Prettiest Aston... Is It The DB7?

[8Speed]

bennno said:

baconsarney said:

bennno said:

My top 4, excluding zagato models

1. DB4 GT
2. DB5
3. V8V mk2
4. DB6

'Scuse my ignorance, whats a V8V mk2 ?

Should have just said the later 4.7 or V12 Vantage around 2012-2015.

Incorrect - the early version without the side skirts is prettier.

[N7GTX]

baconsarney said:

N7GTX said:

baconsarney said:

Prettiest Aston is the Gaydon Vantage. If you disagree with this you're clearly biased and your opinion is worthless.......

Crikey We agree on something

I thought we agreed on everything Iain?
Apart from deep fried Mars bars. Obviously.

Yes we do, sorry old bean. Getting you mixed up with LucyP

[bennno]

8Speed said:

Incorrect - the early version without the side skirts is prettier.

I was paid a big brown envelope full of cash to attend a pre launch design review of that car many moons back.

On that basis I must really buy one at some point.

[Superleg48]

Most Astons look pretty amazing in my opinion. My favourite is the newer Vanquish very closely followed by the DB9.

The reason why Astons generally look so well proportioned and aesthetically pleasing is deliberate by design. It is something called the Rule of 3. It is about the relationship of different elements being precisely 1/3 to 2/3 of each other. The below image of a DB9 illustrates how this is applied to car design. This ratio appeals to the brain’s sense of proportionality. All very scientific you know....

[Speedraser]

Jon39 said:

Speedraser said:

Jon39 said:

The 2005 Vantage is widely admired as a beautiful and well proportioned design.
Ian Callum did the majority of the design, which was then revised slightly by Mr Fisker.

Jon, I've read everything I could find about this, and I'm still not clear on what the Callum : Fisker ratio is. I think it's clear that Callum did almost the entire DB9, with Fisker just slightly revising the finished design. I'm pretty sure the rear lamps (which are superb) are Fisker's. The Vantage design, however, I've thought is more Fisker than Callum. Do you know? Anyone?

You will already know about some of the following Speedraser, but this is my understanding.

The Vantage was designed before the DB9. A new segment model and not replacing an existing car, so there was less secrecy duriing development than is normal. The concept was unveiled in almost identical appearance to the production car, nearly three years before deliveries began.

Initially a mid-engine Callum design (there is a video), Dr Bez stopped that plan within a few days of his arrival. Ian Callum has stated that he designed about 80% of the final Vantage exterior, but none of the interior. Think the interior was the work of Sarah Maynard. A photo the Ian Callum front engine Vantage been posted on PH, showing to my mind, some ugly air intakes, low down ahead of the rear wheels. The whole project was then put on hold, while the DB9 was prepared to be in production first, replacing the DB7. Ian Callum had left by then (was it to Jaguar) and Henrik Fisker appointed. Fortunately in my view, Fisker made a few design adjustments including smoothing away those air intakes. The whole car is entirely free of unnecessary design features, so the air intakes would have served no practical purpose anyway. Henrik Fisker was of course in charge when the Vantage concept was unveiled in Detroit, so therefore the Vantage was attributed to him.

Edited by Jon39 on Monday 1st February 15:46

Jon, yep, good info. But I think we still don't know who did how much of what. The DB9 was begun after the V8 Vantage, but when was it started? I don't know. Fisker arrived in 2001, well before the AM V8 concept was shown in January 2003 (wow, 18 years ago!). I've seen some pics of the early front-engine design, and to me it looks broadly similar to the '03 show car and the production V8V -- yet somehow quite different and not nearly as beautiful. Maybe it's just the pictures of the earlier design, but much of the final design looks to have been subtly -- yet significantly -- redone. Was that the 20% Callum says he didn't do? What percentage does Fisker believe he did, I wonder. We'll probably never know the Callum : Fisker ratio. Heck, people still fight about who did the Miura...

[Jon39]

Speedraser said:

Jon, yep, good info. But I think we still don't know who did how much of what. The DB9 was begun after the V8 Vantage, but when was it started? I don't know. Fisker arrived in 2001, well before the AM V8 concept was shown in January 2003 (wow, 18 years ago!). I've seen some pics of the early front-engine design, and to me it looks broadly similar to the '03 show car and the production V8V -- yet somehow quite different and not nearly as beautiful. Maybe it's just the pictures of the earlier design, but much of the final design looks to have been subtly -- yet significantly -- redone. Was that the 20% Callum says he didn't do? What percentage does Fisker believe he did, I wonder. We'll probably never know the Callum : Fisker ratio. Heck, people still fight about who did the Miura...

I don't know any more.
If you have not seen this video, you might be interested. There is some information from Ian Callum about the Vantage.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=llzQ1RqIacM
Vantage mentioned starting at 28:00 mins.


An AM pub quiz question.
Aston Martins have been 'Hand built in England' and now 'Hand built in Wales'.
Have any been built in another country?

Answer - the Vantage concept car unveiled in 2003, was 'Hand built in India'.

Edited by Jon39 on Tuesday 2nd February 09:32

[V8LM]

Superleg48 said:

All very scientific you know....

And often coincidence.

[Superleg48]

V8LM said:

Superleg48 said:

All very scientific you know....

And often coincidence.

In Aston’s case it is a very deliberate design philosophy. By way of example jere is the Rapide with the same approach..

[Jon39]

There is a video where Marek Reichman, with much arm waving, explains his use of the golden ratio.
I dare not post that link - it is too much to take at this time of the day.

[V8LM]

Screenshot 2021-02-02 at 09.48.56 by v8lemon, on Flickr

Screenshot 2021-02-02 at 10.35.42 by v8lemon, on Flickr

Edited by V8LM on Tuesday 2nd February 10:36

[300bhp/ton]

Superleg48 said:

In Aston’s case it is a very deliberate design philosophy. By way of example jere is the Rapide with the same approach..

Yeah but in the case of the Rapide it looks odd to me. Something just isn’t right with its proportions.

I’d also note the pics above with the silver DB7 and red V8 Vantage. The DB7 looks much more balanced and graceful.

[Superleg48]

V8LM said:

Screenshot 2021-02-02 at 09.48.56 by v8lemon, on Flickr

Screenshot 2021-02-02 at 10.35.42 by v8lemon, on Flickr

Edited by V8LM on Tuesday 2nd February 10:36

Lol, those examples are the Rule of Mess, certainly not 3!

[Superleg48]

300bhp/ton said:

Superleg48 said:

In Aston’s case it is a very deliberate design philosophy. By way of example jere is the Rapide with the same approach..

Yeah but in the case of the Rapide it looks odd to me. Something just isn’t right with its proportions.

I’d also note the pics above with the silver DB7 and red V8 Vantage. The DB7 looks much more balanced and graceful.

The DB7 is designed in exactly the same way.

[V8LM]

Superleg48 said:

The DB7 is designed in exactly the same way.

You are Marek Reichman and I claim my £5.

GeeWiz by v8lemon, on Flickr

[mhurley]

V8 Vantage X pack
DB4 GT
DB5 convertible
Vanquish mk2
DB9 GT

[300bhp/ton]

Superleg48 said:

300bhp/ton said:

Superleg48 said:

In Aston’s case it is a very deliberate design philosophy. By way of example jere is the Rapide with the same approach..

Yeah but in the case of the Rapide it looks odd to me. Something just isn’t right with its proportions.

I’d also note the pics above with the silver DB7 and red V8 Vantage. The DB7 looks much more balanced and graceful.

The DB7 is designed in exactly the same way.

Yet works so much better.

I think the issue with the Rapide is the total length, I note the diagram doesn't have the same metric slider for the entire length of the vehicle....

[baconsarney]

Two things I can’t believe, 1. You’re still discussing this when we all know the V8V wins hands down, and 2. There’s pictures of an Allegro on the Aston forum. I mean really. What’s the world coming to.

[Emilio Largo]

bennno said:

8Speed said:

Incorrect - the early version without the side skirts is prettier.

I was paid a big brown envelope full of cash to attend a pre launch design review of that car many moons back.

On that basis I must really buy one at some point.

There is no bribery needed at all to decide for what obviously is the more perfected, more followed through design of the later MY12.25/V8 Vantage S version

Jon39 said:

An AM pub quiz question.
Aston Martins have been 'Hand built in England' and now 'Hand built in Wales'.
Have any been built in another country?
Answer - the Vantage concept car unveiled in 2003, was 'Hand built in India'.

It´s a shame that our Austrian friends (with their great technical input) have become so silent here in recent years. How soon can a country be forgotten?

[Castrol for a knave]

Jon39 said:

Speedraser said:

Jon, yep, good info. But I think we still don't know who did how much of what. The DB9 was begun after the V8 Vantage, but when was it started? I don't know. Fisker arrived in 2001, well before the AM V8 concept was shown in January 2003 (wow, 18 years ago!). I've seen some pics of the early front-engine design, and to me it looks broadly similar to the '03 show car and the production V8V -- yet somehow quite different and not nearly as beautiful. Maybe it's just the pictures of the earlier design, but much of the final design looks to have been subtly -- yet significantly -- redone. Was that the 20% Callum says he didn't do? What percentage does Fisker believe he did, I wonder. We'll probably never know the Callum : Fisker ratio. Heck, people still fight about who did the Miura...

I don't know any more.
If you have not seen this video, you might be interested. There is some information from Ian Callum about the Vantage.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=llzQ1RqIacM
Vantage mentioned starting at 28:00 mins.


An AM pub quiz question.
Aston Martins have been 'Hand built in England' and now 'Hand built in Wales'.
Have any been built in another country?

Answer - the Vantage concept car unveiled in 2003, was 'Hand built in India'.

Edited by Jon39 on Tuesday 2nd February 09:32

The Rapide was originally built in Austria by Steyr

Edit - spotted the reference above.....

[MarkM3Evoplus]

My faves are DB4 GT and Newport Pagnell Vanquish.

DB7 still a looker though, particularly early, clean models. Bit added, such as the later sill on the V8 Vantage, both eras, detracted from the original clean designs imho.