The friendly "dumb" bike questions thread

[Prof Prolapse]

Making an accessory fuse box now actually... Final version won't rely on partially insulated (and incorrectly sized) spade connectors, this was just the one to check it all worked.



Not shown is the ignition live connector. I found a terminal under the seat. Then purchased a matching female terminal on eBay, and that runs to the relay.

When the ignition is on, the relay triggers, the box is then powered by the battery. There's simply no space for multiple ring connectors directly on the Africa Twin battery. Fuses are also accessible, the Honda OEM stuff is actually inferior in this respect (but much neater).

Edited by Prof Prolapse on Wednesday 7th March 11:56

[Cbull]

Thanks for the suggestions chaps. Although it looks like a good all singing and dancing fuse box, the £80 price tag seems a little steep.

Looks like it'll be a good'un once up and running PP. Think I need to research this a little more and at least find out where the live ignition cable.

[wiliferus]

Taking out a newbie pillion over the next few weeks. She’s not pillioned before, so am looking at buying some ‘love handles’.
Firstly, anybody know if they’re actually any good... as in, do they actually make your pillion feel safer?
And secondly, and recommendations?
Bikes a Fazer8 so reasonably comfy, not perched on a penny on the back of a GSXR.

[Cbull]

wiliferus said:

Firstly, anybody know if they’re actually any good... as in, do they actually make your pillion feel safer?

I would say yes. Better than the pillion grabbing your waist. I've only had my son and a couple of his friends on the back for a small ride out. All had weakened forearms when we got back as they were grabbing it probably a little too tight so I'm assuming they're essential. Although, that could all be down to my dodgy riding.

[cbmotorsport]

Faze 8 has nice grab handles on the pillion seat doesn't it? I'd be inclined to grab those instead of your love handles.

One hand on the grab handles, one round waist and using tank to brace when braking. Swap when stopped to prevent arm ache.

Edited by cbmotorsport on Wednesday 7th March 14:23

[graham22]

wiliferus said:

Taking out a newbie pillion over the next few weeks. She’s not pillioned before, so am looking at buying some ‘love handles’.
Firstly, anybody know if they’re actually any good... as in, do they actually make your pillion feel safer?
And secondly, and recommendations?
Bikes a Fazer8 so reasonably comfy, not perched on a penny on the back of a GSXR.

Much rather a (female) passenger hold around my waist, can reach tank for heavy braking.

As it's a fist time out, assume you'll be taking it gentle, leave your pockets open & let her put her hands in there (assuming normal short type jacket with pockets rather than longer winter jacket) - we used to do this as kids on the back of dads bike.

[RizzoTheRat]

wiliferus said:

Bikes a Fazer8 so reasonably comfy, not perched on a penny on the back of a GSXR.

If you have a topbox put it on, they don't need to put any weight on it but just having something behind them gives a sense of security to a pillion. If you don't have a topbox get one, it's a Fazer for heavens sake, should be compulsory

Other top tip for new pillions is don't try to impress them with hard acceleration, you might think it's cool (because it is) but wait until they're happy on the back and want to go faster. Scare them on the first trip out and they won't want to go again.

Cbull said:

Thanks for the suggestions chaps. Although it looks like a good all singing and dancing fuse box, the £80 price tag seems a little steep.

Looks like it'll be a good'un once up and running PP. Think I need to research this a little more and at least find out where the live ignition cable.

£80 is steep, but for me it was worth it as I running quite a few different things off it and my biggest problem was actually finding a decent connector block. If you're only running a couple of things off it a simple automotive relay, an inline fuse holder, and a selection of crimp fittings will set you back less than a fiver.

If you're using a relay wire you're take the switched live from has next to no current running down it, all it's doing is closing the relay to connect you to the battery, so plenty of places you can hook in to, mine runs off the connector block to the headlights.

[Prof Prolapse]

RizzoTheRat said:

£80 is steep, but for me it was worth it as I running quite a few different things off it and my biggest problem was actually finding a decent connector block. If you're only running a couple of things off it a simple automotive relay, an inline fuse holder, and a selection of crimp fittings will set you back less than a fiver.

If you're using a relay wire you're take the switched live from has next to no current running down it, all it's doing is closing the relay to connect you to the battery, so plenty of places you can hook in to, mine runs off the connector block to the headlights.

Just FYI, you can get matching connector blocks, "Sumitomo", was the brand I used for the Honda, sourced from ebay. About £3 for mine. Good enough quality, perfect fit to OEM, and waterpoof.

[Krikkit]

You could also use something like this, not quite as swish but still pretty clever, and 10x cheaper.

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/product.php/...



Plus a weather-sealed relay.

Edited by Krikkit on Wednesday 7th March 16:25

[Plinth]

This is probably a simple (and quite dumb) question:
My 600 Diversion has a 4-2 system, with cylinders 1 & 4 feeding one exhaust and 2 & 3 feeding the other.
I’ve not seen this on other inline 4 cylinder bikes and the old XJ600 had a conventional 1 & 2, 3 & 4 set up.
Why was this changed for the Diversion?
TIA

[Cbull]

Thanks Rizzo. Krikkit that Fuse Box looks about right. Where do all the Negatives go?

[Prof Prolapse]

If you look Cbull that is the same one I have pictured on the last page. Just with six fuses rather than my four (I have removed the cover).

You will need to construct your own negative terminal. As many others do, I use a feed directly from the battery using 2.5mm^2 core (~29AMP rated).

That bolt on the fusebox is the +ve from the battery. This should come via an automotive relay (all of which should be sealed as standard by the way). All of the male spade terminals pirctures are +ve feeds for the accessories.

Just FYI, you can buy buy the same one for half that price elsewhere.

It's not hard to set up, but if like me you're an amateur, you do need to be sure to use the correct connectors, correct rated wire, and think about things like water ingress, and what happens if the spade connectors rattle loose and start shorting things.

If I finish my DIY effort on Saturday I'll stick a picture up.

[Cbull]

Top bloke PP That'd be great thanks.

So, this wiring diagram actually shows it all quite well then. Difference being, I'll grab a terminal block and connect all the negatives to the block then to the battery. Shall grab a feed from either the Ignition or the Junction Box which seems to have a 10A Accessory Fuse (will try and get it from the ignition though as not 100% sure on that one, JB would be better though due to its location).

https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/516436282245090184...

Getting there

[Prof Prolapse]

When I click that's a whole page of wiring pictures so not sure which one you mean unfortunately.

You can buy -ve terminals for a couple of quid, or you even just use an ~M6 bolt and some ring connectors. I'm currently using using a 5 pin Wago clip and just feeding the -ve directly from the battery, and the -ve accessory feeds will just go into the same reusable Wago clip.

I'm new to this myself but do you mean using the accessory fuse as a switched live for the relay? Or as a +ve feed for the entire box?

If that feed is only on with the ignition, you might be able to draw more than 10AMPs and just up the fuse size (depending on the wire rating) and you are, in my head at least, making the whole accessory fusebox idea a bit redundant. You could just use that wire to power your accessories assuming they draw less than the wire and fuse rating. (10AMPs is sufficient for heated grips at full chat, with about 5AMP left for a USB charger and possibly some LEDs by the way).

You see that's not an option for me as (1) I don't have the space (2) I have a manufacturer warranty invalidated if I even slightly cut and splice and (3) I want to draw up to 20 AMPs, and (4) I am just a bit fking bored and tragic.

[Cbull]

Sorry, the link was blocked in work so couldn't double check. Try this one https://goo.gl/images/t4DYbR or http://www.canyonchasers.net/shop/generic/relay.ph...

Will go down the wago route as it seems to be the tidier option. 10A should suffice, currently only have the heated gloves, will add a phone charger and maybe in the future add some heated grips (which wouldn't be on at the same time as the heated gloves).

[crofty1984]

Here's mine in situ with the indicator relay. The Starfire is positive earth, hence the number of red wires.

[Cbull]

That's way too tidy. You'll need to rip it up and start again

[Mr2Mike]

Plinth said:

This is probably a simple (and quite dumb) question:
My 600 Diversion has a 4-2 system, with cylinders 1 & 4 feeding one exhaust and 2 & 3 feeding the other.
I’ve not seen this on other inline 4 cylinder bikes and the old XJ600 had a conventional 1 & 2, 3 & 4 set up.
Why was this changed for the Diversion?
TIA

Loads of 4 cylinders bikes have a 4-2 exhaust, except it's then followed by a 2-1 section giving a 4-2-1 system that provides a good balance of mid and top end power.

Pairing cylinders 1&4 and 2&3 is conventional as this provides equal timing for the exhaust strokes so pulse tuning can be used. Pairing 1&2 and 3&4 on a flat plane inline 4 would remove this possibility and seems pointless, but I suppose might give a packaging/cost advantage on lower performance applications.

Edited by Mr2Mike on Saturday 10th March 08:26

[Plinth]

Mr2Mike said:

Plinth said:

This is probably a simple (and quite dumb) question:
My 600 Diversion has a 4-2 system, with cylinders 1 & 4 feeding one exhaust and 2 & 3 feeding the other.
I’ve not seen this on other inline 4 cylinder bikes and the old XJ600 had a conventional 1 & 2, 3 & 4 set up.
Why was this changed for the Diversion?
TIA

Loads of 4 cylinders bikes have a 4-2 exhaust, except it's then followed by a 2-1 section giving a 4-2-1 system that provides a good balance of mid and top end power.

Pairing cylinders 1&4 and 2&3 is conventional as this provides equal timing for the exhaust strokes so pulse tuning can be used. Pairing 1&2 and 3&4 on a flat plane inline 4 would remove this possibility and seems pointless, but I suppose might give a packaging/cost advantage on lower performance applications.

Edited by Mr2Mike on Saturday 10th March 08:26

Thanks for that

I thought there must be a technical reason why they changed the layout from the previous model, but I know very little about exhausts.
(I shall now read up about pulse tuning)
The only other bike I have found with the same layout is the CBX550 Honda (1980's).
I did notice that there is no balancer pipe connection between the two silencers - so not needed in this set up?
The Divvy downpipes (tuned for power )

[Globs]

Cbull said:

Thanks Rizzo. Krikkit that Fuse Box looks about right. Where do all the Negatives go?

The bike's frame is connected to negative already so you earth items direct to the frame.

Cars are the same - common earth, so 4 lights just need 4 wires going to them instead of 8 - saves a lot of copper.

Try to make sure the wire from the battery to that fuse box is safe - or put an additional big inline fuse near to the battery to avoid a permanently live unfused wire threading through the bike (avoids faults turning into fires).

Edited by Globs on Sunday 11th March 14:35