No More Manuals - is it true?
Discussion
vernierMike said:
I was trying to think of a manual hybrid, do they exist ?
Not sure technically what you have in mind, but I can use my daily as a manual or auto. Is that hybrid ?
It has a conventional torque converter 5 speed auto, but by moving the gear selector lever left or right, the gears can be controlled manually.
It is almost always left in D (auto mode), but the manual can be useful prior to an overtake ensuring the desired gear is engaged and ready, or to hold a particular gear when the auto system would want to make upward shifts, perhaps when in crawling traffic.
The latest torque converter auto boxes (sometimes now 9 gears) do much faster gear changes, but that would make no difference to my journeys.
He seems to have some trouble getting in the right gear at 08.48.
I think it’s the same dogleg gearbox used in the previous gen V12VS and according to the Bamford Rose video it seems to be quite a handful to master the gear change.
On the aesthetics, I think I now prefer the original “Hunter grille” style than the newly launched bar grille which kind of looks even more like a gaping fish mouth.
Sorry to be negative as I know some on here don’t like the latest Vantage to be slashed but it’s a compromised vehicle on all fronts, looks, sound with the artificial pops ans bangs from the exhaust.
I’m sure there isn’t much tweaking needed to make this a truly great car but the overall package as it is now isn’t very appealing and it seems I’m not the only one out there with the same opinion.
Redesign the front with different headlights, add some shape and vents to the bonnet to make it less bland, the rear light design looks really nice but the diffuser is just ghastly, sort out the interior and make it more fluid, get rid of that IPad sticking out of the dashboard, integrate a new screen, go ahead with the development of the in-house 6 and get rid of the AMG (lovely engine, there’s been a big debate on PH about this already but AMG is downsizing so we’re going to end up with a 4 cylinder hybrid unit if we continue on this path).
And I know we are seeing the end of ICE but until these are completely banned why not make the most of the legal loophole like Ferrari is doing with the 812 and give us some sensational Astons. A V12 Vantage for a start, and the in-house 6 as base model which could then be hybrid if we must!
I think it’s the same dogleg gearbox used in the previous gen V12VS and according to the Bamford Rose video it seems to be quite a handful to master the gear change.
On the aesthetics, I think I now prefer the original “Hunter grille” style than the newly launched bar grille which kind of looks even more like a gaping fish mouth.
Sorry to be negative as I know some on here don’t like the latest Vantage to be slashed but it’s a compromised vehicle on all fronts, looks, sound with the artificial pops ans bangs from the exhaust.
I’m sure there isn’t much tweaking needed to make this a truly great car but the overall package as it is now isn’t very appealing and it seems I’m not the only one out there with the same opinion.
Redesign the front with different headlights, add some shape and vents to the bonnet to make it less bland, the rear light design looks really nice but the diffuser is just ghastly, sort out the interior and make it more fluid, get rid of that IPad sticking out of the dashboard, integrate a new screen, go ahead with the development of the in-house 6 and get rid of the AMG (lovely engine, there’s been a big debate on PH about this already but AMG is downsizing so we’re going to end up with a 4 cylinder hybrid unit if we continue on this path).
And I know we are seeing the end of ICE but until these are completely banned why not make the most of the legal loophole like Ferrari is doing with the 812 and give us some sensational Astons. A V12 Vantage for a start, and the in-house 6 as base model which could then be hybrid if we must!
CSK1 said:
He seems to have some trouble getting in the right gear at 08.48.
I think it’s the same dogleg gearbox used in the previous gen V12VS and according to the Bamford Rose video it seems to be quite a handful to master the gear change.
Yes its the same box as in the V12VSM, which is of course the same actual gearbox as the SSIII in the V12VS just without the automation. That said I have heard from someone who drove the new vantage manual that the longer stick and huge knob do make the shift a little more awkward. And I think we can all agree that the knob itself is not pretty. No idea why they couldn't just use the old knob?I think it’s the same dogleg gearbox used in the previous gen V12VS and according to the Bamford Rose video it seems to be quite a handful to master the gear change.
I've watched that video and Mike is talking twaddle to be honest in respect of the 7spd in the V12VSM, as is almost every journo who has mentioned any issues with finding the right gear. The problem is it takes about a day of driving it to master the gearchange, as you do need to reprogram your head to work upside down, but after that it is quite simply I think it is one of the most rewarding and engaging gearboxes to use in any car I've ever driven. I wouldn't swap mine for the world. I'm not knocking SSIII as I do think that's great too, but the 7spd dogleg is the dogs danglies!
AdamV12V said:
CSK1 said:
He seems to have some trouble getting in the right gear at 08.48.
I think it’s the same dogleg gearbox used in the previous gen V12VS and according to the Bamford Rose video it seems to be quite a handful to master the gear change.
Yes its the same box as in the V12VSM, which is of course the same actual gearbox as the SSIII in the V12VS just without the automation. That said I have heard from someone who drove the new vantage manual that the longer stick and huge knob do make the shift a little more awkward. And I think we can all agree that the knob itself is not pretty. No idea why they couldn't just use the old knob?I think it’s the same dogleg gearbox used in the previous gen V12VS and according to the Bamford Rose video it seems to be quite a handful to master the gear change.
I've watched that video and Mike is talking twaddle to be honest in respect of the 7spd in the V12VSM, as is almost every journo who has mentioned any issues with finding the right gear. The problem is it takes about a day of driving it to master the gearchange, as you do need to reprogram your head to work upside down, but after that it is quite simply I think it is one of the most rewarding and engaging gearboxes to use in any car I've ever driven. I wouldn't swap mine for the world. I'm not knocking SSIII as I do think that's great too, but the 7spd dogleg is the dogs danglies!
I don't expect the new AM management will keep the manual when they do their next "refresh" as I'm sure the MB architecture will make placing the stick very tricky. 15 years from now this car will be in great demand.
Look at it this way:
WIth a manual, you cannot fiddle with Apple Car Play while driving. By deleting manual as an option, AM is doing the modern AM driver a favour, so he can focus on what is really important - answering emails from the office, and selecting "uplifting" 127BPM computer-made"music" from his "playlist".
WIth a manual, you cannot fiddle with Apple Car Play while driving. By deleting manual as an option, AM is doing the modern AM driver a favour, so he can focus on what is really important - answering emails from the office, and selecting "uplifting" 127BPM computer-made"music" from his "playlist".
Dewi 2 said:
Not sure technically what you have in mind...
My auto (which lovely too just, well, an auto but mine is not as quick as a manual!) has an M mode and it's handy as you describe but isn't the same enjoyment. I don't miss the manual at all on a very long or congested run, I have to say. Horses for courses.
I imagine in order to manage the power in and out of the batteries and also manage the drive motors that the computers need total control, not a geezer/geezette with a grin on his/her face and a nostalgia for the pleasures of learning control of mechanical things. Anyway, if the current trajectory of personal transport going electric continues, manual gearboxes don't seem to have a place. A shame for sports cars in my view.
A quick look at the 2020 accounts would tell anyone suggesting that Aston develop a new 6-cylinder engine in-house is whistling Dixie. In addition, I noticed this:
“We understand that having hybrid and electric options for our vehicles is imperative to the Company’s future in this industry and our partnership with Mercedes-Benz AG is fundamental to our hybrid and EV plan. Our ambition is that by 2025 every one of our cars will have an electrified powertrain (hybrid) or be pure electric driven. Our ultimate goal is that by 2030, 50% of our cars will be battery electric vehicles, 45% performance oriented electrified power and 5% carbon for track-only use.”
“We understand that having hybrid and electric options for our vehicles is imperative to the Company’s future in this industry and our partnership with Mercedes-Benz AG is fundamental to our hybrid and EV plan. Our ambition is that by 2025 every one of our cars will have an electrified powertrain (hybrid) or be pure electric driven. Our ultimate goal is that by 2030, 50% of our cars will be battery electric vehicles, 45% performance oriented electrified power and 5% carbon for track-only use.”
A real pity.........let's hope they will come with a decent multi / double clutch transmission soon then, so we can forget about the auto box with torque convertor....... There is enough choice in the MB/AMG collection for this.
The AMG V8 produces 685Nm in the auto version but this was capped at 625 Nm in the manual.
The (565bhp version) V12S produced 620Nm , and for completeness, the (510bhp version) V12 produced 570 Nm.In the DBS, vMax was higher with manual cars (191 mph / 307 kmh) than the cars with TT automatic (185 mph / 297 kmh), probably due to the gear ratio of the last gear?
Will hang on to my manual DBS for sure!
AdamV12V said:
cayman-black said:
Didn't the manual have less power or torque? not surprising then.
Yes the engine was slightly detuned on I believe as it couldn't handle the torque of the AMG V8. Power (BHP) remained the same however.The AMG V8 produces 685Nm in the auto version but this was capped at 625 Nm in the manual.
The (565bhp version) V12S produced 620Nm , and for completeness, the (510bhp version) V12 produced 570 Nm.
Will hang on to my manual DBS for sure!
I too am 100 % with AdamV12 and Viahuerto on the Dogleg.
If you test drive the Dogleg, you're going to have issues with the gearbox.
However, if you own and drive the Dogleg V12, the 7 speed is mastered very, very easily to the point where it is just lovely !
I doubt there are any owners of Dogleg 7's that have any complaints and awkwardness. It's all from the journos !
I think you can tell I'm simply in love with mine
The v12 and Dogleg make for a magnificent combo and I bet the new Vantage manual is just as great with OWNERSHIP !
If you test drive the Dogleg, you're going to have issues with the gearbox.
However, if you own and drive the Dogleg V12, the 7 speed is mastered very, very easily to the point where it is just lovely !
I doubt there are any owners of Dogleg 7's that have any complaints and awkwardness. It's all from the journos !
I think you can tell I'm simply in love with mine
The v12 and Dogleg make for a magnificent combo and I bet the new Vantage manual is just as great with OWNERSHIP ! I suspect this is an unpopular view on this thread but why would you want Manual when the new autos are so good. I was always a Manual fan with bad memories of lurching gear changes from autos when I was a kid. However, in the last 7 or 8 years I've changed my view.
The new autos give you a relaxed easy drive when you want it, and no clutch leg ache in heavy traffic, but if you want it spirited the paddles make for more fun. Best of both.......
The new autos give you a relaxed easy drive when you want it, and no clutch leg ache in heavy traffic, but if you want it spirited the paddles make for more fun. Best of both.......
Champs said:
I too am 100 % with AdamV12 and Viahuerto on the Dogleg.
If you test drive the Dogleg, you're going to have issues with the gearbox.
However, if you own and drive the Dogleg V12, the 7 speed is mastered very, very easily to the point where it is just lovely !
I doubt there are any owners of Dogleg 7's that have any complaints and awkwardness. It's all from the journos !
I think you can tell I'm simply in love with mine The v12 and Dogleg make for a magnificent combo and I bet the new Vantage manual is just as great with OWNERSHIP !
I preferred my V12V 6 speed manual over my V12VS 7 speed manual, just a nicer change. My keeper, DBS manual, has an even better change for some reasonIf you test drive the Dogleg, you're going to have issues with the gearbox.
However, if you own and drive the Dogleg V12, the 7 speed is mastered very, very easily to the point where it is just lovely !
I doubt there are any owners of Dogleg 7's that have any complaints and awkwardness. It's all from the journos !
I think you can tell I'm simply in love with mine
The v12 and Dogleg make for a magnificent combo and I bet the new Vantage manual is just as great with OWNERSHIP ! Gassing Station | Aston Martin | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff