DSG gearboxes - which types (if any) are reliable long term?
Discussion
Apologies if this has been done to death already (I've searched for recent info on this but can't find anything definitive).
I'm in need of a capacious family car for bussing around my family and for my 90 mile (round trip, mostly motorway) commute. I'm looking at Skodas (Superb or Octavia) around 4 or 5 years old. I tend to keep my cars for a long time (until they have 200k+ miles). A lot of the cars out there have the DSG gearbox, especially the better spec'd ones, but my internet research tells me some types of DSG 'box can be a liability in the long run.
Thing is, I can't find any recent information on these, just a lot of forum posts from years ago with conflicting information. I know there are 6 and 7 speed variants, with wet or dry clutches, and that they need an oil and filter change every 40k. How easy is this to do for a competent DIY mechanic?
Which types of DSG are reliable (are any?), which ones should I avoid, and how do I tell which type a car has?
Or should I avoid all DSGs completely and stick with manual?
I've always driven manuals in the past and generally prefer them, but the majority of well spec'd Skodas for sale near me have a DSG, and there's often a lot of traffic on my commute so an auto might be nice to have.
I'm in need of a capacious family car for bussing around my family and for my 90 mile (round trip, mostly motorway) commute. I'm looking at Skodas (Superb or Octavia) around 4 or 5 years old. I tend to keep my cars for a long time (until they have 200k+ miles). A lot of the cars out there have the DSG gearbox, especially the better spec'd ones, but my internet research tells me some types of DSG 'box can be a liability in the long run.
Thing is, I can't find any recent information on these, just a lot of forum posts from years ago with conflicting information. I know there are 6 and 7 speed variants, with wet or dry clutches, and that they need an oil and filter change every 40k. How easy is this to do for a competent DIY mechanic?
Which types of DSG are reliable (are any?), which ones should I avoid, and how do I tell which type a car has?
Or should I avoid all DSGs completely and stick with manual?
I've always driven manuals in the past and generally prefer them, but the majority of well spec'd Skodas for sale near me have a DSG, and there's often a lot of traffic on my commute so an auto might be nice to have.
I'd avoid any DSG from before 2007. My parents have an 08 2.0TDI 140 DSG Octavia they bought at 3 years old with 80,000 miles on it and it now has 145,000. Never had a DSG oil change since they've owned it and the box is fine. Obviously like any mass manufactured product they can go wrong, but my 9 years of experience working for VW Group hasn't put me off them.
It was the early 7 speed dry unit in lower powered cars, 2005ish - 2010, that generated the most noise about reliability. Gearbox model no 0AM.
The 02E DQ250 (6 speed wet) and DQ500 (7 speed dry) are both very robust and reliable units - if looked after, which is the standard caveat for all cars.
As to which car got which gearbox in which year, I'm afraid you'll have to research it. VAG are constantly chopping and changing things.
Look for the 3 digit gearbox code on the options sticker (iirc), such as 02E, 0AM or if it's a manual, 02Q, 0A6 etc. If not on the sticker, it will be stamped into the gearbox casing near the drain/filler plugs.
From that model no. you can do some internet digging but as with everything on the internet, one person gets a problem and it's an epidemic.
The 02E DQ250 (6 speed wet) and DQ500 (7 speed dry) are both very robust and reliable units - if looked after, which is the standard caveat for all cars.
As to which car got which gearbox in which year, I'm afraid you'll have to research it. VAG are constantly chopping and changing things.
Look for the 3 digit gearbox code on the options sticker (iirc), such as 02E, 0AM or if it's a manual, 02Q, 0A6 etc. If not on the sticker, it will be stamped into the gearbox casing near the drain/filler plugs.
From that model no. you can do some internet digging but as with everything on the internet, one person gets a problem and it's an epidemic.
As above. The bad reputation for DSG’s is aimed squarely at one gearbox. The dry clutch, 7 speeder. It is a ‘sealed for life’ box and requires no maintenance. It can be a bit notchy between gears and can also snatch the power on take up.
This is only fitted to low torque cars and the issues have been resolved now by VAG fitting a different oil in the box.
The 6 and 7 speed wet clutch gearboxes are more reliable, stronger and smoother to change gear. They require an oil change every 40k Miles (80k for the newest DQ381 gearbox). Do get it serviced as per specifications.
Best of luck.
This is only fitted to low torque cars and the issues have been resolved now by VAG fitting a different oil in the box.
The 6 and 7 speed wet clutch gearboxes are more reliable, stronger and smoother to change gear. They require an oil change every 40k Miles (80k for the newest DQ381 gearbox). Do get it serviced as per specifications.
Best of luck.
Bear in mind the MK5 Golf platform is now 15 years old, and there are still plenty of DSG variants roaming around daily. Don't let a few reports of one bad egg sway your decision.
For me, DSG reliability isn't the showstopper, livability is. I prefer slush boxes for a smoother commuting experience, but the current trend for too many ratios gives the gearbox ECU too many scenarios to deal with, meaning the inevitable gear hunting, shunting in slow traffic and pauses when asking for full power. 6 speed is the sweet spot.
For me, DSG reliability isn't the showstopper, livability is. I prefer slush boxes for a smoother commuting experience, but the current trend for too many ratios gives the gearbox ECU too many scenarios to deal with, meaning the inevitable gear hunting, shunting in slow traffic and pauses when asking for full power. 6 speed is the sweet spot.
missing the VR6 said:
I'd avoid any DSG from before 2007. My parents have an 08 2.0TDI 140 DSG Octavia they bought at 3 years old with 80,000 miles on it and it now has 145,000. Never had a DSG oil change since they've owned it and the box is fine. Obviously like any mass manufactured product they can go wrong, but my 9 years of experience working for VW Group hasn't put me off them.
Jesus. Changes are supposed to be every 40k!Hi
I've got a 2016 A3 Saloon quattro Tdi with a 6 speed DSG. The quattro didn't come with a manual box.
I bought the car new and now covered 57k miles in it. Whilst I love a manual, the fact I cover 100 miles a day just to get to work and back, I would not willingly go back to a manual as a daily driver. When doing lots of miles its just better easier to live with in my opinion.
In terms of reliability, no issues with the DSG box and to be honest, other than a faulty MAF at 5k (no notincible difference to the running - just a EM light) the car has not had one single issue at all. Really impressed!
I coudn't believe it initially (the Audi dealer never mentioned it) but I actually have a Diesel car that also has launch control, and it works very effectively!!!!
In addition, my son has a 2012 8P RS3 with the 7 speed DSG, the car having covered 70k now has also had no issues.
I'm a convert!
I've got a 2016 A3 Saloon quattro Tdi with a 6 speed DSG. The quattro didn't come with a manual box.
I bought the car new and now covered 57k miles in it. Whilst I love a manual, the fact I cover 100 miles a day just to get to work and back, I would not willingly go back to a manual as a daily driver. When doing lots of miles its just better easier to live with in my opinion.
In terms of reliability, no issues with the DSG box and to be honest, other than a faulty MAF at 5k (no notincible difference to the running - just a EM light) the car has not had one single issue at all. Really impressed!
I coudn't believe it initially (the Audi dealer never mentioned it) but I actually have a Diesel car that also has launch control, and it works very effectively!!!!
In addition, my son has a 2012 8P RS3 with the 7 speed DSG, the car having covered 70k now has also had no issues.
I'm a convert!
A900ss said:
As above. The bad reputation for DSG’s is aimed squarely at one gearbox. The dry clutch, 7 speeder. It is a ‘sealed for life’ box and requires no maintenance. It can be a bit notchy between gears and can also snatch the power on take up.
This is only fitted to low torque cars and the issues have been resolved now by VAG fitting a different oil in the box.
The 6 and 7 speed wet clutch gearboxes are more reliable, stronger and smoother to change gear. They require an oil change every 40k Miles (80k for the newest DQ381 gearbox). Do get it serviced as per specifications.
Best of luck.
The initial 6-speed wet clutch DSG box was plagued with reliability (possibly manufacturing as problem boxes tended to be problematic from very early on) issues when it was introduced and it took a good few years to get to the point where people were confidant.This is only fitted to low torque cars and the issues have been resolved now by VAG fitting a different oil in the box.
The 6 and 7 speed wet clutch gearboxes are more reliable, stronger and smoother to change gear. They require an oil change every 40k Miles (80k for the newest DQ381 gearbox). Do get it serviced as per specifications.
Best of luck.
In the States, VAG were forced to offer an extended warranty on that box.
The 6-speed seems to be the most solid box but can also have issues so there is an element of luck to it! Probably best to stick to something on the MQB chassis (i.e. current shape Golf/ Passat etc) if your budget allows. And make sure the 40k oil changes are done
Manuals aren't perfect either as the Clutches can be problematic and with the sort of mileage you're doing won't last forever.
Manuals aren't perfect either as the Clutches can be problematic and with the sort of mileage you're doing won't last forever.
Yep, because it's a single oil chamber gearbox, meaning contamination from the dirty bits affects sensitive bits (mechatronic valves). This was obviously a big problem when people didn't change the oil on time. If I owned a DSG, I would do the oil every 20K, not 40.
Later DSGs were redesigned with separate oil chambers to prevent cross contamination. As above, the MQB platform car is probably the safest DSG bet......if you can live with the drivability quirks.
Agreed, the manuals are bloody awful with aftermarket clutches (needed for remaps).
Later DSGs were redesigned with separate oil chambers to prevent cross contamination. As above, the MQB platform car is probably the safest DSG bet......if you can live with the drivability quirks.
Agreed, the manuals are bloody awful with aftermarket clutches (needed for remaps).
Apart from a few problems with the dry clutch version fitted to some small cars like the polo etc I would say Dsg gearbox problems ceased to be an issue on almost any new model within the last decade
but because of some failures on earlier versions which were still basically being developed, the Internet will tell you they must all be bad,
and the fact that there are several different gearboxes available (6 speed wet clutch, 7 speed dry clutch for low torque applications, 7 speed wet clutch for high torque applications ) which have constantly been changed to improve reliability and probably share very few of the components fitted to the original versions means nothing.
You only have to consider how many cars are out there running around with a Dsg box now across a number of manufacturers to realise they aren't the ticking time bomb some people would have you believe.
I had dsg in a 2006 Golf diesel and all the scare mongering and occasional clunks made me nervous. Moved it on to the then father in law at about 80k iirc.
It then lived with them and over to my now ex wife. I did an mot check on it and it’s now well over 200k assume on the same gearbox as it wouldn’t cost in to replace it.
So I’d suggest all is well with them. Every time it clunked I was convinced it was about to throw a 3k bill.
It then lived with them and over to my now ex wife. I did an mot check on it and it’s now well over 200k assume on the same gearbox as it wouldn’t cost in to replace it.
So I’d suggest all is well with them. Every time it clunked I was convinced it was about to throw a 3k bill.
xjay1337 said:
Jesus. Changes are supposed to be every 40k!
Tell me about it, it had it's first cambelt change last year because I virtually held a gun to dads head to get it done! Dad's argument "the money I'll save on not having it done I'll put towards replacing the car if it breaks!" va1o said:
Manuals aren't perfect either as the Clutches can be problematic and with the sort of mileage you're doing won't last forever.
I tend to find (after using manual VAG TDIs for the last 10 years / 300k miles) that I get a least 150k miles from a clutch (my 175k mile remapped Golf hasn't needed one yet) and then they're £400ish all in to replace, which isn't too bad if it's only once every five years or so.rottenegg said:
Agreed, the manuals are bloody awful with aftermarket clutches (needed for remaps).
An aftermarket clutch wasn't required for my remapped Golf (138bhp remapped to circa 185bhp) and as above, the factory clutch is still going strong. Possibly helped by my sympathetic driving style - but I do give it the beans when the occasion calls for it.I'll certainly strongly consider remapping anything I get. Good to know the DSG boxes will take it.
xjay1337 said:
rottenegg said:
Agreed, the manuals are bloody awful with aftermarket clutches (needed for remaps).
Disagree - drove 70k with 2 different Helix 6 paddle kits - no issues. It's a well known issue in TFSI circles.
Maccles said:
An aftermarket clutch wasn't required for my remapped Golf (138bhp remapped to circa 185bhp) and as above, the factory clutch is still going strong. Possibly helped by my sympathetic driving style - but I do give it the beans when the occasion calls for it.
I'll certainly strongly consider remapping anything I get. Good to know the DSG boxes will take it.
It's just the 2.0 petrol turbos that need it. DSG can easily cope with the torque levels.I'll certainly strongly consider remapping anything I get. Good to know the DSG boxes will take it.
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