MOT question - Lack of engine management light = MOT fail?
Discussion
Hi all 
2004 5.7 VY CV8, owned from new.
Lack of an engine management symbol illuminating on the dash when the ignition is turned on = MOT fail.
The Monaro has never had an engine management light, it uses the 'check engine' message system to notify of a fault, if one is present. In the manual, no engine light is shown on the dash diagram. But the MOT place are insisting that they can only go by what the gov mot regulations say, it must have an eml light, so I cancelled the test. I've had the car from new and it's never been an issue until recently. The symbol is actually behind the dash mask, despite being completely inoperative!
Is there any way around this? Surely there should be an exemption for the Monaro? Could the ecu be reprogrammed to activate the eml light? It is actually on the dash mask despite being completely inoperative!
Any recommendations for an understanding garage in the Stansted/Bishops Stortford area? I don't fancy driving half way across the country again for an MOT!
2004 5.7 VY CV8, owned from new.
Lack of an engine management symbol illuminating on the dash when the ignition is turned on = MOT fail.
The Monaro has never had an engine management light, it uses the 'check engine' message system to notify of a fault, if one is present. In the manual, no engine light is shown on the dash diagram. But the MOT place are insisting that they can only go by what the gov mot regulations say, it must have an eml light, so I cancelled the test. I've had the car from new and it's never been an issue until recently. The symbol is actually behind the dash mask, despite being completely inoperative!
Is there any way around this? Surely there should be an exemption for the Monaro? Could the ecu be reprogrammed to activate the eml light? It is actually on the dash mask despite being completely inoperative!
Any recommendations for an understanding garage in the Stansted/Bishops Stortford area? I don't fancy driving half way across the country again for an MOT!
The Owners manual shows all the usual warning lights on the dash and what they mean but there is NO eml light shown.
The MOT regulations were tightened up in May 2018:
It's under the 'nuisance' section 8.2.1.2:
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-inspection-manual-...
All vehicles manufactured after July 2003 need to have the MIL checked, pre-July 2003 vehicles do not.
So when the regulations changed, they instantly made all Monaros incapable of passing an MOT!
How are we managing to get our MOT's?
The MOT regulations were tightened up in May 2018:
It's under the 'nuisance' section 8.2.1.2:
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-inspection-manual-...
All vehicles manufactured after July 2003 need to have the MIL checked, pre-July 2003 vehicles do not.
So when the regulations changed, they instantly made all Monaros incapable of passing an MOT!
How are we managing to get our MOT's?
That sounds remarkably s
tty of the garage, did you sleep with the proprietor's wife or something? 
In terms of any programming etc. that won't be possible. I mean, arguably it would be if you were GM, but at consumer level, nobody is going to get that to happen beyond putting an LED behind the dash section on a timer
I'd say just try another MOT place. If you choose one where it's not offering a silly discount, they're probably less likely to look for ways to generate work for themselves
tty of the garage, did you sleep with the proprietor's wife or something? In terms of any programming etc. that won't be possible. I mean, arguably it would be if you were GM, but at consumer level, nobody is going to get that to happen beyond putting an LED behind the dash section on a timer
I'd say just try another MOT place. If you choose one where it's not offering a silly discount, they're probably less likely to look for ways to generate work for themselves
GSE said:
I may well try a LED driven on a timer cct behind the dash.
They're circuit mount LEDs and sectioned off by a white cover (it forms a grid around the various indicator LEDs so one illuminating doesn't bleed across to another)
Getting an LED in there may be a bit awkward. If you do want to go that route, make sure you mark the position of the gauge needles before taking them off, as they aren't keyed in any way, so you will need to line them back up if you don't want fuel, temp, RPM and speed to read off.
If you want to take the white plastic cover off to get better access to the LEDs, you'll need to remove the 3 screens, which are through hole soldered to the board, so a good solder sucker or a lot of solder braid to wick it all up will be needed.
Compared to going to another MOT place (personally I wouldn't use that place again if they were this unreasonable about a perfectly fine car so you'll be doing this anyway...?) it is a LOT more faff.
Well, that's a bit silly. The 2000 commodore I have ,does have a check engine light, but as its older than 2003 its not actually necessary for the MOT.
Similarly, the monaros are ulez exempt, despite only conforming to euro 2 standards, not euro4 as required. where as the commo isn't exempt, even though its the same spec.
With testing (I test motorcycles) we have to use a bit of common sense. If you've explained the car never had a CEL and it passes the emissions test, that should be sufficient.
Similarly, the monaros are ulez exempt, despite only conforming to euro 2 standards, not euro4 as required. where as the commo isn't exempt, even though its the same spec.
With testing (I test motorcycles) we have to use a bit of common sense. If you've explained the car never had a CEL and it passes the emissions test, that should be sufficient.
If you insist on using them, perhaps first have them accept that there is no light on currently...
Then, get them to unplug a rear O2 sensor, the connector is pretty easy to get to if the car is on a ramp / over a pit.
This will give a Check Engine on the centre screen and perhaps verify to their satisfaction that the warning works... I say have them accept that there's no warning because although plugging it back in should immediately clear it (perhaps an ignition cycle too), it'd be worth having them accept that it wasn't illuminated in case it doesn't immediately clear and they then continue being tossers about the whole process...
Then, get them to unplug a rear O2 sensor, the connector is pretty easy to get to if the car is on a ramp / over a pit.
This will give a Check Engine on the centre screen and perhaps verify to their satisfaction that the warning works... I say have them accept that there's no warning because although plugging it back in should immediately clear it (perhaps an ignition cycle too), it'd be worth having them accept that it wasn't illuminated in case it doesn't immediately clear and they then continue being tossers about the whole process...
As the vehicle was designed and manufactured without an eml light I would be contacting the dvsa for guidance on the matter , may be there's something In the type approval standards much like the undersized number plate technically that exempts non type approved cars from having to comply with all of the rules.
us trucks are exempt from an eml , Fred B , no luck challenging the Tfl , it does not make sense , for me not worth risking damaging the dash display , so if it was me another better mot tester , or as you said explain it to your usual garage and see what they say , if it’s a no they loose business
Every time mine goes in for mot I just tell the inspector on the day that it doesn't have an eml light, but a message that comes on if theres a problem. An eyebrow usually gets raised, then I just show him previous posts off here.
At the end of the day it's inspectors discretion, what one passes another could fail.
At the end of the day it's inspectors discretion, what one passes another could fail.
RB CV8 said:
Paul,
You know where I live; the place that maintains all our cars is a couple of minutes from me and does not have any issue with the MoT on the Monaro. They look after Ronaro's car too. Let me know if you want the details.
RB
Hi Richard, long time no see, I hope you are well!You know where I live; the place that maintains all our cars is a couple of minutes from me and does not have any issue with the MoT on the Monaro. They look after Ronaro's car too. Let me know if you want the details.
RB
The car needs a service, and some other things doing, so I'll be in touch. Actually, I need it out of the way for a few months, as we will be having some work done on the house. May be it could be stored at the place you use?
GSE said:
Hi Richard, long time no see, I hope you are well!
The car needs a service, and some other things doing, so I'll be in touch. Actually, I need it out of the way for a few months, as we will be having some work done on the house. May be it could be stored at the place you use?
Hi Paul,The car needs a service, and some other things doing, so I'll be in touch. Actually, I need it out of the way for a few months, as we will be having some work done on the house. May be it could be stored at the place you use?
I've been meaning to catch up, but I have had some unfortunate family issues to deal with. Maybe we can chat next week. I am at "the place" with my Daimler next week so I shall ask about the storage situation, though it will better for you to book the service etc for when it suits you. I could probably run you home as long as I have some notice; I doubt you'll get the bike in the Monaro!
RB
SturdyHSV said:
If you struggle, my Monaro sized garage at home (J15 M1, Northampton) is empty currently and for the forseeable future as I'm not about to start any new projects for a bit, you'd be welcome to hibernate it in there, I have a CTEK trickle charger in there too.
Happy to chat anyway
Thanks very much for the offer Happy to chat anyway
The timer kit has arrived
but I don't think that I'll bother with it. The Monaro's next run will be up to the place that Richard uses for an MOT/service, and then I'll probably store it over the winter. Edited by GSE on Thursday 8th September 17:10
RB CV8 said:
Hi Paul,
I've been meaning to catch up, but I have had some unfortunate family issues to deal with. Maybe we can chat next week. I am at "the place" with my Daimler next week so I shall ask about the storage situation, though it will better for you to book the service etc for when it suits you. I could probably run you home as long as I have some notice; I doubt you'll get the bike in the Monaro!
RB
Thanks Richard. Be in touch next week.I've been meaning to catch up, but I have had some unfortunate family issues to deal with. Maybe we can chat next week. I am at "the place" with my Daimler next week so I shall ask about the storage situation, though it will better for you to book the service etc for when it suits you. I could probably run you home as long as I have some notice; I doubt you'll get the bike in the Monaro!
RB
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