E36 cheap track day toy
Discussion
iSore said:
Nice!
Given how many rusty old 330i's there are about, I'm wondering just how hard it is to convert an M54 to single/non Vanos and use the E36 engine loom and ECU? Or just fit a complete M54 with the existing management, throttle pedal and ASC/DSC?
Don't? think is any power gain tho, with an m5O & map on the 328 it's at same bhp, torque of a 33O i don't know & also don't know how bolt ons gain on an m54? Are there any? If you could swap a few bits & get say 26O+bhp or more then yeah great, if you are stuck at 23O i see no reason.Given how many rusty old 330i's there are about, I'm wondering just how hard it is to convert an M54 to single/non Vanos and use the E36 engine loom and ECU? Or just fit a complete M54 with the existing management, throttle pedal and ASC/DSC?
Yeah I toyed with swapping in the M54 when I first got it before stripping out the crank. But the engine doesn’t seem very modable and to be honest you don’t want twin Vanos in a track car. Variable exhaust timing is purely to meet emissions, there is very little performance change. This is why porsche are only just now starting to use it on the new V8. At least putting the M52 in it is built for that car.
Mechanically the engine is done, now just the extra little bits to tidy up. Stripped the power steering pump the other night. Cleaned and sand blasted the body.
Painted the brackets and pulley.
Should all be ready for the big fit next week.
Second hand modified Subframe arrived this morning too. It’s going to feel like quite a different car when it’s all back together.
Still going, exhaust manifolds on, just waiting for some heat wrap to turn up.
I have also installed my new coolant temp sensor, in the water jacket and an oil pressure sensor behind the oil filter housing.
I have replaced the vacuum lines too. They were braking up. Having fitted the vacuum reservoir the other night, I thought about it and changed my mind. It only supplies the exhaust flap in the tail pipe. That won’t be there when the system is finished, so I removed the reservoir and blocked off the vacuum line.
Lastly I rebuilt the PAS pump. That’s it for the engine really. Going in next week!
I have also installed my new coolant temp sensor, in the water jacket and an oil pressure sensor behind the oil filter housing.
I have replaced the vacuum lines too. They were braking up. Having fitted the vacuum reservoir the other night, I thought about it and changed my mind. It only supplies the exhaust flap in the tail pipe. That won’t be there when the system is finished, so I removed the reservoir and blocked off the vacuum line.
Lastly I rebuilt the PAS pump. That’s it for the engine really. Going in next week!
Good work on the new engine - head bolts pulling were like de-ja-vu to me after having it happen long while back. I've since done a couple of these and only use the cast iron blocks, 20kg weight deficit but I can get over that.
Not sure what you're planning on spinning the engine up to, or if you have standalone management, but you'll get the most out of it by keeping the VANOS engaged longer up the RPM range, instead of switching it off at the standard set point. I have all my previous graphs, from when I ran the M50 inlet, to show the 'dip' it gets rid of mid range.
When I ran the M50 inlet, I didn't really go over 6800-6900rpm much, and never had an issue with the motor. When I built the new motor and went to ITB, spinning it around 7300rpm to get the most from it - I also ran a shorter final drive so spent more time higher up in the rev range. Eventually I had the inevitable happen and the nut came off the oil pump (after approx 2500 track miles/1 year).
I never noticed the drop in pressure on the dash, continued to drive for more than half a lap before I felt something, and that was it. I got lucky and the crank, block, head etc were salvageable and just suffered spun big end bearings. I know you've wire locked the nut, which is a good bit of insurance, but it won't stop the excessive crank vibrations snapping the pump shaft or similar. If you're keeping the RPM down, then I have no doubts you will be absolutely fine. Worst thing was, I knew about the issue with these cranks/pumps, but never really did anything about it, as I never planned on spinning it to those RPMs. I'm just about to gap the rings on the replacement engine build, and plan on spinning it just as high to get the power, so I'm running a different pump shaft and sprocket, and more importantly a different harmonic damper.
I think my issue was made worse with the harmonics due to using the M52 crank pulley, which will be tuned/manufactured for the frequencies in the M52 crank, not the M54. I don't think the M54 crank pulley is usable, unsure if the auxiliary belt lines up, although i've never looked, which obviously would be tuned to the right frequencies, but only for the factory RPM limit/day to day driving - past that RPM its just as unknown as an M52 pulley.
As mentioned above the M54 has limited potential in its standard form, unlike the M52 with an M50 inlet etc. The biggest difference with the rotating assembly is the torque you get from the longer crank, instantly noticeable and you don't need to rev it anywhere near as much.
Not sure what you're planning on spinning the engine up to, or if you have standalone management, but you'll get the most out of it by keeping the VANOS engaged longer up the RPM range, instead of switching it off at the standard set point. I have all my previous graphs, from when I ran the M50 inlet, to show the 'dip' it gets rid of mid range.
When I ran the M50 inlet, I didn't really go over 6800-6900rpm much, and never had an issue with the motor. When I built the new motor and went to ITB, spinning it around 7300rpm to get the most from it - I also ran a shorter final drive so spent more time higher up in the rev range. Eventually I had the inevitable happen and the nut came off the oil pump (after approx 2500 track miles/1 year).
I never noticed the drop in pressure on the dash, continued to drive for more than half a lap before I felt something, and that was it. I got lucky and the crank, block, head etc were salvageable and just suffered spun big end bearings. I know you've wire locked the nut, which is a good bit of insurance, but it won't stop the excessive crank vibrations snapping the pump shaft or similar. If you're keeping the RPM down, then I have no doubts you will be absolutely fine. Worst thing was, I knew about the issue with these cranks/pumps, but never really did anything about it, as I never planned on spinning it to those RPMs. I'm just about to gap the rings on the replacement engine build, and plan on spinning it just as high to get the power, so I'm running a different pump shaft and sprocket, and more importantly a different harmonic damper.
I think my issue was made worse with the harmonics due to using the M52 crank pulley, which will be tuned/manufactured for the frequencies in the M52 crank, not the M54. I don't think the M54 crank pulley is usable, unsure if the auxiliary belt lines up, although i've never looked, which obviously would be tuned to the right frequencies, but only for the factory RPM limit/day to day driving - past that RPM its just as unknown as an M52 pulley.
As mentioned above the M54 has limited potential in its standard form, unlike the M52 with an M50 inlet etc. The biggest difference with the rotating assembly is the torque you get from the longer crank, instantly noticeable and you don't need to rev it anywhere near as much.
Thanks for the compliments and comments guys. I’m just going out to the garage to dig the car out ready for a full day of work tomorrow.
I would have gone with the M50 block as I tried in the first place. But after the debacle with finding a block, having it sent then finding it cracked and binning it. I just wanted to get on.
Also the advantage of the M52 weight saving is something I like as the car has always been about handling.
I know what you mean about holding the revs high. But at the end of the day it is still a fun toy, not a race car. I’m hoping it lasts a very long time and as I always have I’m going to look after her. Gentle in laps and sensible breaks every few laps. Tomorrow I will be fitting two fans. One just for switched cooling. Which it will get ever time we come off track even if the temp switch is not closed.
I would have gone with the M50 block as I tried in the first place. But after the debacle with finding a block, having it sent then finding it cracked and binning it. I just wanted to get on.
Also the advantage of the M52 weight saving is something I like as the car has always been about handling.
I know what you mean about holding the revs high. But at the end of the day it is still a fun toy, not a race car. I’m hoping it lasts a very long time and as I always have I’m going to look after her. Gentle in laps and sensible breaks every few laps. Tomorrow I will be fitting two fans. One just for switched cooling. Which it will get ever time we come off track even if the temp switch is not closed.
Yeah I know. In an ideal world it would be going on. But I really can’t spend another penny at the moment.
I’m going to run it for a month with the standard exhaust on, while running in the engine. The car will be enough to cope with going down the lanes to work, without the noise as well.
One day the M3 system will happen. But hopefully this will keep me happy for now.
I’m going to run it for a month with the standard exhaust on, while running in the engine. The car will be enough to cope with going down the lanes to work, without the noise as well.
One day the M3 system will happen. But hopefully this will keep me happy for now.
I respect what you say about not affording the change to M3 exhaust now but I guarantee if you do the change to M3 headers with the engine in the car you will lose many knuckles, utter many swear words & deeply regret it.
Having done it myself the change took many hours & every single possible combination of 11mm tool known to man with much of the time spent alternately going under the bonnet & under the car to achieve it.
With the engine out it takes 1/2 hour, and you can always weld up an adaptor from M3 header to 328 mid section which takes another hour.
Having done it myself the change took many hours & every single possible combination of 11mm tool known to man with much of the time spent alternately going under the bonnet & under the car to achieve it.
With the engine out it takes 1/2 hour, and you can always weld up an adaptor from M3 header to 328 mid section which takes another hour.
iSore said:
Nice!
Given how many rusty old 330i's there are about, I'm wondering just how hard it is to convert an M54 to single/non Vanos and use the E36 engine loom and ECU? Or just fit a complete M54 with the existing management, throttle pedal and ASC/DSC?
Turns out you can't. The M52TU and M54 have a completely different shape (and smaller) inlet port that you cannot simply bolt the M50 or M52 inlet manifold to.Given how many rusty old 330i's there are about, I'm wondering just how hard it is to convert an M54 to single/non Vanos and use the E36 engine loom and ECU? Or just fit a complete M54 with the existing management, throttle pedal and ASC/DSC?
E-bmw said:
I respect what you say about not affording the change to M3 exhaust now but I guarantee if you do the change to M3 headers with the engine in the car you will lose many knuckles, utter many swear words & deeply regret it.
With the engine out it takes 1/2 hour, and you can always weld up an adaptor from M3 header to 328 mid section which takes another hour.
I really do understand. It’s not that I can’t justify the money, it’s that I really don’t have the money. With the engine out it takes 1/2 hour, and you can always weld up an adaptor from M3 header to 328 mid section which takes another hour.
To be fair time is the one thing I have. The manifolds can wait. Especially as I don’t know what I am doing with the rest of the system yet. Once the running in is done. I might get the 318 decat welded tho the front of the 328 center section. That way I can still use my current backbox. Who knows.
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