Can Aston Martin Survive in the Electric Vehicle Era?

[l354uge]

With EU going to EV only and speed limiters I can see premium OEMs going for a two prong approach, beautiful EVs with great interiors (have to be to make it desirable over a Tesla) for Europe, then keep the ICE for the rest of the world, probably with hybrid in the higher volume vehicles.

AML has a strong brand, but EV companies like Tesla and rivian have built a brand quite quickly (and smash AML in the stock market)

Hope Stroll finds plenty of buyers in the middle east to pay for the R&D for the EVs

[ds666]

Holy thread drift Batman .

All you flat earthers , get a grip .
A beautiful looking Aston with a decent ev package would be great .

I think I may see what it costs to dump the v12 from my Vanquish and put in a decent ev power pack .

[quench]

SpeckledJim said:

There’s a reason everything in our houses runs on electricity.

It’s reliable, simple, cheap, clean, powerful, reliable.

Here I am being a pedant and crank again (my favourite roles).

Please STOP repeating falsehoods like electricity is "clean". That would depend entirely on how it is produced. As you know, the politicians in their infinite wisdom have been lecturing us for quite a few years now about the importance of altering our lifestyles (and taking more of our money as a penance) to be more 'green', all the while spending our money on not-fit-for-purpose 'solutions' like wind and solar. Predictably, a substantial portion of the public is easily brainwashed into following these foolish ideas, lacking the critical thinking skills (or just too lazy) to properly evaluate the situation. This has been done at the same time as nuclear plants have been ramped down and/or closed, conveniently ignoring the fact that nuclear is the ONLY viable alternative to fossil fuels for reliable baseline demands (assuming you have maxed out your hydroelectric capacity, while remembering that dams and permanently altered watersheds really annoy the greenies, too).

[SpeckledJim]

quench said:

SpeckledJim said:

There’s a reason everything in our houses runs on electricity.

It’s reliable, simple, cheap, clean, powerful, reliable.

Here I am being a pedant and crank again (my favourite roles).

Please STOP repeating falsehoods like electricity is "clean". That would depend entirely on how it is produced. As you know, the politicians in their infinite wisdom have been lecturing us for quite a few years now about the importance of altering our lifestyles (and taking more of our money as a penance) to be more 'green', all the while spending our money on not-fit-for-purpose 'solutions' like wind and solar. Predictably, a substantial portion of the public is easily brainwashed into following these foolish ideas, lacking the critical thinking skills (or just too lazy) to properly evaluate the situation. This has been done at the same time as nuclear plants have been ramped down and/or closed, conveniently ignoring the fact that nuclear is the ONLY viable alternative to fossil fuels for reliable baseline demands (assuming you have maxed out your hydroelectric capacity, while remembering that dams and permanently altered watersheds really annoy the greenies, too).

OK. Fair points. I am guilty of brevity.

Electricity is clean at the point of use. Which is (part of the reason) why we don't have diesel hoovers. And part of the reason why we are biasing for EVs in urban environments.

Agree completely on nuclear.

[quench]

[Jon39]

I spoke to the owner of a new hybrid car.
He thought he was finished with buying petrol for his motoring, but disappointed when he discovered that was not true.
The car was sold to him as a self charging electric car. There do seem to be more and more adverts using this phrase, giving the impression that charging is somehow done automatically, by the car itself. No more plugging in to charge.

We know what mild hybrid means, but non car enthusiasts have no idea.

Will this be another class action in a few years time?

[nite_narc]

Couldn't help but jump in as an EV owner, and a V6 owner.

1 - EVs aren't clean, they're cleaner. No EV owner thinks their car is zero impact but it's a lot less than an ICE overall.
2 - Hybrids and EVs are very different. Hybrids are the worst of both worlds, PHEVs are the pits.
3 - My V6 sounds better than my EV but that's it - the V6 is slower (in all metrics), less responsive on the pedals, more wallowy (real word) and less involving. It's a worse driver's car in every way.
4 - The EV's centre of gravity is as low as is physically possible meaning it corners on rails.
5 - Acceleration is instant, much faster than anything you can ever experience in an ICE, and it is endless torque - no gears, no spooling a turbo just power, power and more power.

Beating anything and everything off the lights and safely overtaking is my interpretation of performance. I'd take that over a rumbly engine anytime, and have. The V6 is currently for sale so I can buy another EV.

Talking to people that have never been in one about why an EV is better is pointless. It's like explaining why an iPhone is better than a rotary phone, either they see it or they prefer the manual process of dialling because it makes them feel more connected to the process.

[RL17]

Don’t see heavy EVs replaced every 3 years as a solution for anything other than local pollution when all the build shipping and battery resources and long term issues (fires etc).

Hopefully will end up like EU and UK government’s rush into diesel.

We are just going to get dragged into more control like 20mph country speed limits live big brother in car monitoring, insurance and self driving stuff. And it’s going to come faster given all the fuel and drought issues.

Way too fast for AM(L) to adapt and probably lots of other car manufacturers.

Maybe a brand buy out by a hydrogen start up would be better.

EVs all single speed and infinitely controllable- don’t really need driver experience when you take away the drivers!

[Jon39]

There are some business successes beginning to appear in the world of EV sports cars.
Perhaps Aston Martin should study these companies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN64wMLyCuY

https://carbuzz.com/news/koenigsegg-still-doesnt-t...

Top end of the market though.

[oilit]

Jon39 said:

There are some business successes beginning to appear in the world of EV sports cars.
Perhaps Aston Martin should study these companies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN64wMLyCuY

https://carbuzz.com/news/koenigsegg-still-doesnt-t...

Top end of the market though.

This:- ‘ Christian von Koenigsegg will know better than most about the abilities of Tesla's top sedan as he has daily driven a Model S himself. Speaking about the Tesla, he told CarBuzz that he "quickly got used to the synaptic torque responses - like if you think of overtaking, you've done it." What Tesla has achieved served as some of the inspiration for Koenigsegg ultimately turning to hybridization.
Considering that the Gemera costs around $1.7 million and is barely quicker than the $135,990 Model S Plaid sedan to 60 mph, we can see his point. Before EVs, hypercars were in a clear performance class above practical sedans, but that gap has closed rapidly. Koenigsegg thinks that electric hypercars "need to have a reason to exist".
Even though he is confident that the company will have "the most power dense e-motor and inverters in the world," Koenigsegg clearly believes that a hyper EV needs to do more to set itself apart from EVs in more traditional segments, and to justify their enormous price tags.’

Sums the AM issue up rather well.

[Wayne95]

Combustion engine has lost the “acceleration “ game to EV, but then cars are all ridiculously fast for todays road, and frankly anymore 0-60 reduction is just painful to be in.

My I-pace out accelerates my N430, has instant throttle response, rides beautifully and is cheap to run. The silence outside also means you can enjoy the performance without drawing attention to yourself. Perfect.

But, my N430 involves me, needs my input to make progress, looks fantastic, demands my attention and gets attention from people. It’s not engineering perfect, so my contribution when driving is needed. I love it.

Our Astons cannot compete on speed, so it’s emotion they need to trade on. How they can achieve this without an engine creating personality is a real challenge.

I hope they succeed .

[nite_narc]

Wayne95 said:

My I-pace out accelerates my N430, has instant throttle response, rides beautifully and is cheap to run. The silence outside also means you can enjoy the performance without drawing attention to yourself. Perfect.

But, my N430 involves me, needs my input to make progress, looks fantastic, demands my attention and gets attention from people. It’s not engineering perfect, so my contribution when driving is needed. I love it.

That's what I'm excited about. All the perks of electric with the interior class and style of AM. That's going to get me back into the brand.

[SpeckledJim]

nite_narc said:

Wayne95 said:

My I-pace out accelerates my N430, has instant throttle response, rides beautifully and is cheap to run. The silence outside also means you can enjoy the performance without drawing attention to yourself. Perfect.

But, my N430 involves me, needs my input to make progress, looks fantastic, demands my attention and gets attention from people. It’s not engineering perfect, so my contribution when driving is needed. I love it.

That's what I'm excited about. All the perks of electric with the interior class and style of AM. That's going to get me back into the brand.

Exactly. This is a big opportunity for a company with a history of stylish designs and strong brand image.

Selling ICE cars against Ferrari has not gone well. Take the ICE away from Ferrari and now Aston Martin has some strong cards to play.

[Gary C]

ds666 said:

I think I may see what it costs to dump the v12 from my Vanquish and put in a decent ev power pack .

Your PH credibility ?

[ds666]

Gary C said:

ds666 said:

I think I may see what it costs to dump the v12 from my Vanquish and put in a decent ev power pack .

Your PH credibility ?

Haha , fair point - I'd still have 2 off v12's left and some others ...

But I love my Vanquish and would never spoil it in this way - indeed I don't get people converting " special " old cars like a Testa Rossa or 3.0 CSL BMW to EV . I think they are missing the involvement point made above . Yes you get the looks but why not just buy a new EV ?

But if we are forced to go EV as seems the case , Aston Martin can have a great future if they get it right

[Jon39]

The practical aspect with electric cars seems to need forward planning.
Did you read today, about a UK Police force which bought a fleet of electric cars ?

All went well until they needed charging. No superchargers available at the 'nick'.
A few cars were plugged in to 13 amp sockets, some were left to charge in local supermarket car parks, the remainder left in the station yard with flat batteries.

Project not going too well at present, but they are hoping the experiment will gain some energy soon.
Fortunately they still have the IC cars, otherwise the villains would roam free.

Edited by Jon39 on Wednesday 17th August 18:28

[ds666]

Jon39 said:

The practical aspect with electric cars seems to need forward planning.
Did you read today, about a UK Police force which bought a fleet of electric cars ?

All went well until they needed charging. No superchargers available at the 'nick'.
A few cars were plugged in to 13 amp sockets, some were left to charge in local supermarket car parks, the remainder left in the station yard with flat batteries.

Project not going too well at present, but they are hoping the experiment will gain some energy soon.
Fortunately they still have the IC cars, otherwise the villains would roam free.

Edited by Jon39 on Wednesday 17th August 18:28

That's not a problem with EV's just typical poor government related project management and delivery .

[dbs2000]

ds666 said:

Holy thread drift Batman .

All you flat earthers , get a grip .
A beautiful looking Aston with a decent ev package would be great .

I think I may see what it costs to dump the v12 from my Vanquish and put in a decent ev power pack .

Try electric classic cars in Mid Wales. My guess is you'd be starting around 30k

[Jon39]

ds666 said:

That's not a problem with EV's just typical poor government related project management and delivery .

Exactly and something that even a 5 year old could anticipate.

I wonder if they might avoid such embarrassing situations, by putting more effort into effective management and less time being obsessed with referendums.

It was recently reported, that the people on a couple of islands are very low on food stocks, because the state run ferry is not running !

[SpeckledJim]

Jon39 said:

Exactly and something that even a 5 year old could anticipate.

I wonder if they might avoid such embarrassing situations, by putting more effort into effective management and less time being obsessed with referendums.

It was recently reported, that the people on a couple of islands are very low on food stocks, because the state run ferry is not running !

I heard there's an island near Italy where there are five million sicilian people. That's the biggest number I've ever heard!