Discussion
1st thing Ive never owned a BMW before nor have I driven any of the Diesels.
Anyway cut to the chase Im kind of interested in the 330d Im aware that they come in 184bhp/204bhp & 231bhp versions.
I would want the 204bhp or 231bhp version and ideally in the Sport or M Sport kit. Im not a fan of Auto but would like to hear from owners who have these cars with auto to see what real life average and best MPG they are getting ditto manual.
I have heard that on long motorway runs witht he 6 speed 330D you can get 50mpg! I also hear that @70mph on the manual the revs are below 1700rpm.
Ive driven many miles in the VAG 115GT TDI PD unit and really enjoy the thrust in gears - I currently drive the Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo 220bhp & 230lbf and I guess combined Im getting 28-32 best being 38mpg with nearly 510miles from a 63ltr tank and so far the worst is 20mpg (when I first got the car!!)
I like the power of turbo units hence why Im not thinking about the 330i (although price dependant it might be an option).
Price wise well I want to spend the least amount possible for the best example (who doesnt). Milage well I think I might be travelling 12-15k a year.
What info does each model have on the Multi Function computer? Or is it purely the dial guage for MPG?
Is the 330d Touring a better buy value for money over the saloon & roughly in feet how long is it (need to check it fits into my garage).
Budget - well for the older model I wouldnt want to be spending over £12k and for the new shape I guess if its possible £20k. The alternatives would be buy a £7k Golf/Leon TDi150, BMW 120d etc.
What are the main problems with the 330d?
Whats the difference in real world performance between the old model and new model.
And any other info that would help me out.
Thanks
Anyway cut to the chase Im kind of interested in the 330d Im aware that they come in 184bhp/204bhp & 231bhp versions.
I would want the 204bhp or 231bhp version and ideally in the Sport or M Sport kit. Im not a fan of Auto but would like to hear from owners who have these cars with auto to see what real life average and best MPG they are getting ditto manual.
I have heard that on long motorway runs witht he 6 speed 330D you can get 50mpg! I also hear that @70mph on the manual the revs are below 1700rpm.
Ive driven many miles in the VAG 115GT TDI PD unit and really enjoy the thrust in gears - I currently drive the Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo 220bhp & 230lbf and I guess combined Im getting 28-32 best being 38mpg with nearly 510miles from a 63ltr tank and so far the worst is 20mpg (when I first got the car!!)
I like the power of turbo units hence why Im not thinking about the 330i (although price dependant it might be an option).
Price wise well I want to spend the least amount possible for the best example (who doesnt). Milage well I think I might be travelling 12-15k a year.
What info does each model have on the Multi Function computer? Or is it purely the dial guage for MPG?
Is the 330d Touring a better buy value for money over the saloon & roughly in feet how long is it (need to check it fits into my garage).
Budget - well for the older model I wouldnt want to be spending over £12k and for the new shape I guess if its possible £20k. The alternatives would be buy a £7k Golf/Leon TDi150, BMW 120d etc.
What are the main problems with the 330d?
Whats the difference in real world performance between the old model and new model.
And any other info that would help me out.
Thanks
Hi,
I've got the E91 330d - no idea how long it is - not much different to the saloon I expect.
I would be very surprised if you can get over 50mpg out of one - mine does 40 on a long run and averages 30-34 depending upon how you drive it - although, if you drive very conservativly, then you will probably get more, but that said - why buy a 330d !!?
Fantastic performance - I have drive the 330d 184bhp when it came out and the E91 is much much better - I assume the 335D better still.
If you enjoy the 'thrust' then this is definately for you - if you like the Golf then I am sure you would not be dissapointed !
Mine is 55 plate and has 22K on the clock and is an M sport touring + Leather + Pan Sunroof + Electic seats + few more bits and was offered £21k against a X3 from a main stealer :-(
Problems : none (apart from door handles fixed on warranty)
barney
I've got the E91 330d - no idea how long it is - not much different to the saloon I expect.
I would be very surprised if you can get over 50mpg out of one - mine does 40 on a long run and averages 30-34 depending upon how you drive it - although, if you drive very conservativly, then you will probably get more, but that said - why buy a 330d !!?
Fantastic performance - I have drive the 330d 184bhp when it came out and the E91 is much much better - I assume the 335D better still.
If you enjoy the 'thrust' then this is definately for you - if you like the Golf then I am sure you would not be dissapointed !
Mine is 55 plate and has 22K on the clock and is an M sport touring + Leather + Pan Sunroof + Electic seats + few more bits and was offered £21k against a X3 from a main stealer :-(
Problems : none (apart from door handles fixed on warranty)
barney
Edited by barney123 on Monday 1st October 16:11
Edited by barney123 on Monday 1st October 16:11
Edited by barney123 on Monday 1st October 16:12
I have an older 320d 136bhp and a 2004 330d 204bhp
I generally drive them like I've stolen them. If you want fuel economy buy a 320d, I get 44mpg from the 320. If you want power without too much of a hit at the fuel pumps go for the 330d. It's a world of difference in terms of power and torque but I only get 36mpg average. Wife gets 42 in the same car generally on motorway runs.
If I were you I would not go for the sport models on the E46. My 330d is a sport and the ride can sometimes be irritatingly firm for a family car and I don't have run flats. The 18" tyres are also a bit of a pain in the wallet. If I were buying again I'd find a non sport version with 17's.
In a 330d personally would go for the auto box (and I did). It's well matched to the bigger engine and in todays stop start driving it's a very relaxing drive. I haven't regreted the auto box selection once. When I commute in the 320d manual I find it a bore to shuffle around a less than slick box.
Sports seats are well worth holding out for. You can get non-sport cars with sports seats.
You're not going to get a good 204 bhp E46 sport touring for 12k. They hold money pretty well (I'm not just saying that). you might get a high mile 184 bhp for that but it's going to have 80k+ on it.
Again, I think you're unrealistic expecting to pick up a E91 for 20k.
Sounds to me that you be better of looking for a good 320d and getting a DMS remap.
I generally drive them like I've stolen them. If you want fuel economy buy a 320d, I get 44mpg from the 320. If you want power without too much of a hit at the fuel pumps go for the 330d. It's a world of difference in terms of power and torque but I only get 36mpg average. Wife gets 42 in the same car generally on motorway runs.
If I were you I would not go for the sport models on the E46. My 330d is a sport and the ride can sometimes be irritatingly firm for a family car and I don't have run flats. The 18" tyres are also a bit of a pain in the wallet. If I were buying again I'd find a non sport version with 17's.
In a 330d personally would go for the auto box (and I did). It's well matched to the bigger engine and in todays stop start driving it's a very relaxing drive. I haven't regreted the auto box selection once. When I commute in the 320d manual I find it a bore to shuffle around a less than slick box.
Sports seats are well worth holding out for. You can get non-sport cars with sports seats.
You're not going to get a good 204 bhp E46 sport touring for 12k. They hold money pretty well (I'm not just saying that). you might get a high mile 184 bhp for that but it's going to have 80k+ on it.
Again, I think you're unrealistic expecting to pick up a E91 for 20k.
Sounds to me that you be better of looking for a good 320d and getting a DMS remap.
Good advice so far.
So in your 204bhp 330d Auto your getting between 35-42mpg thats pretty good going given its an auto I'd suspect that the manual gives a bit more 5mpg??
I agree getting a 231bhp for <£20k might currently be difficult but its not going to be too long maybe 6-12 months before they start breaking through? I may be wrong but by Sept08 the 55 platers will be 3 years old and going byt he glasses guide and other online guides it should be around 50-60% retained value. So assuming a £32k list price buy (and zero options saloon) then its going to be worth £16-19k.
I must say I do love the torque thrust - Ive had high reving petrols before and its tiring. I recall one test dfrive I had in a Civic VTi a 1.6 with 160bhp IIRC. Anyway I tested it up a steep uphill dual carridgeway in 5th at 30mph foot into the carpet a Ford fiesta 1.25 was following me and just drove past - changed down to 4th still nothing then 3rd nothing then 2nd and only at 7,000rpm did it start to get moving but by the time I had caught up with the fiesta he was at the top of the hill. I tried the same test in the Golf GT TDI 115 6th at 30mph (ish) but thats pretty much Idle so I put it into 5th and by 1500rpm it was accelerating at a good enough pace and by 1900rpm it was into its stride. 4th would have been ideal but I was surprised at how well it did in 5th.
My Fiat C 20VT 5 speed has 230lbf @2500rpm which equates to about 65mph in 5th so you can see the type of real world usable power.
Ive been in a 328i and unless it was thrashed to the red line there was little power (what Im used to) in fact it felt pretty slow just lots of revs and low economy to achieve that.
So in your 204bhp 330d Auto your getting between 35-42mpg thats pretty good going given its an auto I'd suspect that the manual gives a bit more 5mpg??
I agree getting a 231bhp for <£20k might currently be difficult but its not going to be too long maybe 6-12 months before they start breaking through? I may be wrong but by Sept08 the 55 platers will be 3 years old and going byt he glasses guide and other online guides it should be around 50-60% retained value. So assuming a £32k list price buy (and zero options saloon) then its going to be worth £16-19k.
I must say I do love the torque thrust - Ive had high reving petrols before and its tiring. I recall one test dfrive I had in a Civic VTi a 1.6 with 160bhp IIRC. Anyway I tested it up a steep uphill dual carridgeway in 5th at 30mph foot into the carpet a Ford fiesta 1.25 was following me and just drove past - changed down to 4th still nothing then 3rd nothing then 2nd and only at 7,000rpm did it start to get moving but by the time I had caught up with the fiesta he was at the top of the hill. I tried the same test in the Golf GT TDI 115 6th at 30mph (ish) but thats pretty much Idle so I put it into 5th and by 1500rpm it was accelerating at a good enough pace and by 1900rpm it was into its stride. 4th would have been ideal but I was surprised at how well it did in 5th.
My Fiat C 20VT 5 speed has 230lbf @2500rpm which equates to about 65mph in 5th so you can see the type of real world usable power.
Ive been in a 328i and unless it was thrashed to the red line there was little power (what Im used to) in fact it felt pretty slow just lots of revs and low economy to achieve that.
Olf said:
Sounds to me that you be better of looking for a good 320d and getting a DMS remap.
Im pretty cautious about chipping cars - clear concern about reduced engine life + increased insurance premiums.Out of interest how much does a DMS chip increase the premium on a 330d? % wise and actual £ wise.
Thanks
Welshbeef said:
Olf said:
Sounds to me that you be better of looking for a good 320d and getting a DMS remap.
Im pretty cautious about chipping cars - clear concern about reduced engine life + increased insurance premiums.Out of interest how much does a DMS chip increase the premium on a 330d? % wise and actual £ wise.
Thanks
we have a sep 2003 53 plate 330d sport auto.
Very good car, especially if they have all the features. Prefer an e39 though any day.
Bits that go wrong are injectors and turbos, neither have malfunctioned in my short ownership of the car.
The autobox does the job very well an suits the car, manual will be a total pain in the ass ini a car like this, especially as the seats and pedals aren't in line and operating a clutch would be difficult.
Handling is very go karty, I have 18" MV2s with low profile tyres, however the ride is VERY hard.
I had it remapped by e-maps, goes like crazy now though! just makes such a difference.
Go for it, you won't be disappointed!
Very good car, especially if they have all the features. Prefer an e39 though any day.
Bits that go wrong are injectors and turbos, neither have malfunctioned in my short ownership of the car.
The autobox does the job very well an suits the car, manual will be a total pain in the ass ini a car like this, especially as the seats and pedals aren't in line and operating a clutch would be difficult.
Handling is very go karty, I have 18" MV2s with low profile tyres, however the ride is VERY hard.
I had it remapped by e-maps, goes like crazy now though! just makes such a difference.
Go for it, you won't be disappointed!
jamoor said:
we have a sep 2003 53 plate 330d sport auto.
Very good car, especially if they have all the features. Prefer an e39 though any day.
Bits that go wrong are injectors and turbos, neither have malfunctioned in my short ownership of the car.
The autobox does the job very well an suits the car, manual will be a total pain in the ass ini a car like this, especially as the seats and pedals aren't in line and operating a clutch would be difficult.
Handling is very go karty, I have 18" MV2s with low profile tyres, however the ride is VERY hard.
I had it remapped by e-maps, goes like crazy now though! just makes such a difference.
Go for it, you won't be disappointed!
I take your point - the handling is good-ish but it's no go-kart. I think mine might be compromised somewhat because it has a hidden tow-bar, upgraded suspension and self leveling suspension which all combined can't help.Very good car, especially if they have all the features. Prefer an e39 though any day.
Bits that go wrong are injectors and turbos, neither have malfunctioned in my short ownership of the car.
The autobox does the job very well an suits the car, manual will be a total pain in the ass ini a car like this, especially as the seats and pedals aren't in line and operating a clutch would be difficult.
Handling is very go karty, I have 18" MV2s with low profile tyres, however the ride is VERY hard.
I had it remapped by e-maps, goes like crazy now though! just makes such a difference.
Go for it, you won't be disappointed!
Olf said:
jamoor said:
we have a sep 2003 53 plate 330d sport auto.
Very good car, especially if they have all the features. Prefer an e39 though any day.
Bits that go wrong are injectors and turbos, neither have malfunctioned in my short ownership of the car.
The autobox does the job very well an suits the car, manual will be a total pain in the ass ini a car like this, especially as the seats and pedals aren't in line and operating a clutch would be difficult.
Handling is very go karty, I have 18" MV2s with low profile tyres, however the ride is VERY hard.
I had it remapped by e-maps, goes like crazy now though! just makes such a difference.
Go for it, you won't be disappointed!
I take your point - the handling is good-ish but it's no go-kart. I think mine might be compromised somewhat because it has a hidden tow-bar, upgraded suspension and self leveling suspension which all combined can't help.Very good car, especially if they have all the features. Prefer an e39 though any day.
Bits that go wrong are injectors and turbos, neither have malfunctioned in my short ownership of the car.
The autobox does the job very well an suits the car, manual will be a total pain in the ass ini a car like this, especially as the seats and pedals aren't in line and operating a clutch would be difficult.
Handling is very go karty, I have 18" MV2s with low profile tyres, however the ride is VERY hard.
I had it remapped by e-maps, goes like crazy now though! just makes such a difference.
Go for it, you won't be disappointed!
Is that possible on these?
I know it is on the e39.
Welshbeef said:
Ok not many views really on the 231bhp v 204bhp.
I read in Autocar that they are running an Alpina D3 basically a 320D modified to 200bhp & 300lbf with the benefit of better fuel economy and no options needed all for £26k !!
Not many views to share because the 204 bhp 330d was the E46 and the 231 bhp is the E91. Two very different cars with two very different price brackets. I read in Autocar that they are running an Alpina D3 basically a 320D modified to 200bhp & 300lbf with the benefit of better fuel economy and no options needed all for £26k !!
I personally can't see the point of the Alpina D3 at the moment. BMW have already announced that the next iteration of the 320d will be 204bhp which for me leaves the D3 looking like an expensive luxury. I think no options needed is also a bit of a red herring. e.g. is Bluetooth and Sat Nav standard in the D3? I'd be surprised.
I can only suggest that you drive a late E46 330d and an early e91 330d and decide if, for you, the E91 represents a significant enough advance to justify the extra wonga. I didn't think it did. By the end of it's life the E46 was a well polished, well made generally glitch free car. Thats where my money went. Having said that it was over 18months ago and most E46's will not be nearing the end of the stad 3 year warranty.
True the 231bhp clearly must be much faster & from the BMW brochure's its a fair bit more economical too!
Agree about the price braket two usually uncomparable cars but my take on it is this - both are 330d's aimed at the same market and in the real world will the additional 27bhp & xxlbf really make the additional costs worth it? Im not sure it does.
The worrying thing I keep hearing about the 330D is turbo failure (possibly due to long service intervals and fleet owners not checking their oil levles during that long period) and the expensive injector costs.
Agree about the price braket two usually uncomparable cars but my take on it is this - both are 330d's aimed at the same market and in the real world will the additional 27bhp & xxlbf really make the additional costs worth it? Im not sure it does.
The worrying thing I keep hearing about the 330D is turbo failure (possibly due to long service intervals and fleet owners not checking their oil levles during that long period) and the expensive injector costs.
Welshbeef said:
True the 231bhp clearly must be much faster & from the BMW brochure's its a fair bit more economical too!
Agree about the price braket two usually uncomparable cars but my take on it is this - both are 330d's aimed at the same market and in the real world will the additional 27bhp & xxlbf really make the additional costs worth it? Im not sure it does.
The worrying thing I keep hearing about the 330D is turbo failure (possibly due to long service intervals and fleet owners not checking their oil levles during that long period) and the expensive injector costs.
I don't think the additional 27 bhp is the issue. For me it's the flexibility of the engine. The 231 engine has a smother power delivery with low rev pickup. The 204 is however a great engine and you'd be hard pushed to be disappointed with it. You just get to learn that the full power only really comes in about 1sec after you've stabbed the go pedal (in the auto at least). Agree about the price braket two usually uncomparable cars but my take on it is this - both are 330d's aimed at the same market and in the real world will the additional 27bhp & xxlbf really make the additional costs worth it? Im not sure it does.
The worrying thing I keep hearing about the 330D is turbo failure (possibly due to long service intervals and fleet owners not checking their oil levles during that long period) and the expensive injector costs.
The 204 will generally get you away from the lights before even the most determined 'fast' cars. The surge up to 50mph is truly impressive. If you factor in and plan for that 1sec delay in acceleration not much can keep up!
As for maintenance costs like I say, you either get a warranty or you don't. If you don't a popped turbo or naff injector can make the running costs of a 330i seem a lot more attractive! Early E46 320d's seemed to be the ones with the turbo problems. I rarely see any complaints about the 204 turbo.
Thanks for that Olf.
I personally like the rear of the 231bhp and the front of the 204bhp (not interested in the 184bhp model as many VAG units are quicker in std tune).
The auto is a 5 speed on the 204bhp?
Is it that for the manual a 6 speed indicates that its the 204bhp version?
Also what the very best you have got MPG and the worst. If your driving at 70mph what sort of MPG can I expect?
What are the downsides of the 330D? (ignoring the points "its a diesel"
I personally like the rear of the 231bhp and the front of the 204bhp (not interested in the 184bhp model as many VAG units are quicker in std tune).
The auto is a 5 speed on the 204bhp?
Is it that for the manual a 6 speed indicates that its the 204bhp version?
Also what the very best you have got MPG and the worst. If your driving at 70mph what sort of MPG can I expect?
What are the downsides of the 330D? (ignoring the points "its a diesel"
Apache said:
How can you tell if you're looking at a 204bhp car as opposed to the less powerful model? Did the change occur at a specific period?
Pretty sure it was part of the facelift between 03 plate and 53 plate.The 204hp ones have the 6 speed box in manual cars rather than the 5 speed. Pretty sure its facelift related so the front wings / indicators changed as did the alloys.
Certainly 53 was the first of the facelifts.
Welshbeef said:
Thanks for that Olf.
I personally like the rear of the 231bhp and the front of the 204bhp (not interested in the 184bhp model as many VAG units are quicker in std tune).
The auto is a 5 speed on the 204bhp?
Is it that for the manual a 6 speed indicates that its the 204bhp version?
Also what the very best you have got MPG and the worst. If your driving at 70mph what sort of MPG can I expect?
What are the downsides of the 330D? (ignoring the points "its a diesel"
If you could drive at 70mph you'd get 45 I reckon. I can't. Wife gets 42 as I said earlier.As soon as you nudge 80 you get a quite obvious mpg drop. Very worst seems to be about 35 but thats ragging the car.I personally like the rear of the 231bhp and the front of the 204bhp (not interested in the 184bhp model as many VAG units are quicker in std tune).
The auto is a 5 speed on the 204bhp?
Is it that for the manual a 6 speed indicates that its the 204bhp version?
Also what the very best you have got MPG and the worst. If your driving at 70mph what sort of MPG can I expect?
What are the downsides of the 330D? (ignoring the points "its a diesel"
Auto is 5 spd.
Downsides - not sure there are any apart from bills if it goes awry and your not under warranty.
Don't forget this car has been named a number of times as the best all round car you can buy. Ever. Anywhere.
Sports seats come on the sports models and SE models with upgraded seats.
So 35mpg @ worst & 42mpg @ best out of a 5 speed Auto.... very impressive the manual must be 5mpg better too.
Yes I have read the reports about the 231bhp being all the car you'd ever need (not seen one for the 204bhp though). When you look at the VAG/Skoda/Seat forums they all keep going on about "I killed a 330d the other night" clearly the driver wasnt trying or was lol at the though that a little city car was seriously trying to beat him. Anyway as there is a lot of talk about Ive got 330D beating power puts a huge amount of confidence in the 330D - as its what everybody wants really anyway.
Now where to find a good one? Im in Berkshire (Reading).
Yes I have read the reports about the 231bhp being all the car you'd ever need (not seen one for the 204bhp though). When you look at the VAG/Skoda/Seat forums they all keep going on about "I killed a 330d the other night" clearly the driver wasnt trying or was lol at the though that a little city car was seriously trying to beat him. Anyway as there is a lot of talk about Ive got 330D beating power puts a huge amount of confidence in the 330D - as its what everybody wants really anyway.
Now where to find a good one? Im in Berkshire (Reading).
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