Adblue Jaguar DEF issues

[DOK2]

Hi,

I had a message come on the dash that incorrect DEF (Adblue) was detected and the engine would not start in so many miles which happened. Had the car collected and taken to Jaguar as it is still under warrenty (only 14000 mile on the clock).

I was informed by Jaguar main dealer it had incorrect Adblue in the tank, they drained the tank and refilled. This was done without my approval as I was not informed the tank would need to be drained.

I had to pay for this and I was told it was not covered by the warranty. Please note that no other liquid was put into the car, only the correct specification Adblue.

Having contacted Halfords where I bought the Adblue I received their response below-

A recent issue has come to light which affects all Jaguar, Land Rover and Range Rover vehicles after being refilled with Halfords AdBlue. A warning message appears on the dashboard claiming 'Incorrect diesel exhaust fluid detected'. The handbook recommends visiting their local Jaguar or Land Rover dealership to be drained and replaced.

Our AdBlue complies with all ISO 22241 regulations including ISO 22241-1, which specifies what AdBlue is made of and the quality of the ingredients and ISO 22241-2, which specifies how the product is tested. We can categorically say that our AdBlue is perfectly safe to use in all JLR cars, and there is no need to drain the tank or any other remedial work.


The Jaguar handbook does not state that the Adblue must be purchased for Jaguar only or at all other than the specification which I followed.

The cost to me was £186 which I feel excess to say the least for what would be a quick repair if needed in the first place.

Has this happened to anyone on here as I think there is a bigger issue going on? I would be grateful if you could advise if you had this issue also.

I believe its a faulty NOX sensor and not the Adblue.

Thanks

[anonymous-user]

Halfords admit their AdBlue is causing faults to be thrown on all JLR vehicles in their reply, which I find extremely odd as a quick google shows lots of references to people using Halfords AdBlue in Jaguars with no issue.

It's not down to Halfords to determine whether the tank needs to be drained or not, so likewise I'm surprised to see them flatly denying that it was needed. I would expect any customer service person to be a lot more circumspect about issues of liability and what should/shouldn't be done with a car that they have no direct relationship with.

I'd show the email to Jaguar and see what they say.

[acricha3]

I'm presuming this is the JLR Ingenium diesel? I have a Discovery Sport with the 2.0d Ingenium and have had nothing but issues around the DEF system and various warning lights. Its actually quite a known issue in the Discovery Sport community, there is even a technical bulletin on it. https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f...

I have had the "Incorrect DEF Fluid Quality detected" a few times and it was always put down to faulty software and a reset by JLR Assist/Dealer made it go away, until the next time. I used a variety of DEF fluid over this time, from dealer supplied through to petrol station/Halford's and was never told it was a problem with the fluid itself.

Worth saying that my problem never really went away until I eventually had a "Dosing Malfunction" alert which was ultimately traced to a broken wire on the DEF injector that had to be repaired by the breakdown man at the side of the M6 Toll! Turns out this was the root cause of my issues, other people have had success with just a software update/reset.

For background the ECU measures the quality of the fluid by measuring the effect DEF injection has on emissions, i.e, it looks for a drop in temperature/change in gas makeup once it initiates an injection cycle. If there is an issue with injection, say not enough being injected or bad fluid quality, this shows up as the "Incorrect Quality" message as the ECU makes the assumption the fluid is not working. With mine it was that that the wire to the injector was slowly breaking apart and was causing the injector to work intermittently, it was only when the wire finally broke (took about 6 months/8k miles) that the ECU realised the injector was the problem and flagged the correct message to me.

Knowing this and how sensitive the system is, I would be very sceptical that this really was a poor batch of DEF fluid. I would question how the dealer knows it is the wrong specification of fluid given they would need to send a sample off to the laboratory to show it didn't meet specs. The car message alone is not actually proof of bad quality fluid, simply proof that the system is not working properly. It may be bad fluid but could equally be a problem with the software measurement or the injector itself. Do they have a report they can send to you proving the Halfords fluid does not meet spec?

I would also check for any technical bulletins regarding this and ask if they performed a computer reset/update (as per the Land Rover bulletin) first to discount a software issue before going ahead and changing the fluid?

[PistonBroker]

acricha3 said:

I have a Discovery Sport with the 2.0d Ingenium and have had nothing but issues around the DEF system and various warning lights. Its actually quite a known issue in the Discovery Sport community, there is even a technical bulletin on it. https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f...

Ah, great. I saw this on my usual trawl of the forum using the 'what's new?' link.

Touch wood, 3,000-odd miles in and no warning lights on my Disco Sport yet, other than having to fill it with Adblue already. I'm guessing they don't fill it at the PDI but we shall see. I just picked some up when I was at the petrol station one day. Same stuff I used to put in the Tiguan we had before.

Fingers crossed!

[Jag_NE]

Same error message here a month or so back. Jag assist came out to my house and did a software reset which has seemed to make the issue go away. In my case I’m convinced it was the sensor as opposed to the def quality as it was refilled thousands of miles earlier (pump at service station). If the def was crap I would have expected the sensor to flag it earlier. My quality of my car is absolute horse turd across the board, mechanical and trim, incompetent dealers. Nice drive however.

[Sheepshanks]

DOK2 said:

Has this happened to anyone on here as I think there is a bigger issue going on?

Try pinging WhatCar's helpdesk, or whatever it's called these days. I'd expect they'd at least be able to get your money back, and maybe they'll be able to get to the bottom of the story.

[TooMany2cvs]

DOK2 said:

The cost to me was £186 which I feel excess to say the least for what would be a quick repair if needed in the first place.

Sounds about right for an hour's labour plus some fluid.

[Jag_NE]

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

[Wildcat45]

I (now wrongly) assumed all JLR Ingenium diesels came with a 5 year service pack.

Both mine have. This includes AdBlue top ups. Despite doing tiny miles I'm looking at at least one top up a year. Quick trip to the dealer, coffee cake and tyre kick a few Range Rovers I can't afford and the car is ready, out front washed and hoovered.

I (again maybe wrongly) assumed it was a little ploy to get you into the showroom with nothing better to do in the hope you order a new car or buy la HUE branded coffee mug or dog bowl or wax jacket.

Either way, if you do have the 5 year service pack it may be worth getting them to do your top up. At least that way if it goes wrong they can't use the wrong AdBlue line.

Edited by Wildcat45 on Monday 30th July 22:17

[Simpo Two]

Wildcat45 said:

I (again maybe wrongly) assumed it was a little ploy to get you into the showroom with nothing better to do in the hope you order a new car or buy la HUE branded coffee mug or dog bowl or was jacket.

The last time I took my car to a Jaguar dealer they were more interested in serving coffee than in servicing my car.

In hindsight you could have taken your car to an indy and got the tank drained for 1/3 of the price... but either way your dealer should have got your consent to do the work before starting. That said, by then you had little choice but pay up

[DOK2]

Jag_NE said:

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

Hi

Jag XF R Sport, 14000 miles and has been topped up 3 times so far.

[DOK2]

Jag_NE said:

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

Jag XF R Sport, 14000 miles and have had to fill the Adblue tank 3 times already. Its drinking the stuff and I think it was a faulty sensor or software issue but they charged me to replace the fluid. I dot believe it was a Adblue issue as I have used the same type since I bought the car with no issues.

[DOK2]

Jag_NE said:

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

Jag XF R Sport, 14,000 miles and has been topped up 3 times so far.

[DOK2]

Sheepshanks said:

Try pinging WhatCar's helpdesk, or whatever it's called these days. I'd expect they'd at least be able to get your money back, and maybe they'll be able to get to the bottom of the story.

Thanks

[Ructions]

DOK2 said:

Jag_NE said:

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

Hi

Jag XF R Sport, 14000 miles and has been topped up 3 times so far.

I have only needed one top up, also at 14000 miles, you may have another issue.

[DOK2]

charltjr said:

Halfords admit their AdBlue is causing faults to be thrown on all JLR vehicles in their reply, which I find extremely odd as a quick google shows lots of references to people using Halfords AdBlue in Jaguars with no issue.

It's not down to Halfords to determine whether the tank needs to be drained or not, so likewise I'm surprised to see them flatly denying that it was needed. I would expect any customer service person to be a lot more circumspect about issues of liability and what should/shouldn't be done with a car that they have no direct relationship with.

I'd show the email to Jaguar and see what they say.

Hi,

Halfords state they are aware of the issue with JLR and states that their Adblue is perfectly fine to be used in the JLR cars and recommended I take it up with JLR which I have done. Its either a JAG issue or Halfords so trying to get to the bottom of it out of principle.
Either don't by a JAG or don't buy Halfords Adblue-who knows!!

[DOK2]

Simpo Two said:

The last time I took my car to a Jaguar dealer they were more interested in serving coffee than in servicing my car.

In hindsight you could have taken your car to an indy and got the tank drained for 1/3 of the price... but either way your dealer should have got your consent to do the work before starting. That said, by then you had little choice but pay up

Yep, feeling scammed!!

[Jag_NE]

DOK2 said:

Jag_NE said:

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

Jag XF R Sport, 14000 miles and have had to fill the Adblue tank 3 times already. Its drinking the stuff and I think it was a faulty sensor or software issue but they charged me to replace the fluid. I dot believe it was a Adblue issue as I have used the same type since I bought the car with no issues.

There has to be something amiss here. Either mine isn’t using enough and the emissions are naughty or yours is over consuming. Same car / same engine should have broadly similar def consumption, allowing for some difference in mpg due to driving style (lower mpg = more def) but its relatively linear, you can’t be out by a factor of 3 or 4 in the case of my car and yours.

[Sheepshanks]

Jag_NE said:

Out of interest, which model is it and at what mileage did you need to top up? Mine went all the way to its 20k first service without requiring a top up and I drove it very hard (c.39mpg) so my adblue consumption will have been on the higher side.

I'd say yours is using nothing like enough. Jag say typical 500 miles per litre, but more depending on use. I wouldn't have said 39MPG equates to "very hard" use though.

Do you do a lot of very short journeys? I'm sure I read somewhere that AdBlue systems don't work when the engine is cold.

[MrC986]

Ructions said:

I have only needed one top up, also at 14000 miles, you may have another issue.

My wife has an Ingenium engined Disco Sport and she's been told 3-4K miles of normal driving between Adblue fill ups by her company's service guys though the inter web is saying circa 5-6k miles. The Jag website seems more optimistic on distances....