DB12

[Buster73]

Haven’t read the whole thread but anyone else think the choice of wheels is poor on the DB12

Some of them look cheap and tacky imho.

[Calinours]

I guess that’s one issue with them becoming so large. I often wonder where it is going to end, 30yrs ago 16” was a large wheel. My Calibra turbo was upgraded to 17”, the two 911’s had 18”, the Vantage 19”, the DB11 20” and now we are at 21” with DB12. OK for the exports I guess but it’ll be more stressful on the UK’s 3rd world roads. My Rangie has 22” wheels and to me these start to look a bit too much even on that.

But, we likes ‘em big… BIG!

https://youtu.be/QRCmLpNiw34?si=MNuTahPLsxYFKscg

Benny Hill, Michael Caine and DB4 - 3 national treasures in 20 seconds

Edited by Calinours on Friday 19th January 14:08

[Simpo Two]

Buster73 said:

Haven’t read the whole thread but anyone else think the choice of wheels is poor on the DB12

Some of them look cheap and tacky imho.

All spokes and nothing else. Yes, fashion I guess but some do look a bit 'aftermarket' IMHO.

[Calinours]

BenAstonV12 said:

cayman-black said:

franki68 said:

Good write up in autocar , beat the Ferrari Roma in the opinion of the writer .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xcDpc_iWcc

Really important benchmarks for the DB12. These are the two main competitors most people will cross-shop against, speaking personally as well. Romas are depreciating, Maserati are already offering discounts of MSRP for new GTs, will be interesting to see how the values look for DB12s once more come on the market. Good to see such positive reviews. Bodes well for the rest of the cars coming this year.

Watching that video, I don’t think the writer/presenter placed the AM above the other two at all. The conclusion at the end was Ferrari for a spirited drive and Maser for a long run and clearly for carrying rear seat passengers. The only thing he liked about the DB12 was the looks/brand thing - purely subjective. He also thought the DB12 perhaps the most brutal/characterful. Is that what an Aston should be? Perhaps. My 1980 V8 would surely agree..

I’m very pleased so many like the new front end looks. I don’t, IMHO the value engineered and very ugly new shut lines are a step backward, but I hope it sells a zillion.

It’s also, IMHO clear that the ‘generally perceived’ failings of the previous car have been the focus while delivering a more in vogue and cheaper to produce car with a front end based-on-but-not-quite DBS as opposed to the focus being on creating something more new and unique - all while reducing production costs. Yes money has been spent on new infotainment - but It is hard to believe that even at at this stage the all new sat nav still effectively doesn’t work at all.

[neverlifted]

No V12, no appeal. For me the only step up from a V12 DB11 (or DBS) is a NA V12 Ferrari.

[Jon39]

Calinours said:

I’m very pleased so many like the new front end looks.
I don’t, IMHO the value engineered and very ugly new shut lines are a step backward, but I hope it sells a zillion.

I might have misunderstood this, Calinours, but I thought your 1980 V8 also has the same front bonnet shut line.
I do take your point though, when comparing the one piece DB11.

A better engineering/appearance solution seems to be the VH Vantage/DB9/DBS/Virage, where the bonnet overhangs the front of the car (no forward shut line), but does not have the additional expense of being one piece incorporating the wings.

[V8V Pete]

neverlifted said:

No V12, no appeal. For me the only step up from a V12 DB11 (or DBS) is a NA V12 Ferrari.

Definitely regrettable that once we eventually got to 12 in the DB lineage that a V12 was no longer feasible

I really must own a V12 powered car before they're outlawed on our roads but which one ................

[krisdelta]

V8V Pete said:

neverlifted said:

No V12, no appeal. For me the only step up from a V12 DB11 (or DBS) is a NA V12 Ferrari.

Definitely regrettable that once we eventually got to 12 in the DB lineage that a V12 was no longer feasible

I really must own a V12 powered car before they're outlawed on our roads but which one ................

I wasn’t that taken with the 470bhp variant in the Rapide, perhaps the excuse needed for a Vanquish 2 with the later gearbox and Bosch engine management?

[Phil74891]

V8V Pete said:

neverlifted said:

No V12, no appeal. For me the only step up from a V12 DB11 (or DBS) is a NA V12 Ferrari.

Definitely regrettable that once we eventually got to 12 in the DB lineage that a V12 was no longer feasible

I really must own a V12 powered car before they're outlawed on our roads but which one ................

Easy Vantage V12S or 2008-12 DBS.

[waremark]

Cross shopping, Conti has to be considered.

From the video, I got the impression that the 12 is less refined than the 11, more sports car and less GT. Can any 11 owner who has driven a 12 comment?

[Calinours]

Jon39 said:

Calinours said:

I’m very pleased so many like the new front end looks.
I don’t, IMHO the value engineered and very ugly new shut lines are a step backward, but I hope it sells a zillion.

I might have misunderstood this, Calinours, but I thought your 1980 V8 also has the same front bonnet shut line.
I do take your point though, when comparing the one piece DB11.

A better engineering/appearance solution seems to be the VH Vantage/DB9/DBS/Virage, where the bonnet overhangs the front of the car (no forward shut line), but does not have the additional expense of being one piece incorporating the wing.

Well, I guess that’s correct, but we are then comparing a brand new car



to one designed in the 1960’s.



but being more fair and comparing the brand new car merely to an 6yr old solution (as opposed to a 60yr old one)…



it seems obvious the giant grille on the new car could have been accommodated, but wasn’t - probably for reasons of cost, and probably the same reason the V12 was dropped.

So much for super duper ultra luxury…

Where there is a will there is always a way. Jaguar had a solution even back then, used to great effect on the E-type..

[LTP]

Calinours said:

it seems obvious the giant grille on the new car could have been accommodated, but wasn’t - probably for reasons of cost, and probably the same reason the V12 was dropped.

So much for super duper ultra luxury…

Where there is a will there is always a way. Jaguar had a solution even back then, used to great effect on the E-type..

You can't compare cars of yesteryear to ones developed in the current regulatory environment, particularly Pedestrian Protection. Let's face it, in the era of that E Type Jaguar had fitted a metal "leaping cat" rigidly to the front of the bonnet of some models - I shudder to think what one of those would do to to an unfortunate pedestrian or cyclist.

You also need to consider that the DB11 clamshell used the largest aluminium blank available at the time, and could only just be pressed. if the Designers wanted a wider track at the front it may have rendered a clamshell infeasible (and that had to have special plastic "fuses" in the hinges to pass PedPro. A "nosecone" design does make pedestrian impact easier to manage and may reduce the cost of low-speed impact repairs. Lots of potential implications

Spelling mistake fixed

Edited by LTP on Saturday 20th January 18:26

[EdTheRed]

Just took delivery of DB12 Volante today, my third Aston. Absolutely gorgeous... for the first 68 miles.

Electrics glitched out and then then engine light came on as the soundtrack changed from a beautiful V8 growl to a knackered rotovator chewing stones. Have decided to reject it and get my £250k back. Delivery was delayed a couple of months due to "manufacturing issues", but it seems Aston need to spend another few months getting this car right before sending it out.

[baconsarney]

Only read first page, can’t believe the DB12 doesn’t have a 12 cylinder engine… this isn’t perpetuating the name signatures of the early stuff like the 5 cylinder engine in the DB5, or the 9 cylinder engine in the DB9…. It’s disgraceful really.. Still, looking forward to the DB13 in 2026.

[Calinours]

LTP said:

You can't compare cars of yesteryear to ones developed in the current regulatorry environment, particularly Pedestrian Protection.

I’m pretty sure that it wasn’t me who did… I tried in fact to compare to the DBSS - which as far as I can tell looking at current and upcoming EU directives/regs, was designed to the exact same standards.

I just cited the Jag as an additional example of the fact that if there is a will, there is a way. They solved the (yes, then a purely aesthetic/engineering) challenge back in the day much to the approval of a certain Mr Ferrari.

The new car hasn’t just reverted to shut lines between wings and bonnet (as VH cars), it has gone right back to having a horizontal shut line last seen in AM cars of yesteryear.

Yes, there are ever tighter legislative and other drivers which make things a challenge, however the DBSS proved it could be done. Sorry but the DB12’s fri tail looks are clearly driven by a desire to reduces costs. The market and only the market will decide whether Mr Stroll is quite the genius he clearly thinks he is.

For the record, I sincerely hope he is a genius, a Canadian able to sell snow to a Eskimo (or Inuit, or native of Norrhern North America or whatever the correct term is these days).

Edited by Calinours on Saturday 20th January 18:16

[Jazzy Jag]

EdTheRed said:

Just took delivery of DB12 Volante today, my third Aston. Absolutely gorgeous... for the first 68 miles.

Electrics glitched out and then then engine light came on as the soundtrack changed from a beautiful V8 growl to a knackered rotovator chewing stones. Have decided to reject it and get my £250k back. Delivery was delayed a couple of months due to "manufacturing issues", but it seems Aston need to spend another few months getting this car right before sending it out.

EdTheRed can you change your settings to allow email?

[nickv12]

Shut line above the snout doesn't bother me (probably helps in many areas including insurance costs as repairs should be much cheaper). But following the comment a few replies up, quality and engineering depth does. Let's hope there aren't too many (confirmed) stories like that!

[LTP]

Calinours said:

I’m pretty sure that it wasn’t me who did… I tried in fact to compare to the DBSS - which as far as I can tell looking at current and upcoming EU directives/regs, was designed to the exact same standards.

I just cited the Jag as an additional example of the fact that if there is a will, there is a way. They solved the (yes, then a purely aesthetic/engineering) challenge back in the day much to the approval of a certain Mr Ferrari.

The new car hasn’t just reverted to shut lines between wings and bonnet (as VH cars), it has gone right back to having a horizontal shut line last seen in AM cars of yesteryear.

Yes, there are ever tighter legislative and other drivers which make things a challenge, however the DBSS proved it could be done. Sorry but the DB12’s fri tail looks are clearly driven by a desire to reduces costs. The market and only the market will decide whether Mr Stroll is quite the genius he clearly thinks he is.

For the record, I sincerely hope he is a genius, a Canadian able to sell snow to a Eskimo (or Inuit, or native of Norrhern North America or whatever the correct term is these days).

DBSS is carbon fibre - constraints regarding pressing feasibility and blank size don't apply, and the material itself can be engineered to be more pedestrian-friendly because of the way it can be made to fail under impact.

The horizontal shutline at the front of the DB12 bonnet is what I referred to as a "nosecone" and came back in on the new Vantage - you have a one-piece, non-metal front that is much easier to make pedestrian friendly. I doubt a VH Vantage- or DB9-style bonnet would be easy to make pass either, especially as the designers like to wrap the sheet metal as close as possible to the big, solid bits like engines for the low, sleek front end.

Aston do (or did) go to considerable lengths (and cost) to meet the designers aspirations - you would not believe the hoops that had to be jumped through to engineer the original DB11 clamshell, and the tooling costs involved (relative to the volumes). Ditto mounting the rear lamp assemblies with the separate, body-coloured infill piece. Some ideas just had to be killed because they could not be reliably manufactured - the "floating" polished aluminium cantrail finishers that were available at DB11 launch, for example.

But I get it - you don't like the front of a DB12.

[CSK1]

Calinours said:

DBS Superleggera really looks good and probably a great buy right now. Interior is a bit outdated but if you have CarPlay it doesn’t really matter.
I could live with an outdated interior if the exterior looks that good and with a great V12 engine to boot!
I saw a light green metallic DBS 770 Ultimate at my dealer recently, it was just stunning.

[Calinours]

CSK1 said:

Calinours said:

DBS Superleggera really looks good and probably a great buy right now. Interior is a bit outdated but if you have CarPlay it doesn’t really matter.
I could live with an outdated interior if the exterior looks that good and with a great V12 engine to boot!
I saw a light green metallic DBS 770 Ultimate at my dealer recently, it was just stunning.

Absolutely. Cheapest is now £120k and a good few around £130k. Just 50k to trade a DB11 for a genuine massive 800hp (simple remap), and crushing 900Nm (engine and trans) real Aston Martin engined carbon braked and bodied beautiful last of the line V12 monster. Such a bargain.

Which true petrolhead really gives a toss about the sat nav? Jeez. At least it works…. How much would Aston Installations together with a decent trimmer charge to hide that ugly central display and install something rotating and cool? - a shedload less than the extra £100k needed for a DB12, that’s for sure.

Were I in the position to buy or sell anything - this is absolutely where my money and DB11 V12 would be going.

Edited by Calinours on Saturday 20th January 20:33