Mr2 with a difference.
Discussion
Deltafox said:
I fail to see why you'd junk the 4pot turbo for a V6.
A) For the way it goes.
B) For the way it sounds.
c) For the individuality.
4) For the longevity.
Thats all very well, but do you really want an engine swap that means you are slower than the car you could have been?
Andy Mac said:
I fail to see why you'd junk the 4pot turbo for a V6.
A) For the way it goes.
B) For the way it sounds.
c) For the individuality.
4) For the longevity.
Thats all very well, but do you really want an engine swap that means you are slower than the car you could have been?
Erm...erm.....how do we know its "slower"?
Andy mac said:
Is the V6 really going to be quicker than the stock MR2 Turbo?
In the absence of any feedback from someone whose actually driven a V6 engined Mr2 and a Turbo version, how do we know itll be slower? Why should it be?
Its a larger displacement, 1 litre bigger, putting out circa 220bhp and 80% of full torque available at ~1800rpm and N/A.......it aint gonna be slow......is it?
I cant find hardly any info on this swap for cars done in this country, but its apparently popular in the US with a TRD supercharger on the engine and mighty torque outputs at relatively low revs on just 5 psi....thatll make for a very quick car, especially as the 1mz-fe is lighter than the 3sGTE.
Slower? I wouldnt want to put money on it!
Deltafox said:
Is the V6 really going to be quicker than the stock MR2 Turbo?
In the absence of any feedback from someone whose actually driven a V6 engined Mr2 and a Turbo version, how do we know itll be slower? Why should it be?
Its a larger displacement, 1 litre bigger, putting out circa 220bhp and 80% of full torque available at ~1800rpm and N/A.......it aint gonna be slow......is it?
I cant find hardly any info on this swap for cars done in this country, but its apparently popular in the US with a TRD supercharger on the engine and mighty torque outputs at relatively low revs on just 5 psi....thatll make for a very quick car, especially as the 1mz-fe is lighter than the 3sGTE.
Slower? I wouldnt want to put money on it!
3.0 n/a vs 2.0 Turbo. Going to be very close at 0.8ish bar of boost but the n/a has an inherant limit of tunability that's lower than turbo power... 3.0 SC though would be nifty.
iaint said:
Is the V6 really going to be quicker than the stock MR2 Turbo?
In the absence of any feedback from someone whose actually driven a V6 engined Mr2 and a Turbo version, how do we know itll be slower? Why should it be?
Its a larger displacement, 1 litre bigger, putting out circa 220bhp and 80% of full torque available at ~1800rpm and N/A.......it aint gonna be slow......is it?
I cant find hardly any info on this swap for cars done in this country, but its apparently popular in the US with a TRD supercharger on the engine and mighty torque outputs at relatively low revs on just 5 psi....thatll make for a very quick car, especially as the 1mz-fe is lighter than the 3sGTE.
Slower? I wouldnt want to put money on it!
3.0 n/a vs 2.0 Turbo. Going to be very close at 0.8ish bar of boost but the n/a has an inherant limit of tunability that's lower than turbo power... 3.0 SC though would be nifty.
Did a bit of hunting and came across this: "The 3VZ-FE also started Toyota's trend of severely overbuilding their production V6's. Having a larger forged steel crankshaft, and large cast rods, they are capable of more than doubling stock power output easily. With a few nitrous, and turbocharged examples matching, or exceeding 450 horsepower on both the stock engine, and stock engine management".
Looks like the way to go to me...
Deltafox said:
Is the V6 really going to be quicker than the stock MR2 Turbo?
In the absence of any feedback from someone whose actually driven a V6 engined Mr2 and a Turbo version, how do we know itll be slower? Why should it be?
Its a larger displacement, 1 litre bigger, putting out circa 220bhp and 80% of full torque available at ~1800rpm and N/A.......it aint gonna be slow......is it?
I cant find hardly any info on this swap for cars done in this country, but its apparently popular in the US with a TRD supercharger on the engine and mighty torque outputs at relatively low revs on just 5 psi....thatll make for a very quick car, especially as the 1mz-fe is lighter than the 3sGTE.
Slower? I wouldnt want to put money on it!
That was my point. The expense of a V6 replacement, only to get 220 hp, or so. I would personally think the money for the transplant and V6 engine would be better spent on keeping a tubby engine, and modifications on those. As far as I am aware, the US market had a lower specced, and power turbo engine, so I suppose it would be an attractive proposition over there, especially as they have a thing for V6's and what not. I'd stick with the 3S-GTE if it was mine.
Gazboy said:
Now that's where it gets interesting.
But is it really any cheaper than a GT28dbb, GReddy intercooler, full e-manage set-up and a forged piston/conrod build for a 3SGTE? It's got to be close?
Id be interested to see actual costs for power outputs on both of these units to power levels of say 450bhp before id commit to it myself, but as you say Gaz its gotta be close.
Gut feelings are that the V6 could well give super power outputs for less than the 3sgte, as you only have to take a quick look on fensports site for your wallet to go into spasm when confronted with costs for getting power....what was that saying again? Oh yes, no substitute for cubes..... (except cubes and a big PHAT turbo maybe..
) Deltafox said:
Now that's where it gets interesting.
But is it really any cheaper than a GT28dbb, GReddy intercooler, full e-manage set-up and a forged piston/conrod build for a 3SGTE? It's got to be close?
Id be interested to see actual costs for power outputs on both of these units to power levels of say 450bhp before id commit to it myself, but as you say Gaz its gotta be close.
Gut feelings are that the V6 could well give super power outputs for less than the 3sgte, as you only have to take a quick look on fensports site for your wallet to go into spasm when confronted with costs for getting power....what was that saying again? Oh yes, no substitute for cubes..... (except cubes and a big PHAT turbo maybe..
Remember that Toyota removed the Supra lump in favour of the 2.o lump in the JGTC as a weight saving excerise, and to improve the weight distribution. How much does the V6 weigh, with a supercharger, and what not? (Not being funny, I really have no idea)
Gazboy said:
Iron block with an ally head. Incredibly over engineered, but they don't break either.
Same as the V6, iron block -alloy head. Later versions were all alloy and weighed in full up at less than the 3sgte engine but the management was a pita to do anything with compared to the earlier versions which would allow you to do most anything without interference.
Deltafox said:
Iron block with an ally head. Incredibly over engineered, but they don't break either.
Same as the V6, iron block -alloy head. Later versions were all alloy and weighed in full up at less than the 3sgte engine but the management was a pita to do anything with compared to the earlier versions which would allow you to do most anything without interference.
I thought alloy blocks weren't too keen on 'big power'? Especially if achieved with big boost? I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that was benefit of an iron block...
Gazboy said:
Iron is just cheap- chevrolet use an alloy lump for their 500bhp ZO6.
Its not just for that reason Gaz, its incredibly strong and a used iron block has a lot more power potential than an alloy block due to dimensional stability caused by constant heat cycling.
Material of choice for a high power unit.
The reason its a good swap for the DIY'er is that compared to the turbo conversion this is cheaper. The V6 is relatively cheap to come by, bolts straight in bar one engine mount (this is available to buy) and seems to run perfectly well with the standard NA clutch / gearbox (much easier / cheaper to come by than tubby gearbox).
The MR2 you see was originally a NA so it makes sense. I know if I had a NA and was looking for a conversion, I would pick this over the turbo, which although undoubtedly more tunable, just doesnt sound the same......
My 2p
ps. Even the iron block 3VZ-FE is slightly lighter than the 3S-GTE. The IMZ-FE is lighter still and has 10 more hp (210hp), but has a weaker bottom end for forced induction.
The MR2 you see was originally a NA so it makes sense. I know if I had a NA and was looking for a conversion, I would pick this over the turbo, which although undoubtedly more tunable, just doesnt sound the same......
My 2p
ps. Even the iron block 3VZ-FE is slightly lighter than the 3S-GTE. The IMZ-FE is lighter still and has 10 more hp (210hp), but has a weaker bottom end for forced induction.
Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races.
V6's in small cars are a great combination, not enough people do them, although they happilly shell out shedloads of cash to put turbos on the stock blocks and wonder why they are replacing their blocks after they blow the ringlands and heads.
I wnated to do a v6 3.5l in my prelude but the only thing stopping me was availability of the parts in australia.
V6's in small cars are a great combination, not enough people do them, although they happilly shell out shedloads of cash to put turbos on the stock blocks and wonder why they are replacing their blocks after they blow the ringlands and heads.
I wnated to do a v6 3.5l in my prelude but the only thing stopping me was availability of the parts in australia.
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