I now have Electric Power Steering

I now have Electric Power Steering

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Discussion

pb450

Original Poster:

1,048 posts

99 months

Monday 16th March 2015
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Hi Phil,

To be honest, we didn't discuss it. The guys at Lloyd's know I live over 100 miles from them and they tested the conversion thoroughly before handing the car back. If problems occur I'm pretty confident they will handle things professionally in a reasonable time frame. That's 12 months in my book.

Good luck with the conversion. You won't be disappointed. Happy to answer any questions you may have; forum or PM.

PJP500

8 posts

102 months

Monday 16th March 2015
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Hi Peter

Thanks, really helpful, will try to get it done before Easter. Finally my first post!!!

phazed

17,345 posts

143 months

Monday 16th March 2015
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PJP500 said:
Hi Peter

Thanks, really helpful, will try to get it done before Easter. Finally my first post!!!
Come on, it says 2 posts.

Epic lurking!

pb450

Original Poster:

1,048 posts

99 months

Monday 16th March 2015
quotequote all
That's because he's changed his PH name! thumbup First post under PJP500. smile

PJP500

8 posts

102 months

Monday 16th March 2015
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rolleyesLurkio
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SMB

1,403 posts

205 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
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Hi, I'm interested in this aswell, but I had a couple of questions, you may be able to answer one or either.

Does it change the feel of the car when on the move at all, I found that some cars seem to be too light and floaty.

Also given the turning force is now coming from the column ( esp when turning at low speed) whats the impact on the fibreglass mounting points? In a non-PAS car you just try to turn when the car is rolling a bit, in this what about the forces on the mountings vs the tvr PAS rack that has its mounting on the chassis?


thanks

PJP500

8 posts

102 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
quotequote all
Hi
I'm booked in with Lloyds during May. I had similar concerns regarding the modifications to handle the force. I understand there is a significant strengthening of the pedal box column mounting.

pb450

Original Poster:

1,048 posts

99 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
quotequote all
SMB said:
Hi, I'm interested in this aswell, but I had a couple of questions, you may be able to answer one or either.

Does it change the feel of the car when on the move at all, I found that some cars seem to be too light and floaty.

Also given the turning force is now coming from the column ( esp when turning at low speed) whats the impact on the fibreglass mounting points? In a non-PAS car you just try to turn when the car is rolling a bit, in this what about the forces on the mountings vs the tvr PAS rack that has its mounting on the chassis?


thanks
I can answer both questions. smile

On the move the power assistance progressively reduces from maximum at parking speeds to nothing above 30mph. The power assistance can deffinitely still be felt up to that speed but not in a bad way. (I'm still able to compare to the previous non-PAS situation as I've only had the car for a short time since the conversion. One day I will have no recoletion of the way it was - and that's not an age thing!) Above 30mph there is no difference to the feel of the steeing at all - which is what it says on the tin. There's no light and floaty feel at 'progressive' speeds.

Regarding the turning force and the reaction point on which this force is exerted. The original upper mounting point for the column is on the pedal box. This was removed from the car and strengthened. The additional strengthening (very nicely executed too) also forms the mounting point for the new electric power assistance unit. So there is absolutely no action or reaction outside the pedal box. Hence there are no twisting loads on the fibreglass mounting of the pedal box. It's all self-contained. There's plenty of diagonal bracing too if you look at the pics. Neat! (If you can't find the pics send me a PM or a further request later when I can upload images from home.)

Phil, delighted to hear you're booked in with Lloyd's now. I should have insisted on comission rites! thumbup

SMB

1,403 posts

205 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
quotequote all
pb450 said:
I can answer both questions. smile

On the move the power assistance progressively reduces from maximum at parking speeds to nothing above 30mph. The power assistance can deffinitely still be felt up to that speed but not in a bad way. (I'm still able to compare to the previous non-PAS situation as I've only had the car for a short time since the conversion. One day I will have no recoletion of the way it was - and that's not an age thing!) Above 30mph there is no difference to the feel of the steeing at all - which is what it says on the tin. There's no light and floaty feel at 'progressive' speeds.

Regarding the turning force and the reaction point on which this force is exerted. The original upper mounting point for the column is on the pedal box. This was removed from the car and strengthened. The additional strengthening (very nicely executed too) also forms the mounting point for the new electric power assistance unit. So there is absolutely no action or reaction outside the pedal box. Hence there are no twisting loads on the fibreglass mounting of the pedal box. It's all self-contained. There's plenty of diagonal bracing too if you look at the pics. Neat! (If you can't find the pics send me a PM or a further request later when I can upload images from home.)

Phil, delighted to hear you're booked in with Lloyd's now. I should have insisted on comission rites! thumbup
thanks for the responses, if possible some pics would be great of the mountings. As unless I'm missing something although the pedal box is strengthed, ultimately it mounts to the fibreglass, or have they fabircated something to mount to the chassis.

carsy

3,011 posts

104 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
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SMB said:
thanks for the responses, if possible some pics would be great of the mountings. As unless I'm missing something although the pedal box is strengthed, ultimately it mounts to the fibreglass, or have they fabircated something to mount to the chassis.
Yes indeed. This has been discussed before and whether it is an issue mounting to the fibreglass i`m not sure. Several have gone this way tho.

Not an issue if you go with the Scooby rack which is also a heck of a lot less money.

SMB

1,403 posts

205 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
quotequote all
carsy said:
Yes indeed. This has been discussed before and whether it is an issue mounting to the fibreglass i`m not sure. Several have gone this way tho.

Not an issue if you go with the Scooby rack which is also a heck of a lot less money.
I've had a scan of the searches for the subaru option, looks interesting, is there a list anywhere of the parts required?

Hedgehopper

1,361 posts

183 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
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http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

This is the latest of several write-ups on Subaru racks. Very informative and helpful.

Quinny

15,791 posts

205 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
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SILICONEKID345HP said:
Can it be pumped and is it purchased from the fuel stataion ?
It comes in tanks from Russia, and you have tip it in a bucket, then pour it into the car.....

J400GED

1,200 posts

176 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
quotequote all
Quinny said:
It comes in tanks from Russia, and you have tip it in a bucket, then pour it into the car.....
rofl

pb450

Original Poster:

1,048 posts

99 months

Tuesday 17th March 2015
quotequote all
SMB said:
thanks for the responses, if possible some pics would be great of the mountings. As unless I'm missing something although the pedal box is strengthed, ultimately it mounts to the fibreglass, or have they fabircated something to mount to the chassis.
Right, so the unit is mounted to the strengthened pedal box only. There is no connection to the chassis.





The only additional load on the fibreglass body is the self weight of the unit itself, which is negligible. All forces and reactions derived from the actuation of the power assistance unit are contained within the pedal box itself. There are no 'external' forces and hence no issues with mounting in this way. The unit is not about to tear itself from the car.

I started this thread by saying it wasn't cheap but it offers the best of all worlds in my opinion. The serious DIY'er can do the Scooby rack conversion but you have to source all the right bits first (and I haven't seen a definitive list) but it's still a hydraulic system with constant power assistance and the potential for leaks etc. Again, all IMHO. smile

ChimpOnGas

8,467 posts

118 months

Friday 20th March 2015
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pb450 said:
Right, so the unit is mounted to the strengthened pedal box only. There is no connection to the chassis.





The only additional load on the fibreglass body is the self weight of the unit itself, which is negligible. All forces and reactions derived from the actuation of the power assistance unit are contained within the pedal box itself. There are no 'external' forces and hence no issues with mounting in this way. The unit is not about to tear itself from the car.

I started this thread by saying it wasn't cheap but it offers the best of all worlds in my opinion. The serious DIY'er can do the Scooby rack conversion but you have to source all the right bits first (and I haven't seen a definitive list) but it's still a hydraulic system with constant power assistance and the potential for leaks etc. Again, all IMHO. smile
A brilliantly eloquent summary on what appears to be an excellent "best of all worlds" steering enhancement.

Great to see a nicely written intelligent post when authors on these pages so often reveal a severe lack of erudition.

I have TVR factory power steering which (after I fixed the "U" pipe leak) is excellent, if I had a manual rack car electric power steering would be top of my list.

thumbup

pb450

Original Poster:

1,048 posts

99 months

Friday 20th March 2015
quotequote all
Thanks Dave. thumbup It helps to have a structural engineering background. smile

ChimpOnGas

8,467 posts

118 months

Friday 20th March 2015
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pb450 said:
Thanks Dave. thumbup It helps to have a structural engineering background. smile
Indeed wink

stevesprint

957 posts

118 months

Saturday 21st March 2015
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SMB said:
Hi, I'm interested in this aswell, but I had a couple of questions, you may be able to answer one or either.

Does it change the feel of the car when on the move at all, I found that some cars seem to be too light and floaty.

Also given the turning force is now coming from the column ( esp when turning at low speed) whats the impact on the fibreglass mounting points? In a non-PAS car you just try to turn when the car is rolling a bit, in this what about the forces on the mountings vs the tvr PAS rack that has its mounting on the chassis? thanks
I’ve got a Corsa B electric motor that’s been hanging from my pedal box for the last three years without any structural issues. If you are interested the details of my installation have a look at
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

The biggest issue is finding the right ECU as the Corsa ECU makes the steering too light and floaty even on its heaviest setting. I therefore ended up buying a fully programmable ECU with a road speed sensor from DC Electronics as they supply E-PAS to the British Touring Championship cars.

In the beginning I programmed the ECU so the steering was light as a feather for parking and then gradually reverted to manual as the road speed builds up to 30 mph. This actually meant the steering got progressively heavier as the speed increased and to be honest felt very unusual so I've now reduced the parking assistance and raised the full manual setting to 40mph.

caduceus said:
Peter. Any feedback on the new power assistance yet?
One thing I'd personally like to know is how much assistance is there if you inadvertently powerslide it on a :cough: damp roundabout and need quick corrections?
I could program the full manual setting for a higher speed so there's some assistance to help catch a power slide on a damp roundabout. It’s all down to having a fully programmable ECU, like the 14CUX is now.

Once I was finally happy with the level of assistance I then chopped and welded my top front suspension arms to allow more caster angle adjustment to increase the straight line stability which worked a treat.

You certainly can tell my steering is manual above 40 mph because the harder and faster you turn in the heavier the steering gets especially with R888 plus in a straight line at the legal limit it's not light and floaty.

With the right ECU Electric PAS is definitely the best of both !!!

SILICONEKID345HP

14,662 posts

170 months

Saturday 21st March 2015
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Could a different size pully be used on the TVR power steering setup ? just to reduce assistance