and air filter for each bank, tidied to make it pretty.

[Skyedriver]

Original set up was a 38DGAS IIRC (Single twin choke) or something similar. Circular plastic filter case sat on the top. In a Capri it's a lot further forward.


In the Gilbern


Unsure of the exact spec but my engine has been breathed on, cam, heads, exhaust....

Edited by Skyedriver on Thursday 30th March 23:33

Edited by Skyedriver on Thursday 30th March 23:34

[Skyedriver]

stevieturbo said:

I'd say 38mm pipe is more than enough for each runner on the engine. I'm sure it's not a massive power house.

.

Rolling road figures
156BHP at 5500rpm, 192 lb/ft torque at 3500rpm. I assume at the wheels.

[Skyedriver]

From the Essex V6 FB page:

[stevieturbo]

Yes, that's basically similar to what I said to do earlier. Although as your TB's and injectors are in the base, it's as simple as some short pipes into a filter base and then the filter.

[Sensibleboy]

Boosted LS1 said:

Mikey G said:

The key is make sure when you cut a pipe that it is a clean cut through the braid. I normally cover it in masking tape and use a thin cutting disc on and angle grinder to slice it.

Clamping it with a jubilee clip and then using the ngle grinder is even better :-)

Or using a big thick cable tie wrapped round the hose and cutting down the middle of the tie with a stainless steel cutting disc works perfectly. The remains of the tie can be cut off quickly too.

[normalbloke]

Sensibleboy said:

Boosted LS1 said:

Mikey G said:

The key is make sure when you cut a pipe that it is a clean cut through the braid. I normally cover it in masking tape and use a thin cutting disc on and angle grinder to slice it.

Clamping it with a jubilee clip and then using the ngle grinder is even better :-)

Or using a big thick cable tie wrapped round the hose and cutting down the middle of the tie with a stainless steel cutting disc works perfectly. The remains of the tie can be cut off quickly too.

If you’re doing a few, or a project, it’s worth buying the proper shears. Way faster,quieter, and less likely to damage the hose within ( especially true is adding aluminium fittings with olives). Plus it’s a new tool for the box.

Edited by normalbloke on Wednesday 5th April 21:51

[Skyedriver]

Not a fan of braided hose -can't see what the condition of the pipe underneath is.
These AN6 are new to me and very clever but I'm going back to proper R9 hose with good old fashioned hose clips. I have a plan.... but need to get a few jobs done elsewhere first so this project is on hold for a while.

[stevieturbo]

Skyedriver said:

Not a fan of braided hose -can't see what the condition of the pipe underneath is.
These AN6 are new to me and very clever but I'm going back to proper R9 hose with good old fashioned hose clips. I have a plan.... but need to get a few jobs done elsewhere first so this project is on hold for a while.

Most AN fittings will not be aimed towards a regular push on hose/barb

Some do a push-lock style, which is a regular rubber type hose that you push over a pretty aggressive barb, and no clip is needed. Whilst these do work, they are a right PITA to install, and can only be removed off the barb by cutting the pipe.

I think it's an Earls 700106 http://www.earls.co.uk/earls100/earls_shop/index.p...

Too many part numbers in my head lol

Which is a pretty close fit for an 8mm ID rubber hose and clip, but to screw onto an AN06 fitting. I think the barb is a little bigger than 8mm so it is a tight fit, but it's about the closest and most suitable I used for what you suggest.
Although I probably haven't used that route in over 10 years or so.

[Skyedriver]

New feeds to the TBs

[witko999]

It looks much tidier but it's a hell of a lot of pipe clamps and potential leak points. Can you not link each fuel rail directly with a single hose? Then you'd have your feed on one side of the engine and your return on the other.

[stevieturbo]

witko999 said:

It looks much tidier but it's a hell of a lot of pipe clamps and potential leak points. Can you not link each fuel rail directly with a single hose? Then you'd have your feed on one side of the engine and your return on the other.

Certainly a single feed and then tee at the end of each rail would be neater, this sort of thing on the end of the rail. then a common feed in one and, with a return on the other side.


https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/150631394074?hash=item2...

Just seems odd the way they added the injectors in the middle of the intake, although perhaps necessary with the throttle linkage in the side, perhaps blocking a more normal, close to the intake valve position for the injectors.

[E-bmw]

On the subject of what to do next to get a better arrangement there is only 1 possible solution I can think of.

If you were to get a plenum made up above the front 4 with short straight intake tubes, but ensure it isn't too big so as to limit access for the bolts underneath, you could then get 2 x 90 degree intakes to go towards the rear 2 intakes.

Depending on preference you could then either use 1 or 2 intakes towards the front of the car, or 1 pointing towards a bonnet/scuttle intake and a foam panel filter sized to suit.

[stevieturbo]

E-bmw said:

On the subject of what to do next to get a better arrangement there is only 1 possible solution I can think of.

If you were to get a plenum made up above the front 4 with short straight intake tubes, but ensure it isn't too big so as to limit access for the bolts underneath, you could then get 2 x 90 degree intakes to go towards the rear 2 intakes.

Depending on preference you could then either use 1 or 2 intakes towards the front of the car, or 1 pointing towards a bonnet/scuttle intake and a foam panel filter sized to suit.

Simplest is literally just make up a base plate for a filter onto the existing alloy bends, then get a filter to suit

[Skyedriver]

E-bmw said:

On the subject of what to do next to get a better arrangement there is only 1 possible solution I can think of.

If you were to get a plenum made up above the front 4 with short straight intake tubes, but ensure it isn't too big so as to limit access for the bolts underneath, you could then get 2 x 90 degree intakes to go towards the rear 2 intakes.

Depending on preference you could then either use 1 or 2 intakes towards the front of the car, or 1 pointing towards a bonnet/scuttle intake and a foam panel filter sized to suit.

That's what I have in mind although I was thinking an ITG sponge filter on top with two holes for the rear two pipes or had contemplated using a K&N custom filter cut down with a solid face to the rear with two pipes out but that was widely criticised....

[Skyedriver]

stevieturbo said:

Simplest is literally just make up a base plate for a filter onto the existing alloy bends, then get a filter to suit

My other option Steve, I've cardboard templates for the ITG JC 200 and 300 filters using a solid back plate cut to suit.
Pulling the fuel lines into the side of the TBs makes that option easier but it's still a close fit to the underside of the bonnet.

Project on hold until I sort out the fuel tank disaster.
Could old petrol, or maybe there's been some E10 put in and left, really have rotted the brass drain plug? I find it very hard to believe but also find it hard to believe that Tony would have wrenched it so tight, to the point of shearing and left it. He was simply too good an engineer to do that.

[stevieturbo]

Skyedriver said:

My other option Steve, I've cardboard templates for the ITG JC 200 and 300 filters using a solid back plate cut to suit.
Pulling the fuel lines into the side of the TBs makes that option easier but it's still a close fit to the underside of the bonnet.

Project on hold until I sort out the fuel tank disaster.
Could old petrol, or maybe there's been some E10 put in and left, really have rotted the brass drain plug? I find it very hard to believe but also find it hard to believe that Tony would have wrenched it so tight, to the point of shearing and left it. He was simply too good an engineer to do that.

It's an old car....I'd say nothing other than age has done it.

Does it really need to come out ?

Just drain the tank via the pump/outlet, and if the tank needs work, there are places who can re-line them etc

[Mikey G]

E-bmw said:

If you were to get a plenum made up above the front 4 with short straight intake tubes, but ensure it isn't too big so as to limit access for the bolts underneath, you could then get 2 x 90 degree intakes to go towards the rear 2 intakes.

Only issue with this would be the odd lengths of the inlet tracts. You could get around this by increasing the diameter on the rear 2 inlet bends but by how much I have no idea. I'm sure someone cleverer would have a calculator that does it

I would be looking at 3 equal adapter blocks that angle forward enough to clear the rear bulkhead and high enough to clear the fuel rails. You could then put a filter baseplate on this with trumpets on top, but again bonnet clearance may be an issue. Either way it isnt a cheap project to tidy up. Its a shame maybe a later plenum inlet from an injected V6 couldnt be adapted to fit, or go back to a carb manifold and see if there is an 'injected carb' like the 4 barrel Holley that would fit. I'm sure most of that could be funded by the sale of the current Jenvey setup.

[E-bmw]

Mikey G said:

E-bmw said:

If you were to get a plenum made up above the front 4 with short straight intake tubes, but ensure it isn't too big so as to limit access for the bolts underneath, you could then get 2 x 90 degree intakes to go towards the rear 2 intakes.

Only issue with this would be the odd lengths of the inlet tracts. You could get around this by increasing the diameter on the rear 2 inlet bends but by how much I have no idea. I'm sure someone cleverer would have a calculator that does it

Surely, they wouldn't be that different.

The rears would be shorter than they currently are to move the plenum/filter housing as far back as possible & the front 4 would protrude into the plenum/filter housing a short way.

No expert of course, just sayin'.

[stevieturbo]

Really wouldn't worry about the length of the trumpets.

I'd rather a neat fit and finish, easy to work on, than a few mm difference in runner length which in reality will make negligible difference.