Post your dyno curve here

[ivanhoew]

DangerousDerek said:

drlloyd said:

Thank you. Looking at the various drag strip results it looks as though it is all timed in stages too? So should be able to see the true pace of the car, even if my reaction times are poor!

yep, Reaction times are only important when trying to beat the guy in the other lane. Your ET isn't affected as your time only starts when you set of and break the timing beam. ETs don't mean much when assessing the grunt. Its all about terminal speed.
Most V8's will top 100, a good 450 or 500 will approach 110. Those that have modified successfully can see 115ish.

A good example on the effect of power to weight is my 1310 cc 72 austin mini ,ran 112mph terminals ,with less power but at 620 kg .

[phazed]

That is a hell of a top speed for a mini!

[drlloyd]

SILICONEKID 345HP 12.03 said:

My car makes about 345hp at the fly,it's a v8d 5l with I think stage 4 heads and Stealth cam

What power would it make with the wild cat heads?

What else would need upgraded ?

It's getting exciting ..

Edited by SILICONEKID 345HP 12.03 on Saturday 2nd June 16:52

Typical gains from this conversion should be about 100bhp but it does depend on the maximum safe engine speed of the engine. Bigger engines typically have a lower safe engine speed (longer stroke = higher piston speed for same given engine speed) but conversely the bigger engines will produce peak power and torque at lower engine speeds. I wouldn't feel comfortable revving an original TVR spec 5-litre much over 6000rpm but ACR supply 'short stroke' cross-bolted 5-litre engines that are rated to 7000rpm. Don't know what your short engine is rated to, you would need to ask V8D.
Wouldn't necessarily need to change the camshaft, as a given cam spec will give different characteristics with the larger valves. Uprated injectors would be included with any conversion. You would definitely need aftermarket fully programmable engine management - the fuel & ignition requirements are very different!
Over 400bhp will be easily achievable with a 5-litre in any case.

Edited by drlloyd on Sunday 3rd June 09:58

[QBee]

The V8 D stealth cam is very torquey. Daz has an Emerald ECU, so that’s dealt with. And you could sell your stage 4 heads, Daz - loads of people on here who would want them. I have a spare set of Cerbera injectors - would they be big enough?

[ivanhoew]

phazed said:

That is a hell of a top speed for a mini!

i have to admit i was a bit surprised , it was only on old falkens and an open diff.

[SILICONEKID 345HP 12.03]

When will these heads be forsale and any idea of the costs ?

Rev limit can easily be set on the ecu.

Edited by SILICONEKID 345HP 12.03 on Sunday 3rd June 22:40

[Yex 450]

QBee said:

And you could sell your stage 4 heads, Daz - loads of people on here who would want them.

If these would work as a direct fit onto my 450 without the need for pocketed pistons I may be interested

[QBee]

Yex 450 said:

QBee said:

And you could sell your stage 4 heads, Daz - loads of people on here who would want them.

If these would work as a direct fit onto my 450 without the need for pocketed pistons I may be interested

Pocketed pistons - depends on what cam you are using I think

[Yex 450]

QBee said:

Yex 450 said:

QBee said:

And you could sell your stage 4 heads, Daz - loads of people on here who would want them.

If these would work as a direct fit onto my 450 without the need for pocketed pistons I may be interested

Pocketed pistons - depends on what cam you are using I think

Ah, so the penny drops.........I think. A high lift cam would provide greater depth of movement for the valves and thus require pocketed pistons to prevent impact. I have had one of Dom's 885 cams fitted which I think is quite mild so perhaps I may be good to go.

Once funds allow I'll chat to Joolz and see what he thinks

[ivanhoew]

Yex ,bear in mind if the valves are bigger then the current piston pockets are(if there are any ) then hittage could occur even with the same cam.

[Yex 450]

ivanhoew said:

Yex ,bear in mind if the valves are bigger then the current piston pockets are(if there are any ) then hittage could occur even with the same cam.

Every day a school day

I now understand why you can get so far reasonably easily with these cars and then extra ooomph starts to get into the £100 per BHP other more experienced engine developers have written about.

[QBee]

Yex 450 said:

ivanhoew said:

Yex ,bear in mind if the valves are bigger then the current piston pockets are(if there are any ) then hittage could occur even with the same cam.

Every day a school day

I now understand why you can get so far reasonably easily with these cars and then extra ooomph starts to get into the £100 per BHP other more experienced engine developers have written about.

As has been said by the Lloyds (and me), the real restricting factor on these engines is the heads. So discuss everything fully and grow your understanding of all the possible mods you can do, but always remember that you will waste a lot of money if you don’t upgrade your heads first, and if you do upgrade them many of your subsequent mods will be about ensuring other bits of the engine and transmission can handle the power.
Also bear in mind what you want to do with the car once you have increased the power. There are pretty quick cars straight out of the factory, and there is not a lot of point in adding 100 bhp at great expense if the car will only be taking you to Tescos in St Helier.

[CanoeSniffer]

drlloyd said:

A few engine bay shots of our TVR Chimaera 400 - naturally aspirated 4.1-litre Rover V8 with 373 bhp and 315 lb-ft at the flywheel!

Awesome numbers!!! Have you any idea Daniel, what's the N/A peak you would expect to see from an early pre-serp non-crossbolted 400 with the 3.9 engine? I'm giving consideration to going turbo but if halfway impressive performance can be found without needing that funny whirly thing I'm all ears!

[ChimpOnGas]

QBee said:

Also bear in mind what you want to do with the car once you have increased the power. There are pretty quick cars straight out of the factory, and there is not a lot of point in adding 100 bhp at great expense if the car will only be taking you to Tescos in St Helier.

To me a Chimaera is an improved classic, in completely standard spec you get all the back to basics thrills and connected analogue driving experience of the traditional 60's British sports cars we all love.... with the addition of:

• Better brakes
• Better handling
• Fuel injection
• A five speed gearbox
• Improved ergonomics
• A really good turn of speed

All things you might look to add to a classic to improve it and make it usable on modern roads, indeed all things Frontline add to the MGB and Eagle add to the E-Type.

The far too often overlooked brilliance of a Chimaera is you get all these things as standard and for a very good price when compared with the traditional default 1960's classic British sports cars like Austin Healeys, E-Types ect ect. Even if you did the improving of your 60's classic yourself, even if you started at the cheaper end with an MGB... you'd still be looking at spending well over £20k for the donor car and all the upgrades.

And while the end result for your £20k plus investment will be a far superior MGB, it will still be a long way behind what you get with a completely stock Chimaera, now consider you can still buy a super nice well sorted Chimaera for £14k, you get the far better improved classic and for £6k less...

I think you'll find that's what they call a no-brainer!

When designing the Chimaera TVR started with the very 1960's design of a tube back bone chassis and a separate fiberglass body bolted to it, because the truth is this is the exact same recipe TVR had been using since the 1960's. Of course by the 1990's they had the benefit of years of developing this super simple and very 1960's construction, and they needed the car to be saleable in the 1990's as by this time the competition like Porsche were producing much more sophisticated designs that were literally light years ahead.

This perseverance with a very basic and out of date construction formula was driven by the fact the cars still needed to assembled by hand and because TVR simply didn't have the money to develop something more sophisticated and modern. This all sounds quite negative but the irony is it actually created a quite brilliant happy accident, the happy accident of TVR building a really rather good 'improved classic' that predated the trend for building improved classic we've seen a massive rise in over the last 10 years.

What I'm saying is, the Chimaera is quite clearly a very practical improved British classic with fantastic GT abilities, so for me all this obsession with huge horsepower is in many ways completely missing the point of the car's true attributes, for example if I wanted a track day car I would absolutely no question buy a Caterham 7.

While I'm sure 375hp must be insanely thrilling in a Chimaera, playing Devil's Advocate I'd have to argue what use is all that power in an improved classic British sports car if you've got to stop every 200 miles to put £70 of fuel in it? Suddenly you've taken a very practical GT in the classic theme that'll whisk you down to the South of France in style and comfort, and (for a lot of money) turned it into a weekend toy that's only really practical for occasional use.

Suddenly for all your obsession with horsepower you've actually removed the very element the car excels at

At which point you've got to ask yourself the question.... "Perhaps I should I have started with a more suitable platform that meets my true needs in the first place?"

The above is just another perspective and is the opinion of one, I would always caveat my points with my strong belief in the idea that.... 'it's your car, so you have every right do with it what you want'.

I embrace what others are achieving with these cars as there are some truly remarkable results being presented here, it's just for me what already sits at the true core of a completely standard Chimaera is a brilliant improved classic British sports car with really capable GT qualities that should be seen as an exceptional value alternative to something like an Eagle E-Type or a Frontline MGB.

I have taken a different path to the big horsepower crowd because improving my Chimaera is all about enhancing the car's core natural qualities, it's also way cheaper and easier to polish and refine what you have already, than trying to take a design and turn into something it was never intended to be

Of course the elephant in the room that all hot rodders and modifiers seldom discuss is that of reliability, reliability is also the hardest thing to achieve because none of us, amateurs or professional TVR specialists alike, have the development budgets, knowledge, resources and skill bank of a big OEM. For example..... for all it's 50mpg petrol cost equivalent fuel economy brilliance my LPG conversion delivers... If it can't be matched with sustained consistent reliability it really would be nothing more that an interesting post on PH and ultimately a complete folly!

[Squirrelofwoe]

ChimpOnGas said:

I embrace what others are achieving with these cars as there are some truly remarkable results being presented here, it's just for me what already sits at the true core of a completely standard Chimaera is a brilliant improved classic British sports car with really capable GT qualities that should be seen as an exceptional value alternative to something like an Eagle E-Type or a Frontline MGB.

Completely agree with that sentiment, it's exactly how I view the Chimaera. My girlfriend's dad has a Healey 3000- looks superb, makes a great noise, and goes pretty well too. But even 10 years ago it cost almost over twice the price of a sorted Chimaera, and the Chimaera doesn't leak when it rains

Importantly though, the Chimaera still 'feels' like a classic. The RV8 sounds like an old donkey (because essentially that's what it is), and the car is all the better for it in my opinion. I get all the feel of a British classic roadster, in a package that doesn't leak, and has mid-90's performance and a few mod-cons.

I don't track mine so outright speed isn't a big draw- if I was into trackdays I'd prefer something with a tighter chassis and a screamer of an engine- i.e. another Honda Type R.

For me my Chim is a car to enjoy on country roads and long distance drives - my 4.0 with 855 cam and future Canems system will be absolutely perfect for that. If I can end up with 250 bhp or thereabouts it'll be the icing on the cake.

[Sardonicus]

Hats off to those numbers and does anyone else think the under-bonnet look of these goodies look the b*llocks too? maybe I just like a bit of show too

[CanoeSniffer]

Are all people called Dave total soft touches?

In all seriousness, it's horses for courses. Maybe my Chimaera is a wonderful grand tourer, maybe it's a 60s evocation, maybe it's a brilliant British sports car- maybe. But what it certainly is is MY car. And I love it to pieces for what it is, it's awesome at everything I want it for- except it could do with a bit more grunt. That's as simple as it is really. Whilst I understand the 'if you wanted more power you should have bought something else' logic, if I wanted huge power I'd've bought something Jap and turbo instead. But it wouldn't look, sound, and feel like my car. Do I have to lose all that in order to get a bit more edge-of-the-seat thrill?

I could equally argue that a Chimaera isn't about economy and you've totally ruined the spirit of the car Dave 1, but I wouldn't- I think your LPG burbler is an awesome piece of kit, superbly engineered, and your attention to detail is outstanding. It's still a Chimaera, just a better one- in ways that you more than anyone else appreciate.

And Dave 2, I could also suggest that TVRs were built to be driven hard and it's a waste to have one that's cosmetically perfect and never sees a track, but that would be nonsense. I adore the way your car looks and sounds, and the interior is absolutely to die for. It's the epitome of all that's most beautiful about the Chimaera's design.

Live and let live! Gentle chastising over, now bugger off the power thread if you're going to moan about people wanting power

Edited by CanoeSniffer on Tuesday 5th June 11:46

[Squirrelofwoe]

CanoeSniffer said:

And Dave 2, I could also suggest that TVRs were built to be driven hard and it's a waste to have one that's cosmetically perfect and never sees a track, but that would be nonsense. I adore the way your car looks and sounds, and the interior is absolutely to die for. It's the epitome of all that's most beautiful about the Chimaera's design.

Live and let live! Gentle chastising over, now bugger off the power thread if you're going to moan about people wanting power

Edited by CanoeSniffer on Tuesday 5th June 11:46

You know full well I am only trying to justify why I didn't buy a bigger-engined Chim in the first place but have now spent too much time/effort/money sorting mine to my own taste to warrant changing cars and starting all over again...

That said, my engine is now in rude health and with the fresh 855 cam it currently feels faster than it ever has











So cylinder heads are where the gainzzz are at then??

[ChimpOnGas]

CanoeSniffer said:

I could equally argue that a Chimaera isn't about economy and you've totally ruined the spirit of the car Dave 1, but I wouldn't- I think your LPG burbler is an awesome piece of kit, superbly engineered, and your attention to detail is outstanding. It's still a Chimaera, just a better one- in ways that you more than anyone else appreciate.

Ha ha, all very good

But in my defense my LPG Chimaera has actually proved itself to make more power than the car would have ever made when delivered new in late 1996, and when it was only burning expensive petrol, also as it turns out LPG has offered the ability to deliver better than new drivability too.

So if I can have all that, yet without even knowing I'm driving on gas I can swap a 23mpg average for 45-50mpg at a flick of a switch... why wouldn't I

Forget the monumental game changing leap forward in fuel economy for a minute, better performance and drivability is hardly ruining the spirit of the car. Unless that is the spirit of the car is actually worse performance and drivability while the owner throws fivers our of the window, if that's the spirit of TVR you can keep it mate

TBH the LPG thing is just one element in a list of improvements I've adopted as part of my objective to refine and improve the car, by merely respectfully enhancing it's core qualities and trying to eliminate it's failings like the car's prodigious fuel thirst, all I'm really doing here is polishing a 'Flawed Diamond'.

By carefully leaving all the good stuff well alone like the pleasing aesthetics, V8 sound track and back to basics analogue driving experience.... but then improving the elements we all know could have been better ..... my theory is simple... ie I should end up with a more rounded and polished TVR that already started as an improved classic in the first place.

And a TVR that genuinely does.... Retain The Spirit of The Car'

Anyway,,,, back to PoweRRRRR!

Because you can never spoil a classic by adding too much power.. or can you

[drlloyd]

SILICONEKID 345HP 12.03 said:

When will these heads be forsale and any idea of the costs ?

Rev limit can easily be set on the ecu.

Edited by SILICONEKID 345HP 12.03 on Sunday 3rd June 22:40

We have a new set of Wildcat heads with roller rockers, rocker covers, pushrods, etc in stock now but some of the other components (intake, exhaust, etc) are not yet in finished stock.

Currently at the stage of costing up the full conversion so cannot confirm yet but safe to say that, although it will not be cheap, it will still be less than half the cost of an LS conversion.

Edited by drlloyd on Tuesday 5th June 18:20