RE: Turbo Beemer is on its way
Wednesday 8th February 2006
BMW 3-SeriesBMW 3-Series turbo is approaching a showroom near you. According to Autocar, the 335i, which will be powered by a turbocharged version of the company's 3.0-litre straight-six, is out and about in undisguised form, undergoing final testing.
Turbo Beemer is on its way
Three-litre six in 335i to yield 330bhp
BMW 3-Series
It should put out some 330bhp -- nearly 100bhp more than the 330d -- and the motor is likely to appear in the X5. In terms of visual differentiation, it sports a pair of tailpipes and a unique taillight cluster. The cabrio version will, according to Autocar, use a steel folding roof.
Sadly, we've no photos we can legally show...yet.
Discussion
Sounds like a nice turbo-engine with some more torque, so it also can compete a bit better to the strong turbo-diesels they also offer, and this way they fill up the gap between the 330i and the coming M3 V8 with 420pk?! MMM
And today's turbo's are much better then the old bimmer turbo days(still no turbo fan, but they can offer great performance)
I think PH have some picture's but they are not yet alowed to show them(copy rights and release data)
GTRene
>> Edited by GTRene on Wednesday 8th February 11:54
And today's turbo's are much better then the old bimmer turbo days(still no turbo fan, but they can offer great performance)
I think PH have some picture's but they are not yet alowed to show them(copy rights and release data)
GTRene
>> Edited by GTRene on Wednesday 8th February 11:54
outnumbered said:
Hmmmm... Chipped 335i Sport vs. impending M3 V8 - which will be faster ?
We can then have a 20 page "turbo petrol" vs. "N/A petrol" thread.
Similar to the Ford Falcon XR6 Turbo vs XR8 arguments, Turbo wins every time really unless you bolt on a blower to the V8, only thing the V8 really has in its advantage is that it sounds better.
With a V8 M3 though it will be a bit different as the whole car will have been tweaked by the M boys into a finley tuned beast in comparison to a standard production 335Ci which will probably be more straight line hero in comparison.
A turbo M3 on the other hand
More interesting would be seeing this engine in the 5 series as a new 535i where it could provide and interesting alternative the the V8 models, still has the power if you need it, but without all the extra capacity if you are cruising along at low rpms or stuck in traffic.
I think modern petrol turbos are very very good for day to day use - they no longer lose out to turbo diesels on torque and don't need revving to perform. Only the inferior fuel economy versus a diesel remains as a weakness. For example the VW 1.8 turbo is perfect in a passat estate - good car.
Drive an Audi TT with that same 1.8 turbo though and, conversely, it kind of ruins the car. In a performance car, they are still undesireable. You lose all the sharp crispness you like and need; everything becomes rather soft.
Only a weener would prefer a chipped 450bhp turbo 335i to a naturally aspirated 400bhp M3.
People chip turbos to try and get some excitement out of them IMO!
Russell
Drive an Audi TT with that same 1.8 turbo though and, conversely, it kind of ruins the car. In a performance car, they are still undesireable. You lose all the sharp crispness you like and need; everything becomes rather soft.
Only a weener would prefer a chipped 450bhp turbo 335i to a naturally aspirated 400bhp M3.
People chip turbos to try and get some excitement out of them IMO!
Russell
Not sure that the "metal folding roof" will see the light of day; BMW nailed their colours to the mast in the past saying that such items had too great packaging and weight penalties and they wouldn't be using them in the foreseeable future. Meaning that a four-seater would end up looking like the Pug 307cc (I.E. having a massive boot).
paulie-mafia said:
Strikes me as odd though - BMW have historically moved towards, then away, from forced induction. They've been banging the N/A drum for a few years now, but are again moving back to turbos.
While Audi are starting to put N/A engines into their performance models (V10 in the S8 and forthcoming S6, V8 in the RS4). Wierd!
paulie-mafia said:
Strikes me as odd though - BMW have historically moved towards, then away, from forced induction. They've been banging the N/A drum for a few years now, but are again moving back to turbos. Is this because of the advances in turbo technology that the demand for diesels has driven?
More likely the demand for torque that said diesels have generated. (See RX8 story you're also posting on
)Witchfinder said:
Strikes me as odd though - BMW have historically moved towards, then away, from forced induction. They've been banging the N/A drum for a few years now, but are again moving back to turbos.
While Audi are starting to put N/A engines into their performance models (V10 in the S8 and forthcoming S6, V8 in the RS4). Wierd!
And then VW who are putting superchargers AND turbos into the same engine...
Swings and roundabouts!
r988 said:
Also Audis are becoming the new w*nker vehicle of choice which used to be BMWs domain.
Yeah this is, sadly, true! When I was 6 and my Dad asked me what my dream car was, I said (and don't laugh), an Audi 80 Quattro! Even at that tender age I loved the simple, clean styling and the whole "thinking man's BMW" ethos that went with the brand. These days, however, they've become a little too ubiquitous and have definitely become the ride of choice for people who like their bling. Sad state of affiars, but I do still love the uncompromising focus on quality and technology.
zevans said:
Strikes me as odd though - BMW have historically moved towards, then away, from forced induction. They've been banging the N/A drum for a few years now, but are again moving back to turbos. Is this because of the advances in turbo technology that the demand for diesels has driven?
More likely the demand for torque that said diesels have generated. (See RX8 story you're also posting on
Why more torque?
The RS4 V8 revs to 8000rpm, so can be geared down alot more.
The torque defecit is just in ones mind, and you only notice the torque in a diesel as you sit waiting for it and then bang all at once.
Put some max torque at wheels in each gear and max speed per gear down and we'll see which is really better.
350bhp petrol turbo 335i or 330d? Even a 335d would be 100bhp down on power! That power advantage is realised in the gearing and real world pace no matter how you look at it!
Economy is still the only bonus of a diesel, hence it's high price, but bring in initial cost and servicing and you still need to do alot of miles to make it cost effective!
Dave
dinod said:
Turbocharging a diesel model wouldn't be news.
True. But why compare outputs to the diesel when comparison should really be made against the 330i?
I agree that it should be compared with the 330i. The only way I can see the comparison is as I said above: Turbo 3.0 petrol vs turbo 3.0 diesel.
DIESEL IS NOT THE REAL DRIVER'S CHOICE.....END OF DISCUSSION.
It amazes my how people are prepared to pay X-Thousand pounds for a badge (see X5/A6/5-series/3-series blah blah) and yet spec a Diesel because of the minmal economy gains. Do you really care? By buying a diesel, you certainly aren't bothered about how the car drives. I care becasue I have to breath in the shite coming out of the other end!!! Who the
said Diesels are cleaner than petrol? And who really gives a monkies about C02, an unproven cause of "global warming." There's nothing unproven about Carcinogens and Cancer!
Diesels don't rev, are heavy and noisier..."Yes, but my 535d is whisper quiet and I don't have to change gear to overtake you!"
Yeh, that's because it's carrying 200kgs of sound proofing in addtion to hefty engine, thus negating a good slug of the potential economy gains. And why don't you just get a bleeding auto if you don't like changing gear! Plus your Status Badge sounds like a TRACTOR.....
Oh yeh, the 330i Turbo? Whoopee; sounds like BM have finally succumed (sp?) to the fasion for Turbo everything.
It amazes my how people are prepared to pay X-Thousand pounds for a badge (see X5/A6/5-series/3-series blah blah) and yet spec a Diesel because of the minmal economy gains. Do you really care? By buying a diesel, you certainly aren't bothered about how the car drives. I care becasue I have to breath in the shite coming out of the other end!!! Who the
said Diesels are cleaner than petrol? And who really gives a monkies about C02, an unproven cause of "global warming." There's nothing unproven about Carcinogens and Cancer! Diesels don't rev, are heavy and noisier..."Yes, but my 535d is whisper quiet and I don't have to change gear to overtake you!"
Yeh, that's because it's carrying 200kgs of sound proofing in addtion to hefty engine, thus negating a good slug of the potential economy gains. And why don't you just get a bleeding auto if you don't like changing gear! Plus your Status Badge sounds like a TRACTOR.....
Oh yeh, the 330i Turbo? Whoopee; sounds like BM have finally succumed (sp?) to the fasion for Turbo everything.
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