six or eight cylinders E39?
Discussion
Right, what to go for. It is going to be an auto E39, but what engine? I like the idea of a 535 (540 would be nice but I need to be relistic). The V8 would be my first choice, but reading various perfomance specs. on it, it appears that it isn't that much quicker than a 528/530, neither top end nor 0-60! 
. The additional torque however has not gone un-noticed. I am also aware that the V8 models use a slightly more primative steering setup, and coupled with the additional weight of the "V" block, does not handle as well as the light-weight straight 6s.
The question is whether a 535 is really worth the extra running costs over a 528/530. I suppose it also depends on what comes along and at what price.
. I wouldn't rule out a 530d either 
. The additional torque however has not gone un-noticed. I am also aware that the V8 models use a slightly more primative steering setup, and coupled with the additional weight of the "V" block, does not handle as well as the light-weight straight 6s. The question is whether a 535 is really worth the extra running costs over a 528/530. I suppose it also depends on what comes along and at what price.
. I wouldn't rule out a 530d either Edited by peaktorque on Sunday 19th November 22:45
Oh no not again .... 
I have a 535i and its a good car - not great, but good.
The choice between V8 or 6 cylinder cars is a personal preference in reality. There is not much to split them in total running costs and reliability so its what you want at the end of the day. With regards to the 3.5 or 4.4 litre question - I would hunt out a good 4.4 if you can. There is not much in it for fuel consumption and the 4.4 is a bit quicker. The 3.5 lacks a bit of mid-to-low end torque and hence needs a bit more ragging to get any performance out of it. However, either V8 is extremely well matched to the steptronic gearbox. Its an excellent fit and they work very well together - smooth, swift and bags of power - a really good example on how an engine should be matched to an autobox.
The best all-round E39 is the 530i. Its quick, powerful and quite economical for its size. It also has the better steering in comparison to the V8's (different system used in RHD V8's) and with the lighter engine its not noise heavy. However, everyone else seems to know this too and its reflected in the values - so a 530i will be worth more than a 528i which will be worth more than a 540i which will be worth more than a 535i. Yep, thats right - the 535i is the runt of the range and the fastest dropper in value! Its got the V8 and hence the concerns for the MPG while its not the fastest, so its the cheaper one. Thats the reason why I got mine - it was an excellent price, came very well equiped with leather, aircon, DSP, folding mirrors, M-tech suspension. So it was a bit of a bargain. But never pay more for a 535 against a 540 unless its absolutely amazing condition and spec!
The big issue is the second hand values though - the 528i is the older big-6 and hence cheaper, but since its seen as the more economical then its values are better. The 530i is much newer (post 2000?) and hence more expensive again. So it boils down to your budget. If you can get a 530i since its the best. If you cannot afford a good 530i dont get one - get a different model. The 528i is good but if you want a faster one then a V8 is the way forward.
As for performance - well yes, they are all pretty much matched on top speeds - because all E39's are limited to 155MPH. The V8's do more than that (the 3.5 only just) while the 528i is close. The 530i is a true 155MPH car too - so thats not a fair comparison. As for 0-60, well thats not fair either. The 535i only came in steptronic auto to the UK so if you compare a 535i to a manual 528i then the performance is very similar - commpare an auto 528i and the difference is more acute! Again, choose your gearbox and then engine - the auto big-6's are good, but the combination of steptronic, torque and low-end power for the V8's mean its a better combination. If you want manual then again its 530/528...
As for MPG - mine is currently getting an average on a tank of 28-29MPG (cooler air makes a 1MPG difference!!!!). I rarely drive in town and most of my miles are motorway. At a steady 75-80 I am getting 32MPG and as a test I saw 42MPG at a steady 55MPG (heavy traffic on the M4 one friday - I was bored!). Chuck it into town driving and its going to struggle with 20's. The 6's are better but not by much. For their time the V8 was very advanced and actually very economical. Compare the BMW V8's to the equivalent Merc and Audi ones and you will see the difference! However, if you are worried about fuel costs then a V8's not for you - but do be warned though a 530i in town traffic will guzzle too, its a big and heavy car and stop-start traffic is not the best.
Like I said, mine was bought on price, spec and the deal the trader cut for me. I like it and other than a few misfortunes its been a good car. I will be definately getting another E39 or maybe E60 (though probably not). Try one and see what you think.
I have a 535i and its a good car - not great, but good.
The choice between V8 or 6 cylinder cars is a personal preference in reality. There is not much to split them in total running costs and reliability so its what you want at the end of the day. With regards to the 3.5 or 4.4 litre question - I would hunt out a good 4.4 if you can. There is not much in it for fuel consumption and the 4.4 is a bit quicker. The 3.5 lacks a bit of mid-to-low end torque and hence needs a bit more ragging to get any performance out of it. However, either V8 is extremely well matched to the steptronic gearbox. Its an excellent fit and they work very well together - smooth, swift and bags of power - a really good example on how an engine should be matched to an autobox.
The best all-round E39 is the 530i. Its quick, powerful and quite economical for its size. It also has the better steering in comparison to the V8's (different system used in RHD V8's) and with the lighter engine its not noise heavy. However, everyone else seems to know this too and its reflected in the values - so a 530i will be worth more than a 528i which will be worth more than a 540i which will be worth more than a 535i. Yep, thats right - the 535i is the runt of the range and the fastest dropper in value! Its got the V8 and hence the concerns for the MPG while its not the fastest, so its the cheaper one. Thats the reason why I got mine - it was an excellent price, came very well equiped with leather, aircon, DSP, folding mirrors, M-tech suspension. So it was a bit of a bargain. But never pay more for a 535 against a 540 unless its absolutely amazing condition and spec!
The big issue is the second hand values though - the 528i is the older big-6 and hence cheaper, but since its seen as the more economical then its values are better. The 530i is much newer (post 2000?) and hence more expensive again. So it boils down to your budget. If you can get a 530i since its the best. If you cannot afford a good 530i dont get one - get a different model. The 528i is good but if you want a faster one then a V8 is the way forward.
As for performance - well yes, they are all pretty much matched on top speeds - because all E39's are limited to 155MPH. The V8's do more than that (the 3.5 only just) while the 528i is close. The 530i is a true 155MPH car too - so thats not a fair comparison. As for 0-60, well thats not fair either. The 535i only came in steptronic auto to the UK so if you compare a 535i to a manual 528i then the performance is very similar - commpare an auto 528i and the difference is more acute! Again, choose your gearbox and then engine - the auto big-6's are good, but the combination of steptronic, torque and low-end power for the V8's mean its a better combination. If you want manual then again its 530/528...
As for MPG - mine is currently getting an average on a tank of 28-29MPG (cooler air makes a 1MPG difference!!!!). I rarely drive in town and most of my miles are motorway. At a steady 75-80 I am getting 32MPG and as a test I saw 42MPG at a steady 55MPG (heavy traffic on the M4 one friday - I was bored!). Chuck it into town driving and its going to struggle with 20's. The 6's are better but not by much. For their time the V8 was very advanced and actually very economical. Compare the BMW V8's to the equivalent Merc and Audi ones and you will see the difference! However, if you are worried about fuel costs then a V8's not for you - but do be warned though a 530i in town traffic will guzzle too, its a big and heavy car and stop-start traffic is not the best.
Like I said, mine was bought on price, spec and the deal the trader cut for me. I like it and other than a few misfortunes its been a good car. I will be definately getting another E39 or maybe E60 (though probably not). Try one and see what you think.
off_again said:
Oh no not again ....
I have a 535i and its a good car - not great, but good.
I have a 530 auto and it's beyond excellent - it's knocking
on the door of seminal.
off_again said:
The choice between V8 or 6 cylinder cars is a personal preference in reality. There is not much to split them in total running costs and reliability so its what you want at the end of the day.
Except that the V8 are substantially heavier on petrol, I'd
agree.
Here is a little table of engine sizes versus average
petrol consumption. Manufacturer's data I think.
520 31.4
525 30.1
530 29.7
535 23.9
540 23.0
We can see that the sixes are all within 1-2 mpg of each
other, but the V8 are 6 mpg behind ;-<
off_again said:
The 530i is a true 155MPH car too - so thats not a fair comparison.
To nitpick: the 530 manual is a 155 car. The 530 auto
is 152 only.
However, if you put 100 Oktane in a 530 auto you can get
it to 154 [ near Frankfurt].
off_again said:
As for MPG - mine is currently getting an average on a tank of 28-29MPG (cooler air makes a 1MPG difference!!!!). I rarely drive in town and most of my miles are motorway. At a steady 75-80 I am getting 32MPG and as a test I saw 42MPG at a steady 55MPG (heavy traffic on the M4 one friday - I was bored!).
Crikey - that's good mpg.
I get 27 mpg global average over three years. If I drive like
a pensioner [ I don't] I can get to 30 mpg.
25 mpg flat out in Germany.
off_again said:
Chuck it into town driving and its going to struggle with 20's. The 6's are better but not by much.
See above. Expect the sixes to be 6 mpg or so better.
off_again said:
For their time the V8 was very advanced and actually very economical.
I agree - the BMW V8 seems better on petrol that the 3.2
V8 in the Jaguar I owned. That got 19 mpg global average.
So the trade off between the sixes and the V8
appears to be 1-2 seconds off the 0-60 time versus different
steering and heavier fuel consumption.
Your choice.
Get a full fat 540 and convert it to lpg.
I run my e46 330i on lpg and its great as long as you get a quality kit fitted by a quality outfit. For my car the conversion cost was £2,3k. On a v8 it will be about £2,6k
My running costs are 10p a mile with an ave consumption of 26mpg.
The lpg conversion is even better on a 5series as you can get a bigger gas-tank into it. There is no power loss compared with 95ron fuel. I still get to 155mph limiter on lpg! However, I have noticed that the car is more responsive on 99ron Vpower fuel.
I run my e46 330i on lpg and its great as long as you get a quality kit fitted by a quality outfit. For my car the conversion cost was £2,3k. On a v8 it will be about £2,6k
My running costs are 10p a mile with an ave consumption of 26mpg.
The lpg conversion is even better on a 5series as you can get a bigger gas-tank into it. There is no power loss compared with 95ron fuel. I still get to 155mph limiter on lpg! However, I have noticed that the car is more responsive on 99ron Vpower fuel.
dcb said:
off_again said:
As for MPG - mine is currently getting an average on a tank of 28-29MPG (cooler air makes a 1MPG difference!!!!). I rarely drive in town and most of my miles are motorway. At a steady 75-80 I am getting 32MPG and as a test I saw 42MPG at a steady 55MPG (heavy traffic on the M4 one friday - I was bored!).
Crikey - that's good mpg.
I get 27 mpg global average over three years. If I drive like
a pensioner [ I don't] I can get to 30 mpg.
I must be a freak then.... dont know why I get so good MPG! I really do not hang around and it goes into sport at least once per drive. I also dont hang around on the motorway either - a steady cruise at a 80-85 is usual on busyish motorways. I guess its the town driving that does it though. But I kid you not though - current CONS2 on my car is showing 28.1MPG and thats on the last 2000 miles since I last tripped it! Maybe I have a good'un?
off_again said:
I also dont hang around on the motorway either - a steady cruise at a 80-85 is usual on busyish motorways.
Good comedy.
Of course, any student of GCSE physics will tell you
top speed doesn't affect mpg very much - it depends
on the acceleration.
off_again said:
I guess its the town driving that does it though. But I kid you not though - current CONS2 on my car is showing 28.1MPG and thats on the last 2000 miles since I last tripped it! Maybe I have a good'un?
Possibly - much more likely a manual and a gentle right foot.
For comparison, a friend of mine has a 540 and he struggles to
get 23-25 mpg.
You're not really giving that V8 much hard work are you ?
I have to concue with dcb about that fantastic V8 consumption figure that off_again is getting.
My 330i is supposed to give 30mph according to manufacturer. I get 25-26 (This is my average over 19k miles of owenership). I know why though:
My version of 'not hanging about' on the motorway is 90-110.
I regularley use ALL Of the rev range in as many gears as the road permits.
Although the car has loads of torque I will use often use lower gear to vertake just to hear the engine which is obviously bad for consumption.
That said have achieved 32mpg on a steady cruise at 70mph from London to Sheffield along the M1.
There was a recent thread about the 3 series consumption and all the people with 330's bar one person were posting better mpg than me.
Not sure what point is really, I guess I'm trying to say that the driving style is a massive factor in fuel consumption....
My 330i is supposed to give 30mph according to manufacturer. I get 25-26 (This is my average over 19k miles of owenership). I know why though:
My version of 'not hanging about' on the motorway is 90-110.
I regularley use ALL Of the rev range in as many gears as the road permits.
Although the car has loads of torque I will use often use lower gear to vertake just to hear the engine which is obviously bad for consumption.
That said have achieved 32mpg on a steady cruise at 70mph from London to Sheffield along the M1.
There was a recent thread about the 3 series consumption and all the people with 330's bar one person were posting better mpg than me.
Not sure what point is really, I guess I'm trying to say that the driving style is a massive factor in fuel consumption....
dcb said:
Good comedy.
Of course, any student of GCSE physics will tell you
top speed doesn't affect mpg very much - it depends
on the acceleration.
Of course, any student of GCSE physics will tell you
top speed doesn't affect mpg very much - it depends
on the acceleration.
Oh great - thanks for the sarcastic comment. Sod you....
I know damn well what affects MPG and I also have a very good understanding about the relationship between speed, gearing and MPG too. So less of the sarcastic comments please.
I do regularly boot my the car and let it run the gears. When I made the comment about 80-85, I was referring to the consistent average over a number of motorways. To maintain 90-110 on the M4 at 8:00AM on a weekday will require some pretty major commitment. What I was trying to do was make a comparison that the average speeds that is more likely is actually lower than the headline figures.
dcb said:
You're not really giving that V8 much hard work are you ?
Thanks....
off_again said:
Oh great - thanks for the sarcastic comment. Sod you....
Fair enough. Good job I toned it down first.
off_again said:
I know damn well what affects MPG and I also have a very good understanding about the relationship between speed, gearing and MPG too. So less of the sarcastic comments please.
Over 25 mpg out of a V8 and claims 80-85 is fast ?
You leave yourself wide open to hilarity of the pipe
and slippers variety.
off_again said:
To maintain 90-110 on the M4 at 8:00AM on a weekday will require some pretty major commitment.
I am not so sure.
My practical experience on the M4 is that when it is
clear, and I'm doing my usual 90 mph cruise, then there
is usually plenty of traffic queueing to get past.
So I'd say 90-110 on the M4 when it is clear wouldn't be a big
deal.
Of course at 8am it might well be blocked and 10 mph a luxury.
Thanks for all the info. guys. The "sport version" of all versions I orginally listed look much better with the bumpers wheels etc., would I be correct in thinking that they also have uprated suspension? What else is different from say an "SE" equiped car?
I suppose it really boils down to right car right price (although a 520 would not tempt me away from my current V6 Mondeo!). I have ruled out a 540 purely for insurance cost purposes I have had a quote for a 535 and 540 and there is quite a differance (am 26 with a mortgage
, two kids, and wife that could spend for England!) The other half would pilot it during the week to Tesco's and I would only drive it ay weekends, so fuel consumption is not really that big an issue, performance per pound is I suppose
I suppose it really boils down to right car right price (although a 520 would not tempt me away from my current V6 Mondeo!). I have ruled out a 540 purely for insurance cost purposes I have had a quote for a 535 and 540 and there is quite a differance (am 26 with a mortgage
, two kids, and wife that could spend for England!) The other half would pilot it during the week to Tesco's and I would only drive it ay weekends, so fuel consumption is not really that big an issue, performance per pound is I suppose My 530 Sport is as much car as I will need, ever.
The suspension set-up is perfect. It is amazing how this family car holds the road, completely belying its weight.
I used to have a chipped E34 540. That was very quick but nowhere near as agile as the E39 530.
In my view, the 530 Sport is the best compromise of both comfort and fun to drive.
I did a 1200 mile journey last year that started 08 AM in southern Spain and ended 11PM in Rotterdam. During the whole journey, I never felled uncomfortable in the car.
My vote goes for a 530 Sport.
The suspension set-up is perfect. It is amazing how this family car holds the road, completely belying its weight.
I used to have a chipped E34 540. That was very quick but nowhere near as agile as the E39 530.
In my view, the 530 Sport is the best compromise of both comfort and fun to drive.
I did a 1200 mile journey last year that started 08 AM in southern Spain and ended 11PM in Rotterdam. During the whole journey, I never felled uncomfortable in the car.
My vote goes for a 530 Sport.
"Good comedy.
Of course, any student of GCSE physics will tell you
top speed doesn't affect mpg very much - it depends
on the acceleration."
Well, sorry to add to the 'sarcasm'...I only did 'A'-Level Physics (i.e don't have a physics degree) and it was nearly a quarter of a century ago...but isn't one of the major parameters affecting top-speed something called 'DRAG'? And am I correct in recalling something like a quadrupling of drag for a doubling in speed? Therefore, the energy required to move the object (eg car) becomes exponentially higher for a given increase in steady speed. In the case of a car this energy is surely derived from the fuel so fuel consumption goes up exponentially at high speed?
I can't remember the other forces acting against the car...things like 'rolling resistance' etc...maybe they're all part of the same 'drag' thing?
Anyway, doesn't the curve look something like this?
So, any GCSE student failing to appreciate this may (these days!) still get a Grade A but will probably be unlikely to progress much further in this academic field...but worse still may be destined to a lifetime of high fuel bills without understanding why!
Of course, any student of GCSE physics will tell you
top speed doesn't affect mpg very much - it depends
on the acceleration."
Well, sorry to add to the 'sarcasm'...I only did 'A'-Level Physics (i.e don't have a physics degree) and it was nearly a quarter of a century ago...but isn't one of the major parameters affecting top-speed something called 'DRAG'? And am I correct in recalling something like a quadrupling of drag for a doubling in speed? Therefore, the energy required to move the object (eg car) becomes exponentially higher for a given increase in steady speed. In the case of a car this energy is surely derived from the fuel so fuel consumption goes up exponentially at high speed?
I can't remember the other forces acting against the car...things like 'rolling resistance' etc...maybe they're all part of the same 'drag' thing?
Anyway, doesn't the curve look something like this?
So, any GCSE student failing to appreciate this may (these days!) still get a Grade A but will probably be unlikely to progress much further in this academic field...but worse still may be destined to a lifetime of high fuel bills without understanding why!
Edited by derin100 on Wednesday 22 November 09:19
Edited by derin100 on Wednesday 22 November 09:19
Edited by derin100 on Wednesday 22 November 09:21
Edited by derin100 on Wednesday 22 November 09:56
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