AML - Stock Market Listing

[AstonV]

Jon39 said:

KevinBird said:

From a very reliable source, there will be no facelift cars to customers until 2024

Will this delay, affect the Company's existing business targets ?

'British iconic ultra luxury car brand Aston Martin, becomes the latest automaker to reveal its electrification plan, which it has dubbed as Racing Green strategy. The carmaker now foresees itself as a PHEV focused brand in 2024 and shifting to pure electric cars is slated to happen in 2025.'


'The management target of 10’000 units in 2025 is split as follows:
Front Engine Sports Cars:...... 4,000 units
SUVs: ....................................... 4,500 units
Mid-Engine Sports Cars: ....... 1,500 units'


'By 2025;
Cars per year ............. 10,000
Revenue ..................... £2bn
Adjusted EBITDA ....... £500m'

So no changes to current lineup? Guess if they are going all EV by 2025, any updates wouldn’t be cost effective?

[KevinBird]

There will be a new strategy along tomorrow

[nathwraith1]

KevinBird said:

There will be a new strategy along tomorrow

Interesting. I’m holding off buying a sports/GT Aston until the updates arrive. I was told by my dealer that a new “db11” would be announced Aug/Sept, deliveries next summer.

Another year with the sports/GT range as is will just see the numbers drop off even further. Especially as the range overall is getting constant price rises. Even the DBX707 list has gone up by £8K base since launch.

[KevinBird]

nathwraith1 said:

new “db11” would be announced Aug/Sept, deliveries next summer.

Like the Valkyrie?

[SSO]

KevinBird said:

From a very reliable source, there will be no facelift cars to customers until 2024

Probably about right. When Stroll originally took over he did promise they would be ready in 2022........ Doubt the Valhalla will appear in anyones garage before 2025.....if at all.

[Jon39]

SSO said:

KevinBird said:

From a very reliable source, there will be no facelift cars to customers until 2024

Probably about right. When Stroll originally took over he did promise they would be ready in 2022........ Doubt the Valhalla will appear in anyones garage before 2025.....if at all.

Promises of this type are probably one result of the inappropriate (for this Company) stock market listing.
Long into the future product announcements, no doubt trying to raise short-term expectations amongst the investment community.

Without such pressures, they could just keep quiet until everything is ready, then announce the new product.
It was often done like that 'in the old days', unless they wanted to build an advance order book.

Probably counter productive to raise hope, then fail to meet expectations.

[AstonV]

Jon39 said:

SSO said:

KevinBird said:

From a very reliable source, there will be no facelift cars to customers until 2024

Probably about right. When Stroll originally took over he did promise they would be ready in 2022........ Doubt the Valhalla will appear in anyones garage before 2025.....if at all.

Promises of this type are probably one result of the inappropriate (for this Company) stock market listing.
Long into the future product announcements, no doubt trying to raise short-term expectations amongst the investment community.

Without such pressures, they could just keep quiet until everything is ready, then announce the new product.
It was often done like that 'in the old days', unless they wanted to build an advance order book.

Probably counter productive to raise hope, then fail to meet expectations.

Does not sound promising for the company or the investors. If I was an investor, I would dump my stock. So unfortunate that this company is run by such a bunch of incompetents.

[oilit]

Tbh - a facelift of the range without introducing some form of hybrid tech was probably a hiding to nothing as far as the press etc. plus any such facelift would give a life of what 12 months before another facelift with hybrid? AM can’t afford that.

The $1m question is whether they will last until 2024 (I hope they do) furthermore, they are obviously more confident of selling very limited number specials to help get the money in than of designing something that will appeal to the (relative) masses…….

[BenAstonV12]

volvodrummer said:

KevinBird said:

From a very reliable source, there will be no facelift cars to customers until 2024

Not surprised. When they said '23, I assumed revealed, marketed, taking orders with deliveries starting sometime in '24.

Exactly, that was my understanding from earlier in the year after the heads of the major dealers were at Gaydon to be updated on future plans. For any of the "new" refresh cars to be coming out next year, they would be building them now (or at least starting the new production lines) as next year's car. If that was the case, we'd have already seen some camouflage images. I was told the "new" cars will be available to order next year, meaning they will be 2024 cars (possibly some will be delivered by the very end of 2023 I guess). Only question is, will they stagger the refresh in some way? Assuming the DB11 will be first in line, or do the entire range at the same time. Only upside will be some great potential deals on 2023 model year cars for those who like the current range.

[Jon39]

AstonV said:

Does not sound promising for the company or the investors.
If I was an investor, I would dump my stock.
So unfortunate that this company is run by such a bunch of incompetents.

As a follower of this topic Steve, you probably would have never bought AML shares.

Do you think incompetents, might perhaps be considered a touch harsh ?
I always keep in mind that for 109 years, hardly any annual periods have ever been profitable and cash has repeatedly run out.
During thise years, there have been a number of very skilled people running the business and even they could not make AM financially successful.
In other words, history indicates that whoever is running the show, is on a 'hiding to nothing'.

Fortunately, there has always been such passion for the marque, that more money has repeatedly been provided in every 'hour of need'.

I am reminded of Victor Gauntlett's reply to this question.
"How long did it take, for you to accept the offer by the Ford Motor Company, to buy Aston Martin?"
"Just a fraction of a second, to bite their hand off." -

[Jon39]

BenAstonV12 said:

Exactly, that was my understanding from earlier in the year after the heads of the major dealers were at Gaydon to be updated on future plans. For any of the "new" refresh cars to be coming out next year, they would be building them now (or at least starting the new production lines) as next year's car. ...

I don't know whether the timescales have now changed, but AML did work on Model Years (September 1st to August 31st).
One example was the 'face lift' of the Vantage from 4.3 to 4.7. The change was announced on 23 May 2008. Factory annual holiday is in August, when any production line changes can take place, then the revised model began build in September 2008, as a 2009 Model year car. The first deliveries to customers was also in September 2008.

In that instance, there were quite a number of changes, but no one would notice any development cars, even if they did need to run any. Different of course when it is not a mid-cycle 'face lift', but an all new model, because then there is extensive testing with camouflaged development cars, which these days, are inevitably spotted by people with cameras.

Edited by Jon39 on Friday 19th August 19:49

[AstonV]

Jon39 said:

Do you think incompetents, might perhaps be considered a touch harsh ?

No, not really.

[TurboTerrific9]

Jon39 said:

As a follower of this topic Steve, you probably would have never bought AML shares.

Do you think incompetents, might perhaps be considered a touch harsh ?
I always keep in mind that for 109 years, hardly any annual periods have ever been profitable and cash has repeatedly run out.
During thise years, there have been a number of very skilled people running the business and even they could not make AM financially successful.
In other words, history indicates that whoever is running the show, is on a 'hiding to nothing'.

Fortunately, there has always been such passion for the marque, that more money has repeatedly been provided in every 'hour of need'.

I am reminded of Victor Gauntlett's reply to this question.
"How long did it take, for you to accept the offer by the Ford Motor Company, to buy Aston Martin?"
"Just a fraction of a second, to bite their hand off." -

Whilst you make some valid points - indeed there will many skilled practitioners within he group. They are now a PLC and as such they have to divvy up to investor needs. They seem to be way,off providing anything other than bravado to investors who would probably prefer a meaningful and believable direction forward

[GreasyHands]

Jon39 said:

Do you think incompetents, might perhaps be considered a touch harsh ?

I tend to agree it is a touch harsh and certainly shows a great deal of arrogance to boot.

Given the long and rocky history of AML ( mostly hidden in private hands) it’s clear that this was always going to be a tough journey for whoever is trying to move this company forward. Seems pretty difficult for almost anybody to make it through an entire cycle. Stroll stepped into a difficult situation and it only got worse with Covid. The fact he’s still standing is probably a decent testament to him.

I may not be a fan of the turnover at the company and tend to blame Stroll but I think I see his vision and it’s better than most of the forum armchair CEOs. Doesn’t seem like a terrible plan to me. It’s just the starting point with so much debt makes it highly unlikely. The hole is just too deep particularly with the economy looking like it’s going to be weak for a little while. Aston just has never had the wherewithal for a rainy day.

I also agree that this never made a great candidate for a public company. Best to stay somebodies vanity project and let most of us just ogle the cars.

[LTP]

GreasyHands said:

I think I see his vision and it’s better than most of the forum armchair CEOs. Doesn’t seem like a terrible plan to me.

Really? Care to explain it? Perhaps I've not been paying attention but I've not seen a credible, coherent plan; just talking "Brand!" and running down your current models doesn't really cut it..... unless your name is Ratner.

[Minglar]

LTP said:

GreasyHands said:

I think I see his vision and it’s better than most of the forum armchair CEOs. Doesn’t seem like a terrible plan to me.

Really? Care to explain it? Perhaps I've not been paying attention but I've not seen a credible, coherent plan; just talking "Brand!" and running down your current models doesn't really cut it..... unless your name is Ratner.

LTP

Totally agree with you. The level of debt that has been taken on since LS got involved is quite astonishing, and the top priority has to be to get it off the balance sheet as soon as possible. The current economic environment is hostile to a company in the position that AM finds itself. The recent funding announcement is just a sticky plaster that will only delay the inevitable imho. The world is a very different place nowadays, and marketing spiel and talk of “ultra luxury” and all the other marketing gibberish simply will not be enough to stem the tide. Talk will not boost sales, and it won’t generate the revenues required. AM will not survive in its current form if a coherent financially viable plan is not in place, and the elephant in the room, ie the debt, is not resolved very quickly. In many ways LS reminds me of Philip Green, and we all know how that went at BHS. The sooner AM is swallowed up by a larger liquid automotive name, the better imho.

Best Regards

Minglar

[LTP]

As an aside, because of my fleeting increased interest in this thread I went to find a recording of the AML presentation so I could put some of the comments ITT into context, but couldn't find one. I did manage to find a transcription that "MoneyController.UK" have posted that might be of interest.

Summary here: https://www.moneycontroller.co.uk/finance-news/ast...

Full transcript .pdf here: https://docs.publicnow.com/viewDoc?hash_primary=48...

The transcript does not have a timestamp so it's difficult to relate it directly to some of the "key moments" other posters ITT have referred to

[Jon39]

LTP said:

As an aside, because of my fleeting increased interest in this thread I went to find a recording of the AML presentation so I could put some of the comments ITT into context, but couldn't find one. I did manage to find a transcription that "MoneyController.UK" have posted that might be of interest.

Did you listen to the analyst Q&A, which followed that presentation ?

I think the link to it was removed on the AML website (possibly because there were a couple of awkward questions), but I think it was Mingler who subsequently posted a working link for us to use.

[LTP]

Jon39 said:

Did you listen to the analyst Q&A, which followed that presentation ?

I think the link to it was removed on the AML website (possibly because there were a couple of awkward questions), but I think it was Mingler who subsequently posted a working link for us to use.

No, missed that. I've had a quick look back through about 12 pages of this thread and didn't spot it, but I think the Q&A was in the full pdf, though.

[Minglar]

LTP said:

Jon39 said:

Did you listen to the analyst Q&A, which followed that presentation ?

I think the link to it was removed on the AML website (possibly because there were a couple of awkward questions), but I think it was Mingler who subsequently posted a working link for us to use.

No, missed that. I've had a quick look back through about 12 pages of this thread and didn't spot it, but I think the Q&A was in the full pdf, though.

It wasn’t me Jon. I posted the RNS which was issued the morning the H1 results were released on 29th July. Looking back through this thread I think the link may have been posted by Peavey123 on 6th August, page 182. Hope that helps.

Best Regards

Minglar