440i or 430i

[ladderino]

racingmule said:

So I checked out the 440i Gran Coupe and 440i Coupe and must admit I love the look of the coupe over the Gran Coupe. Much sleeker.

However, and I know the purist will mock me for this, I would like the Xdrive, about once a year I drive through snow and sleety conditions. Besides I'm slightly nervous about all that power coupled with my twitchy right foot, and the possibility of my rear end ending up in a ditch.

Buy a second set of wheels and have winter tyres fitted instead.

[Mike335i]

Agreed, winter tyres over AWD every time. Having said that, I transitioned to RWD myself and have never had a problem driving in wet or icy conditions, even on my summer tyres (michelin ps4). The winter or wet weather 'fear' seems entirely irrationally and exaggerated.

[moffat]

racingmule said:

So I checked out the 440i Gran Coupe and 440i Coupe and must admit I love the look of the coupe over the Gran Coupe. Much sleeker.

However, and I know the purist will mock me for this, I would like the Xdrive, about once a year I drive through snow and sleety conditions. Besides I'm slightly nervous about all that power coupled with my twitchy right foot, and the possibility of my rear end ending up in a ditch.

I agree on the Coupe v Gran Coupe.

I've got a 5 year old and the GC would make sense, but it looks awkward to my eye. Much like a A5 Coupe v the 4 door A5 Coupe.

I would never go for XDrive though - one you can't get it on the 440i and two, the cars that have XDrive sit on SE suspension which is terrible. Even with adaptive its a big compromise for 4 wheel drive. Your also adding more weight and lower mpg.

If snow is an issue it makes much more sense to get winter tyres. I'd wager that an SDrive car on winters will handle snow much better than an XDrive car on normal summer tyres.

[racingmule]

Thanks folks, If I go for the 440i then I'll get winter tyres. I have read that winter tyres are more effective then AWD, and that the raised Xdrive suspension does affect the handling.

They had a 2017 Valentino Orange (think burnt tanned orange) 440i coupe in the showroom, pre-reg and loaded at only £37k. The colour was a head turner but too loud for me.

[moffat]

I thought the orange was a new LCI colour for the SE only? I know Snapper Rocks Blue is the new 4er M Sport colour.

Not enough colour choices for me.

Ideally I would have liked a dark metallic grey (like singapore grey), Imola red as I have now or metallic white (no longer on non-M's).

Grigio Telesto is my favourite colour, but not at £3500!!!

[racingmule]

moffat said:

I thought the orange was a new LCI colour for the SE only? I know Snapper Rocks Blue is the new 4er M Sport colour.

Not enough colour choices for me.

Ideally I would have liked a dark metallic grey (like singapore grey), Imola red as I have now or metallic white (no longer on non-M's).

Grigio Telesto is my favourite colour, but not at £3500!!!

Yes the colour choices are really poor. Just looked up Grigio Telesto and wow, yes please. I wish they did more off black colours. I was told the Valentino Orange was a one off they did for the showroom.

I'm thinking about getting the car wrapped in a dark grey, I wonder if an aftermarket Grigio Telesto is possible.

I was also tempted by the white they had in the showroom with a body kit, though it was only a 430i :

[JNW1]

moffat said:

The 35d engine is very capable, but ultimately fails to excite and obviously it sounds like a diesel.

Agreed!

moffat said:

But if you are doing serious mileage it's hard to argue against the 35d as in the real world you will get a combined 42-45mpg and a likely 50-55mpg on long cruise control runs.

Not so sure about that! My F31 335d has averaged 38mpg over 36k miles and that doesn't include much in the way of short-runs or stop/start work. My E92 335i averaged just over 30mpg in the same conditions and a 340i/440i with the B58 engine would be at least 10% better than that; there are also plenty of people with 340i's over on F30Post who are easily averaging over 30mpg. Therefore, while the 35d certainly enjoys an mpg advantage, I don't think it's that significant - 5 or 6mpg better than the equivalent 40i would be my guess.

moffat said:

It's also worth noting that the 435d only comes with SE suspension and XDrive. Neither of which I would ever want. SE suspension makes the car too soft even with Adaptive and it looks awkward externally. Also the XDrive system adds more weight and gives the car more tendency to understeer.

Also agreed and, given IMO the only reason for buying the 435d over the 440i is to have X-Drive, the petrol is the more sensible choice in my view!

[racingmule]

Thanks, I'll probably go for a 440i.

[Helicopter123]

REALIST123 said:

cerb4.5lee said:

REALIST123 said:

moffat said:

racingmule said:

I saw your other thread Moffat and a 2015 640d was also an option for me, excellent value secondhand. I test drove it and loved the performance & interior. But alas the car was a tad too wide for city roads, I'd be getting stuck all over the place.

I've never really had an issue with the size of the 6 Coupe around town, except I suppose in tight multi storey car parks.

You're right to notice they are a complete bargain used. I've no idea why people buy a 435d over one unless they need 4 seats often. My 5 year old is a regular backseat passenger in mine with no issue.

It suits the 40d engine too (yes the 35d engine is the same). But you don't need a diesel, you need a 40i engine in your life ;-)

I can never understand the "it's too wide" thing. The 6 is less than 70mm wider than the 4. Of course, it's longer but that shouldn't be an issue.

I live out where the roads are mainly narrow lanes and regularly visit towns and cities. Never even occurred to me that my 5 series was a wide car, and the 6 is about 25mm wider, that's all.

The build quality of the 5/6 far outweighs any perceived disadvantage of size, for me.

The biggest problem with the 640d is it feels like a boat in the corners and it's woeful steering only adds to the problem, it's a very good cruiser but it isn't in any way enjoyable to throw around for me.

It reminds me of a car that's built for America and it's only really designed for straight roads, so that's enough for me to prefer a smaller/lighter car.

No experience of the 6 but the new 5 is hardly any wider than the 3/4, and weighs about 100kg more. It's reckoned to handle better than the current 3/4 too, which is maybe not too big a surprise given the criticism they've had.

I understand what your saying about a smaller lighter car but the 4 and 5 are both unlikely to be called small or light. Other than the length they're a lot closer in dimension and weight than one might think.

And the 5 is still the better built car.

6 series should really come with Adaptive Drive as standard for European markets IMO.

I'm starting to have a tentative look for a good used 640d around 2015 but virtually no cars have it fitted.

Cars look cracking value.

[SoCalDave]

I'd go for the 440i. Much improved steering and acceleration.

[racingmule]

Test drove a 435d xdrive today and I was very severely disappointed. In contrast to the refined 640d, the 435d was a clattery diesel and the ride didn't feel at all planted. In fact the car felt jumpy/bouncy when overtaking at speed, possibly due to the Xdrive.

Real shame as I really wanted to like the 435d with it's promise of low down torque. In fact it didn't even feel particularly pleasant to drive around town. I'm hoping I can find a 440i to test drive, otherwise I might have to look elsewhere (the Mercedes c43 is an option).

[LocoBlade]

Have you considered an M240i? There's a few less optional toys available to tick (HUD is the one I'd have liked) and they're a bit (but not much) smaller inside than the 4 coupe, but they're quicker and from those that have driven both they feel more alive and raw in comparison plus they can be had from about £30k upwards new through TRL etc and even with a reasonable amount of options will squeak under the £40k list bracket for VED.

Edited by LocoBlade on Wednesday 26th April 21:56

[racingmule]

I've decided reluctantly to go for the marque I was desperately trying to avoid. I test drove a twin turbo Mercedes C250d coupe and it blew me away. Felt like a 3 litre. I imagine the C300 petrol coupe is even better.

So it's either a c300 coupe or a 3 litre e-class coupe.

I think BMW need to up their game. The handling, design and interior quality really lets them down.

[moffat]

racingmule said:

I've decided reluctantly to go for the marque I was desperately trying to avoid. I test drove a twin turbo Mercedes C250d coupe and it blew me away. Felt like a 3 litre. I imagine the C300 petrol coupe is even better.

So it's either a c300 coupe or a 3 litre e-class coupe.

I think BMW need to up their game. The handling, design and interior quality really lets them down.

A few things:

1. Avoid the C300h, has a dreadful diesel engine and the car WEIGHS too much
2. Drive the petrol C's first, the only decent example is the C43 or above
3. The bad handling only affects xDrive cars, certainly much better on the 440i
4. If you can't find a 440i drive a M240i to experience the engine (that's what I did)
5. The interior can be made as good as or better than the C Class if you spec it right e.g. Merino leather and leather dash

[LocoBlade]

What are Mercs like for reliability overall because taking the experience of a few guys at work, I'd be wary. One in particular has a year old new shape C220d company car and it's been in the dealers at least 6 times trying and failing to fix adaptive suspension issues and another has had a few niggles.

[racingmule]

moffat said:

A few things:

1. Avoid the C300h, has a dreadful diesel engine and the car WEIGHS too much
2. Drive the petrol C's first, the only decent example is the C43 or above
3. The bad handling only affects xDrive cars, certainly much better on the 440i
4. If you can't find a 440i drive a M240i to experience the engine (that's what I did)
5. The interior can be made as good as or better than the C Class if you spec it right e.g. Merino leather and leather dash

Thanks Moffat - I'll keep an eye out for a m240i if I can't find a 440i to test drive. Shame about the Xdrive, makes the car feel unsafe at speed.

Regards the Merc C class, yes the C300h is the saloon diesel hybrid, awful. Whereas the C300 is the petrol 2 litre coupe. Supposed to be punchy.

But ofcourse the C43 3 litre petrol is the sweet one. It's so difficult to find petrol cars to test drive. Even merc only had the diesel versions as demos.

Edited by racingmule on Thursday 27th April 17:42

[chandrew]

I bought a 340i xdrive touring with the performance pack today (Switzerland). We went in to look at a 640i xdrive convertible demo car massively specced and much cheaper than we paid in the end for the 340 but couldn't get the children comfortably in the back.

Following that disappointment drove a 330i xdrive which I thought would have been good enough for a 'utility' car. I then drove a 340 with performance pack and one without. Needless to say for me it was night and day and the 340 should be with me in 10 days.

It's a real shame that the 6 series doesn't have as much space as a 4 series convertible.

These 2 liter forced induction petrols deliver the numbers but for me not the experience of a bigger engine, & I'm not convinced they're that much more efficient in the real world. I drove a T6 Volvo recently and didn't really like it. Same with an E300 compared to the E400. They seem designed for numbers on paper than enjoyment on a good road.

My wife thought I'd get bored of the 330 whereas the 340 would keep my interest for longer. I also thought the performance pack moved the car on. It felt properly fast with it.

[SL550M]

Pretty much set my heart on a new 440i M Sport. Several lovely looking examples listed on BMW website, pre-registered with good spec. Retail price is stated in the text, so obviously they've been reduced already (eg. £52k list, now £39,995). My question is, is anyone getting additional 'enticements' in the form of deposit contributions, or such like, perhaps when taking out BMW finance? Going to look at a few cars this coming weekend and would be good to be armed with some crafty insider knowledge! Many thanks.

[Helicopter123]

SL550M said:

Pretty much set my heart on a new 440i M Sport. Several lovely looking examples listed on BMW website, pre-registered with good spec. Retail price is stated in the text, so obviously they've been reduced already (eg. £52k list, now £39,995). My question is, is anyone getting additional 'enticements' in the form of deposit contributions, or such like, perhaps when taking out BMW finance? Going to look at a few cars this coming weekend and would be good to be armed with some crafty insider knowledge! Many thanks.

These are £35k new from a broker before option but with the cheap BMW finance.

[racingmule]

If you scroll through this thread there's a link & contact details for a BMW dealer offering a discount of £36k - and two month lead time.