Discussion
Mr2Mike said:
Prof Prolapse said:
Better f
k off the whole idea and sit around hoping someone pulls the perfect solution out of their arse then.
Yes, that's just the kind of attitude we need to help secure our future energy requirements k off the whole idea and sit around hoping someone pulls the perfect solution out of their arse then.
I was taking the piss out of you because you implied this wasn't a perfect solution and therefore had no value! I personally think these ideas have potential, even if they are (sometimes very) rough around the edges. Interesting in any instance.
JaguarsportXJR said:
Agreed. The only issue is that although everybody wants a more secure supply, no-one wants their power off for the day while the cables are replaced or to sit in traffic due to the road works. I'm not for an instant saying it can't be done - I know it can - just suggesting it's not as easy as some think.
Yeah. I don't think we're going to see people abandoning petrol overnight though so I think we'll be alright.I mean look at Pistonheads. There are people here who would rather pay obscene amounts of cash to keep their petrol engines, even if electric cars managed to better it in every conceivable way.
Ironically I'd probably be one of them.
I will just point out that the infrastructure supporting our petrol/diesel cars is hardly a model of efficiency, with massive trucks moving it by road from the few refineries to retail outlets all over the country.
I think smarter companies are now moving away from the green association as the debate is complex, and emotional. Think BMW using blue for its i3 and i8 prototypes. I guess I did like the idea of no exhaust emissions when I chose an electric sports car over some obvious and desirable petrol alternatives, but really it was the extraordinary power delivery, incorporating regen braking into B road driving, and the mechanical simplicity of it.
Yes, I am also leaving more fuel for you, and no, I don't eat lentils
I think smarter companies are now moving away from the green association as the debate is complex, and emotional. Think BMW using blue for its i3 and i8 prototypes. I guess I did like the idea of no exhaust emissions when I chose an electric sports car over some obvious and desirable petrol alternatives, but really it was the extraordinary power delivery, incorporating regen braking into B road driving, and the mechanical simplicity of it.
Yes, I am also leaving more fuel for you, and no, I don't eat lentils
Mr2Mike said:
Talksteer said:
The Tesla Model S battery is twice as energy dense as the GM Volt battery for example. In fact scaling from the Model S battery Tesla could supply an 8kwh battery for a weight of only 50kg, less than the weight of most motorcycle engines.
That's just the battery (equivalent to a fuel tank). If you are comparing to an engine you have to include the motor, transmission and drive electronics etc. FWIW, just 0.61 kg of petrol contains the equivalent of 8kWh. Obviously petrol engines are pretty inefficient, so you'll need to burn 3-4 times that amount to get the same shaft power, but the difference in energy density is still huge.Also based on the prices for the Tesla Model S battery an 8kwh battery from them would come in at around $3200, which would actually make such a vehicle financially viable as well provided you could make enough of them.
In the next 5-10 years you are looking at Lithium-Sulfur chemisties appearing which would increase battery capacity about two fold over lithium-ion making the electric drive-line comparable in weight to a petrol one.
Ninjaboy]rof Prolapse said:
Better fk off the whole idea and sit around hoping someone pulls the perfect solution out of their arse then.
[/quot
I liked the original 7 series idea. A normal internal conbusion engine that ran on hydrogen or something (water was the exahust emissions) iirc
I agree.k off the whole idea and sit around hoping someone pulls the perfect solution out of their arse then.[/quot
I liked the original 7 series idea. A normal internal conbusion engine that ran on hydrogen or something (water was the exahust emissions) iirc
IC engines are now very good at what they do and still improving. The fundamental issue with them is simply the choice of fuel.
Change the fuel then we already have a distribution network setup to mange it and nobody has range anxiety.
Leccy motors are fine for city commuter cars but it does make me laugh when people say about the high torque from a leccy motor when it goes through a single fixed ratio... A IC engine may be much lower (in some cases) but having a gearbox means that it'll be able to put out more torque at the wheels.
Prof Prolapse said:
Irony fail?
I was taking the piss out of you because you implied this wasn't a perfect solution and therefore had no value!
Double irony failure?I was taking the piss out of you because you implied this wasn't a perfect solution and therefore had no value!
I was taking the piss out of you because you clearly hadn't read what I said in context i.e. as a reply to someone who implied that it was only heavy because it's a prototype model, or at least early days for electric bikes. The point is that batteries aren't going to remotely approach the energy density of hydrocarbon fuels for the foreseeable future.
Mr2Mike said:
Prof Prolapse said:
Irony fail?
I was taking the piss out of you because you implied this wasn't a perfect solution and therefore had no value!
Double irony failure?I was taking the piss out of you because you implied this wasn't a perfect solution and therefore had no value!
I was taking the piss out of you because you clearly hadn't read what I said in context i.e. as a reply to someone who implied that it was only heavy because it's a prototype model, or at least early days for electric bikes. The point is that batteries aren't going to remotely approach the energy density of hydrocarbon fuels for the foreseeable future.
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