335d/435d or 535d
Discussion
drmark said:
But why would anyone interested in driving and handling order a 335d in anything but MSport spec, with plus pack and adaptive suspension? 
Agree regarding adaptive suspension but not convinced about the M-Sport plus pack; the 19" wheels don't improve how the car drives (arguably the reverse!) and, while the uprated brakes might be worth having, the standard set-up is fine for normal road use IMO.JNW1 said:
Agree regarding adaptive suspension but not convinced about the M-Sport plus pack; the 19" wheels don't improve how the car drives (arguably the reverse!) and, while the uprated brakes might be worth having, the standard set-up is fine for normal road use IMO.
I agree re wheels but plus pack great value - however MSport seats etc and adaptive etc are no brainer I would have thought. Unless you want a comfy barge and the handling that goes with it 
drmark said:
But why would anyone interested in driving and handling order a 335d in anything but MSport spec, with plus pack and adaptive suspension?
I suggest many dont know the real differences ,we are not all Forum Fruits.....as for me my 120d auto SE was fine a little go kart so thought a 3 series is supposed to be better allround and the Standard suspension would be fine ,not the blancmange it turned out to be......and when the BMW salesman was trying to entice me into an Xdrive 2 series he didnt mention the suspension was just standard only my googling found that out,drmark said:
I agree re wheels but plus pack great value - however MSport seats etc and adaptive etc are no brainer I would have thought. Unless you want a comfy barge and the handling that goes with it
I agree the M-Sport Plus Pack is good value but only if you want most of what it contains anyway! I did and opted for it initially but my order got caught-up with the shortage of upgraded brakes problem last year and it was either wait a fair bit longer or proceed without the M-Sport Plus Pack; on the basis I wasn't fussed about the larger wheels and wasn't convinced I'd need the upgraded brakes I opted to get the car sooner and save around £500. As it happens I think BMW then offered an interim solution whereby they'd knock the cost of the brakes off the M-Sport Plus Pack if you still wanted everything else and didn't want to wait for the brakes; however, my car had been delivered by then and I didn't really want the 19" wheels anyway. Generally I have to say I'm pretty pleased with my F31 and can't say I feel the need to shell out on these upgraded springs everyone keeps talking about; with adaptive suspension I find it fine for normal road use and, while I'd agree it's no sports car, I never expected it to be either. The one disappointment for me remains the fuel consumption which is sitting at around 38mpg over 7k miles; can't help thinking a 335i would be within 5 or 6mpg of that and if I was ordering now I'd be waiting for the upgraded 340i petrol engine that's due out in the facelift model later this year.
Interesting comments above.
I too have done over 6k in 2.5 months in a 335d. The car is a real hoot. Good on the twisties and great in a drag race at the lights.
The tyres and suspension make a real difference it seems. On adaptive and 19s in sport +, the car's steering, while not last word in feedback, does have some feel, the turn is very good and body roll/wobbly nature of comfort/Eco well controlled. On 18s non run flat winters the feel and turn in are made significantly worse. So I suspect 18 run flats and standard suspension are not much better.
I may go over to the ac schnitzer suspension to see if that makes the handling, turn in and suspension even better especially for £650 and no warranty worries.
I've even managed to get the mpg upto 50+ mpg on a long run by sitting at 68mph (70 indicated) - around 1500 rpm in Eco. Normally at the naughty side of 70 with fun on the twisties I'm getting a steady 43-44mpg and 34mpg when towing 1.5t.
In terms of choosing, the 435d is a good looker but less practical and, for me, much less discount. The 535d is more of a luxury barge and I would be more tempted by a merc c class or the up and coming jag XE, since the monthlies maybe better and quality/presence certainly is.
The 335d is about practicality, performance, handling and some economy - looks are not bad either. Its no Porsche but it's one of the few rep mobiles I'd like to try on the track.
(Especially in the wet when the race car on semi-slicks would be trying to f
king kill me!)
I too have done over 6k in 2.5 months in a 335d. The car is a real hoot. Good on the twisties and great in a drag race at the lights
.The tyres and suspension make a real difference it seems. On adaptive and 19s in sport +, the car's steering, while not last word in feedback, does have some feel, the turn is very good and body roll/wobbly nature of comfort/Eco well controlled. On 18s non run flat winters the feel and turn in are made significantly worse. So I suspect 18 run flats and standard suspension are not much better.
I may go over to the ac schnitzer suspension to see if that makes the handling, turn in and suspension even better especially for £650 and no warranty worries.
I've even managed to get the mpg upto 50+ mpg on a long run by sitting at 68mph (70 indicated) - around 1500 rpm in Eco. Normally at the naughty side of 70 with fun on the twisties I'm getting a steady 43-44mpg and 34mpg when towing 1.5t.
In terms of choosing, the 435d is a good looker but less practical and, for me, much less discount. The 535d is more of a luxury barge and I would be more tempted by a merc c class or the up and coming jag XE, since the monthlies maybe better and quality/presence certainly is.
The 335d is about practicality, performance, handling and some economy - looks are not bad either. Its no Porsche but it's one of the few rep mobiles I'd like to try on the track.
(Especially in the wet when the race car on semi-slicks would be trying to f
king kill me!)tjlees said:
Interesting comments above.
I've even managed to get the mpg upto 50+ mpg on a long run by sitting at 68mph (70 indicated) - around 1500 rpm in Eco. Normally at the naughty side of 70 with fun on the twisties I'm getting a steady 43-44mpg and 34mpg when towing 1.5t.
If I was getting low 40's I'd be quite happy but can't say I'm overly impressed with 38 (especially not when my E92 335i returned just over 30 despite in theory being over 16mpg worse on the combined cycle). That said, my F31 was bought in part in anticipation of an office move which would mean a commute of almost 30 miles each way but, because that's been put on temporary hold, my normal commute is only about 12 miles each way (and being honest that's not long enough for the diesel to get properly warmed-up, especially at this time of year). Got a couple of longer trips coming up in the next few weeks so I'll see how it fares on those; don't see me getting anywhere near 50mpg though!I've even managed to get the mpg upto 50+ mpg on a long run by sitting at 68mph (70 indicated) - around 1500 rpm in Eco. Normally at the naughty side of 70 with fun on the twisties I'm getting a steady 43-44mpg and 34mpg when towing 1.5t.
JNW1 said:
If I was getting low 40's I'd be quite happy but can't say I'm overly impressed with 38 (especially not when my E92 335i returned just over 30 despite in theory being over 16mpg worse on the combined cycle). That said, my F31 was bought in part in anticipation of an office move which would mean a commute of almost 30 miles each way but, because that's been put on temporary hold, my normal commute is only about 12 miles each way (and being honest that's not long enough for the diesel to get properly warmed-up, especially at this time of year). Got a couple of longer trips coming up in the next few weeks so I'll see how it fares on those; don't see me getting anywhere near 50mpg though!
I am averageing same mpg but the 335 gets nowhere near. My neighbour has the petrol engine in another model (1series) and averages 25 driving at the same sort of pace I do. Only way petrol makes sense economy wise is if you spend a lot of time on traffic on short commutes.PS And let's be honest 38mpg at this level of performance is incredible
JNW1 said:
tjlees said:
Interesting comments above.
I've even managed to get the mpg upto 50+ mpg on a long run by sitting at 68mph (70 indicated) - around 1500 rpm in Eco. Normally at the naughty side of 70 with fun on the twisties I'm getting a steady 43-44mpg and 34mpg when towing 1.5t.
If I was getting low 40's I'd be quite happy but can't say I'm overly impressed with 38 (especially not when my E92 335i returned just over 30 despite in theory being over 16mpg worse on the combined cycle). That said, my F31 was bought in part in anticipation of an office move which would mean a commute of almost 30 miles each way but, because that's been put on temporary hold, my normal commute is only about 12 miles each way (and being honest that's not long enough for the diesel to get properly warmed-up, especially at this time of year). Got a couple of longer trips coming up in the next few weeks so I'll see how it fares on those; don't see me getting anywhere near 50mpg though!I've even managed to get the mpg upto 50+ mpg on a long run by sitting at 68mph (70 indicated) - around 1500 rpm in Eco. Normally at the naughty side of 70 with fun on the twisties I'm getting a steady 43-44mpg and 34mpg when towing 1.5t.
drmark said:
I am averageing same mpg but the 335 gets nowhere near. My neighbour has the petrol engine in another model (1series) and averages 25 driving at the same sort of pace I do. Only way petrol makes sense economy wise is if you spend a lot of time on traffic on short commutes.
PS And let's be honest 38mpg at this level of performance is incredible
Hmm, but if my E92 335i missed its combined figure by "only" 10% why would an F31 335i not achieve something similar with the same driver in the same road conditions? Combined figure for an F31 335i is 37.2mpg so to be honest I'd be surprised if I couldn't improve by at least a couple of mpg over what I was getting with my E92; that suggests 32mpg ought to be achievable which is only 6mpg down on what my 335d is doing. The forthcoming 340i will offer both more power and improved economy compared to the 335i so if I was looking to order a new one now that's the way I'd go; however, generally I do like my existing car and I certainly don't feel so strongly about it that I'm about to take a financial pasting by bailing-out early!PS And let's be honest 38mpg at this level of performance is incredible
You're also quite right about the glass half full or half empty syndrome; in absolute terms 38mpg in a relatively large, heavy, estate offering very good performance is indeed impressive, I just find it annoying that it's so far off the claimed number (and much further off the claimed number than I suspect its petrol equivalent would be!).
JNW1 said:
Hmm, but if my E92 335i missed its combined figure by "only" 10% why would an F31 335i not achieve something similar with the same driver in the same road conditions? Combined figure for an F31 335i is 37.2mpg so to be honest I'd be surprised if I couldn't improve by at least a couple of mpg over what I was getting with my E92; that suggests 32mpg ought to be achievable which is only 6mpg down on what my 335d is doing. The forthcoming 340i will offer both more power and improved economy compared to the 335i so if I was looking to order a new one now that's the way I'd go; however, generally I do like my existing car and I certainly don't feel so strongly about it that I'm about to take a financial pasting by bailing-out early!
You're also quite right about the glass half full or half empty syndrome; in absolute terms 38mpg in a relatively large, heavy, estate offering very good performance is indeed impressive, I just find it annoying that it's so far off the claimed number (and much further off the claimed number than I suspect its petrol equivalent would be!).
I have always ignored BMW claims. Plenty on forums about 335i real world mileages and most averaging mid to late twenties, with 30+ on long journey at sensible speeds. Here is one guys obsessive monitoring on 335i xdrive - (although in US mpg so not as bad as it looks at first glance)You're also quite right about the glass half full or half empty syndrome; in absolute terms 38mpg in a relatively large, heavy, estate offering very good performance is indeed impressive, I just find it annoying that it's so far off the claimed number (and much further off the claimed number than I suspect its petrol equivalent would be!).
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=...
Edited by drmark on Saturday 14th February 14:47
drmark said:
I have always ignored BMW claims. Plenty on forums about 335i real world mileages and most averaging mid to late twenties, with 30+ on long journey at sensible speeds. Here is one guys obsessive monitoring on 335i xdrive - (although in US mpg so not as bad as it looks at first glance)
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=...
I don't doubt there are lots of reports on real world mpg on various forums but I monitored the fuel consumption for my E92 the old fashioned way (i.e. not just relying on the trip computer) over 30k miles so I know exactly what it achieved with my driving style and in the conditions in which I drive (and the figure was just over 30mpg which was almost exactly 10% less than the combined figure). Therefore, all other things being equal, I suppose my thought process is why wouldn't an F31 335i also miss its combined figure by roughly 10%? Perhaps that's over simplistic on my part but what I know for a fact is that at the moment my F31 335d is almost 25% off its claimed figure and I struggle to believe the petrol would be so far down given my experience with the same engine in the E92!http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=...
Edited by drmark on Saturday 14th February 14:47
Only 2k miles in and my 640d is averaging 34.8mpg but very few motoroway journeys and lots of X-country stuff.
My previous 135i's averaged (25mpg for the coupe and 22mpg for the convertible) both had N54 engines. I would expect the N55 cars to average 28mpg??
The new 40i engine is going to be excellent I think with higher mpg and lower emissions.
My previous 135i's averaged (25mpg for the coupe and 22mpg for the convertible) both had N54 engines. I would expect the N55 cars to average 28mpg??
The new 40i engine is going to be excellent I think with higher mpg and lower emissions.
Soov535 said:
On the mpg question I just did a trip up to my Mum's place for the weekend and back.
520 miles on much less than a tank - 43mpg overall.
Are you sure? The reason I ask is that earlier in this thread you said you got £12K off the car's £54K list but your profile says (twice) that you got £8K off list.........520 miles on much less than a tank - 43mpg overall.
Just saying.......this thread seems to have an awful lot of
moffat said:
Only 2k miles in and my 640d is averaging 34.8mpg but very few motoroway journeys and lots of X-country stuff.
IME the engine sips when running in a steady state - it slurps if there's any change in that.So a cruise along a DC or motorway at constant speed gives numbers that are disproportionately good in sip mode. As soon as you go onto something that has bends and stuff then it heads towards the numbers you're seeing as it starts to slurp.
I drove a 420d M sport economical sure engine gruff and the interior wow vastly inferior to the 5 I didn't expect it to be such a notable difference but it is huge.
The 5 series really is comfort and space and loads of kit. Plus its rwd x35d
why I went for it
As for economy on commutes I'm getting in the 38-42mpg really traffic dependant. I don't hang about - not in the sense of I go over m way speed limits but I do fully load the engine which is great
Best so far when really trying (only on 40 miles) is achieved 46/47mpg door to door from a frozen start. Worst 37 I think nothing worse than that.
I do like the newer x35'ds which rev out to 5.5k revs before the redline v 5k in my version its now properly petrol rev range and with the x35d its all the way not hit a point and zero reason to rev beyond.
Sat nav pro superb
Comfort seats superb
Rwd
Extended Bluetooth vital
Adaptive Xenons dark magic
Rear lip spoiler - just adds that cool look
Things I wish I had
DAB
313bhp unit
Eco pro option
RTTI
With kids the full OEM rear entertainment system - well that's being OTT
The 5 series really is comfort and space and loads of kit. Plus its rwd x35d
why I went for itAs for economy on commutes I'm getting in the 38-42mpg really traffic dependant. I don't hang about - not in the sense of I go over m way speed limits but I do fully load the engine which is great
Best so far when really trying (only on 40 miles) is achieved 46/47mpg door to door from a frozen start. Worst 37 I think nothing worse than that.
I do like the newer x35'ds which rev out to 5.5k revs before the redline v 5k in my version its now properly petrol rev range and with the x35d its all the way not hit a point and zero reason to rev beyond.
Sat nav pro superb
Comfort seats superb
Rwd
Extended Bluetooth vital
Adaptive Xenons dark magic
Rear lip spoiler - just adds that cool look
Things I wish I had
DAB
313bhp unit
Eco pro option
RTTI
With kids the full OEM rear entertainment system - well that's being OTT
Dryce said:
moffat said:
Only 2k miles in and my 640d is averaging 34.8mpg but very few motoroway journeys and lots of X-country stuff.
IME the engine sips when running in a steady state - it slurps if there's any change in that.So a cruise along a DC or motorway at constant speed gives numbers that are disproportionately good in sip mode. As soon as you go onto something that has bends and stuff then it heads towards the numbers you're seeing as it starts to slurp.
cerb4.5lee said:
I tend to agree and I think if its only returning around 34mpg then maybe it is better to go with a petrol and ours is returning 40mpg but I still question if it is worth it in some ways, because surely its worth throwing a few more quid at fuel to get more reward and enjoyment from an engine that is more smooth and far more enjoyable to listen to in the long run possibly.
One pleasing thing is range - the fact you waste so much less time as the fuel station filling up. Time is tight for most people and fuel station fill ups waiting for free pumps waiting them to pay etc all dead time so a valid upside Its quicker than the 535i equivalent too in every situation which is nice - you'd have to go 550i to better it which is a big step in price.
Another good thing is you really do have the ability to eke out good economy if you wish or just drive normally or drive it very hard. All choices for you to make.
I wouldn't say you are missing out by not having the ECO pro option mind welshbeef!
Our 640d goes back at the end of this month - it's been a fabulous car. Probably averaged 40mpg over 40k miles (belongs to SWMBO so I rarely check the mpg properly but generally 42ish on the OBC) and ticked the service pack option so only £400 in servicing costs and still on the original brake pads (70k remaining for fronts and 17k for rears according to iDrive).
Yes the steering feel is poor and the stupid recess in the alloys is infuriating when cleaning the car but apart from that I have no complaints.
Our 640d goes back at the end of this month - it's been a fabulous car. Probably averaged 40mpg over 40k miles (belongs to SWMBO so I rarely check the mpg properly but generally 42ish on the OBC) and ticked the service pack option so only £400 in servicing costs and still on the original brake pads (70k remaining for fronts and 17k for rears according to iDrive).
Yes the steering feel is poor and the stupid recess in the alloys is infuriating when cleaning the car but apart from that I have no complaints.
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