New 320d makes peak power at 5,500rpm

[ericmcn]

chow pan toon said:

Merc and Jaguar do quite a bit better and neither of them are especially .

BMW owners playing down the severity of things as usual, loads of Japanese cars get recalls too for seals, airbags and whatnot and they dont seem to be adversely affected by the ratings, owners of these 'lesser' cars for £6k I can assure you do not escape the wrath of dealers for issues that prop up.

My experience is that Japanese made cars are #1 for reliability, period. German cars are good while new but when they age they are in most cases a moneypit (or when relatively new even)

Edited by ericmcn on Sunday 5th May 00:58

[ericmcn]

LexyLex said:

Really - I was in a 520d the other day (new G30) and the first thing that struck me was just how unrefined it was. Handsome big beast but all I could think was how coarse and noisy it was. The start stop system was very intrusive. Everyone’s hearing is different but I’m very sensitive to sound.

FYI - I have 3 cars - all of them petrol powered and each is in my view perfect for their purpose.

The LS is my main car, the Elise my “drive just to enjoy driving car” and my battered old 04 reg RAV4 my going to the shops/don’t want to get salt on the Lexus/Lotus car and for driving in the very bad weather car. The combined value of these cars isn’t much more than a loaded 320d and all play to very particular strengths that a 320d couldn’t begin to match other than fuel economy.

A 320d is neither cheap nor cheerful. Its neither fish nor foul. A petrol one would be far nicer to drive, and still cheap on gas but a 3 series is not a car (bar the M cars and big engined ones) for a car enthusiast to get excited about. Back in the day when they had LSD as options rather than extra sized satnav screens they were.

I suppose you could say the same about a LS but the sheer waftiness and serenity of the thing blows my mind and the v8 engine/suspension makes it remarkably deft for a big car. The cars engineered in a way that wows a petrol head. The lotus is a joy to drive and after this post I’m going to head out in it to clear my head!! It’s a car I cannot ever see myself parting with.

And IMHO everyone needs a clunker to hand. The RAV refuses to die and once it does I’ll find another 4wd shed.

LS460? Seriously on my next car shopping list, I want a V8 and that continually props up in my head, and what you said is bang on the money

[A1VDY]

Teddy Lop said:

AC43 said:

Bet it still sounds like tumble drier full of bricks when you start it.

do all new diesels sound this bad? My transit (okay it's a ford I know) sounds like a tractor, okay the last van was a v6 so not fair to compare but I'm sure the preceding Mitsubishi 2.8 & vw 1.9 4cyl diesels never sounded anywhere near so bad.

The latest gen Transit has a superb range of engines, the 140 2litre starts quiet from cold and certainly isnt agricultural, its a far better designed engine than any BMW 4 cyl diesel..

[Welshbeef]

A1VDY said:

The latest gen Transit has a superb range of engines, the 140 2litre starts quiet from cold and certainly isnt agricultural, its a far better designed engine than any BMW 4 cyl diesel..

British built engine (for now) did ze Germanz

[JonDerz]

Pica-Pica said:

I did not say it would die at 4k. Not what I said at all. It is a physical fact that with zero torque, there will be zero power. What you experienced was a rev limit that changed the auto-box up when the torque (and thus the power at those revs) was starting to drop off sufficiently to call for an upchange.

If you have the performance indicators (torque and power dials) showing, you could see how the torque would change over the rev range.

Yeah my bad, for some reason I read that as 4k. I haven’t slept much, it shows, sorry about that. The XE engine being s**t still stands though

[f1nn]

BMW 3 series, tell me a better driving car in its class?

I’ve got form with both 6 cylinder petrol and diesel BMW engines, I will say that I think the 320d is probably all the car you ‘need’.

Want? Well that’s different matter, but people love to hate what’s popular.

[jamoor]

LexyLex said:

Still will be an unreliable, small, cramped, over priced pile of junk like the predecessors before it.

This, looks like a terrible idea.

I'm amazed people buy these.

[ericmcn]

jamoor said:

This, looks like a terrible idea.

I'm amazed people buy these.

the wonder of leasing never ceases to amaze

[PorkRind]

Welshbeef said:

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/bmw/3-series/...


Wowzers hardly any different now to the Rev range of petrols who’d have thought it - years ago 3k and all was done now as per the article and journalist it headbuts the limiter

Engineering superb and 6.8 seconds to 62mph which will be the company car choice for many.

Looks like I just found the gfs new company car!

[Shiv_P]

No doubt it'll have some sort of problem in a few years. Egr, timing chain, BMW always find something to fk with their 4 cyl engines

[Welshbeef]

Shiv_P said:

No doubt it'll have some sort of problem in a few years. Egr, timing chain, BMW always find something to fk with their 4 cyl engines

Given you e only had Fords I wouldn’t worry about abNWs.

My experience with Ford is the ST Mindy diesel EGR failed on it only had the car months.
So woeful reliability ditto the hearted screen fubar it needed a stone chip to replace the screen to get it working - oh never mind our S Max heated front screen doesn’t work either dire reliability on Fords

[anonymous-user]

LexyLex said:

Still will be an unreliable, small, cramped, over priced pile of junk like the predecessors before it.

Mine was fine, not one issue. And certainly more fun to drive than a sterile Lexus barge which barely manages 20mpg and eats it’s suspension complements with irritating regularity.

[Monkeylegend]

Welshbeef said:

Given you e only had Fords I wouldn’t worry about abNWs.

My experience with Ford is the ST Mindy diesel EGR failed on it only had the car months.
So woeful reliability ditto the hearted screen fubar it needed a stone chip to replace the screen to get it working - oh never mind our S Max heated front screen doesn’t work either dire reliability on Fords

I am sure you are Stanley Unwin reincarnated.

[anonymous-user]

ericmcn said:

BMW owners playing down the severity of things as usual, loads of Japanese cars get recalls too for seals, airbags and whatnot and they dont seem to be adversely affected by the ratings, owners of these 'lesser' cars for £6k I can assure you do not escape the wrath of dealers for issues that prop up.

My experience is that Japanese made cars are #1 for reliability, period. German cars are good while new but when they age they are in most cases a moneypit (or when relatively new even)

Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 5th May 00:58

Because old senile people who own them have failing eyesight and can’t fill in the forms or ‘work’ the internet
Toyota have had some complete howlers in recent years, as severe as anyone, yet you’d still claim they’re beyond reproach.

[LexyLex]

ericmcn said:

LS460? Seriously on my next car shopping list, I want a V8 and that continually props up in my head, and what you said is bang on the money

Do it mate - you will not regret it for a second. Best big car I've ever had.

yonex said:

Because old senile people who own them have failing eyesight and can’t fill in the forms or ‘work’ the internet
Toyota have had some complete howlers in recent years, as severe as anyone, yet you’d still claim they’re beyond reproach.

They're not perfect and there have been recalls but they're still on balance probably the best manufactured cars on the road, along with Kia/Hyundai Honda and Mazda. All I know is none of mine have given any trouble, nor anyone I know/known who's had them and I can work the internet and see perfectly - without glasses

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 09:19

ericmcn said:

the wonder of leasing never ceases to amaze

And marketing. BMW's aren't the cars they used to be - and it's a crying shame. A 320d is not a car to be excited about. The upcoming M3/4 and 340i might be but the build quality won't be what it was. The appeal of these cars is just surface/show room appeal now.

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 09:20

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 09:21

f1nn said:

BMW 3 series, tell me a better driving car in its class?

I’ve got form with both 6 cylinder petrol and diesel BMW engines, I will say that I think the 320d is probably all the car you ‘need’.

Want? Well that’s different matter, but people love to hate what’s popular.

Class - what - the "small, cramped over priced badge appeal" class.

The Alfa and Jag XE I imagine. Neither are cars I would want.

All the car you need is probably a Honda Civic but never mind. We are car lovers hence drive cars we appreciate and love. I couldn't love a 320d. I can love my V8 LS460 and Lotus Elise

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 09:23

[Wills2]

Welshbeef said:

Shiv_P said:

No doubt it'll have some sort of problem in a few years. Egr, timing chain, BMW always find something to fk with their 4 cyl engines

Given you e only had Fords I wouldn’t worry about abNWs.

My experience with Ford is the ST Mindy diesel EGR failed on it only had the car months.
So woeful reliability ditto the hearted screen fubar it needed a stone chip to replace the screen to get it working - oh never mind our S Max heated front screen doesn’t work either dire reliability on Fords

Unfortunately having actual experience of the cars isn't something that bothers him, he knows best.

[Fastdruid]

GroundEffect said:

It's a single turbo, twin entry.

Here's a graph for the power of the B47 engine, that's in the latest 320d.



It does NOT produce peak power at anything like 5500rpm, and look at how power falls off after 4000rpm...lovely...

https://www.bimmertoday.de/2017/11/20/bmw-baukaste...

Personally even though it makes the power up there I dislike the feeling of an engine that is making power while losing torque. Which makes the "power band" still only 1000rpm wide.

I'll stick with my petrol turbo thanks. Even though it makes less torque.

[f1nn]

LexyLex said:

Class - what - the "small, cramped over priced badge appeal" class.

The Alfa and Jag XE I imagine. Neither are cars I would want.

All the car you need is probably a Honda Civic but never mind. We are car lovers hence drive cars we appreciate and love. I couldn't love a 320d. I can love my V8 LS460 and Lotus Elise

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 09:23

Alfa and Jag, unfortunately not...and that is before you consider quality issues of both, well okay I wouldn’t have a JLR product due to the issues that friends and colleagues have had but i’ve No experience of modern Alfa’s so maybe i’m being unfair, and simply the wrong badges for the majority of buyers/company car users.

My point being of course, that a 3 series is a fantastically capable and accomplished car. Although I personally would choose a 6 pot, the 320d would be all most users would want or need.

There is a reason that they are so popular.

[AC43]

LexyLex said:

A petrol one would be far nicer to drive, and still cheap on gas

I was talking to the owner of a local garage about this yesterday. He was persuaded against his better judgement by the Merc dealer to buy a 6 month old E350 diesel last year and found the fuel consumption really bad in London traffic. He kept in 9 months and then sold it to a customer to he could get a petrol Macan which reckons actually delivers better MPG.

Horses for courses, etc but it still amazes me how many people drive diesels around London. I presume it's the promised MPG and low road tax that appeals. In the real world for that sort of use surely a 320i would make much more sense. Of the hybrid version of course.

Now the government and councils are moving the taxation goalposts it seems to be the direction we'e heading in.

[LexyLex]

f1nn said:

Alfa and Jag, unfortunately not...and that is before you consider quality issues of both, well okay I wouldn’t have a JLR product due to the issues that friends and colleagues have had but i’ve No experience of modern Alfa’s so maybe i’m being unfair, and simply the wrong badges for the majority of buyers/company car users.

My point being of course, that a 3 series is a fantastically capable and accomplished car. Although I personally would choose a 6 pot, the 320d would be all most users would want or need.

There is a reason that they are so popular.

Quality issues - BMW - LOL. The engines literally self destruct. Even the expensive ones have bad trim (a 3000 mile X5 a friend has already rattles and buzzes). You don't buy a car with a 4 cylinder diesel if you really like driving so I don't see the argument for the rear drive element of the car.

I do not think a 320d is capable and accomplished car. The best one probably quality wise is the IS Lexus but they are woefully small inside for the length/width of the car and the performance is pretty lackluster given the lack of choice here in the UK market (only a 300h model). The chassis can take the power but the drive-train isn't for serious drivers. Neither is a 320d's.

The 340i looks more like it but I'd be worried about the reliability now. I remember when BMW's were extremely well built. The newer ones are not.

At this money I'd be in a Mondeo, Volvo S90 or new S60 if I wasn’t into driving. Maybe even a Mazda 6. The US market gets a much better IS 350 model but we do not. The C class is similarly small inside, unrefined, not very comfortable or good to drive. Small saloons with small engines are not drivers cars.

Edit - I’d might also swerve the segment and go leftfield - the price of a 320d has to get you into a Golf R estate, FK8 type R. These are quite economical cars and will be a barrel of laughs compared to a 320d. Refinement wise a Golf R is also very decent. If I was faced with a jack of all trades fun to drive car I’d go in this direction over a “compact executive” saloon car with a dreadful engine in it. I like cars, I like driving. A 320d would be the death of it for me.

Edit - a loaded 320d will breach £40k (because BMW give you literally nothing in these cars - everything is optional) - that gets you into a Kia Stinger 3.3. The later looks like fun and a car you'd love driving and the former a tedious excuse of forgettable blandness.

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 10:57

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 10:58

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 11:05

Edited by LexyLex on Sunday 5th May 11:10