Griff Help obscure dash vent parts
Discussion
RichB said:
While people are on here giving out pearls of wisdom on Griffith 500 heaters, can I ask, what is the most recent thinking on improving/repairing/correcting the control of the hot water flow valve? - Anyone know the details?
Searching Griffith topics for several weeks as I have been, looking for any information relevant to work I'm engaged with on my Griff I came across these pages that might be of help to you too Rich.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
http://www.bertram-hill.co.uk/Pages/grifheater.asp...
The AJP Griff said:
The right hand side vent in the main dash beside the radio should connect to the flexi pipe which enters from over the steering column(this is only on cars with the optional 'booster blower' not usually found on later cars) and the other two vents(passenger and left hand dash) should come from the left hand heater box outlet after being 'split'.
I have searched back to the start of 2010 thus far in the Griffith topics. In my efforts to bookmark all relevant topics I appear to have missed one. I did read a topic which showed pictures of a Griff with dash facia removed and clearly to be seen were a pair of glass fibre connector sections that push over the rear of the two centre vents. Both vents were into a T piece which connected to the flexi hose from over the steering column.
My 1993 build 500 has the tube from over the column. The tube appears to go through the bulkhead area right up in the top corner as forward as one can get. If I pull on the tube it feels attached to something inside the inner wing. I need to investigate further I'm afraid, so am still at a loss as to where this tube actually goes and where it gets its fresh air feed. Right now I suspect it receives fresh air from the nose past the inner wing and over the wheel arch.
The AJP Griff said:
The vent in the left hand side of the drivers footwell should be connected to the pipe which runs behind the engine in the engine bay and comes from the other outlet of the heater box.
I believe this to be correct for my Griff thanks.The AJP Griff said:
Also found in the drivers footwell on cars equipped with the 'booster blower' is another vent on the left hand side of the footwell.
I assume you mean right hand side of the footwell? Mine does not appear to have an additional blower in the drivers side wing.Please do keep more information coming if you have it.
500dread said:
My 1993 build 500 has the tube from over the column. The tube appears to go through the bulkhead area right up in the top corner as forward as one can get. If I pull on the tube it feels attached to something inside the inner wing. I need to investigate further I'm afraid, so am still at a loss as to where this tube actually goes and where it gets its fresh air feed. Right now I suspect it receives fresh air from the nose past the inner wing and over the wheel arch.
This hose on mine is connected to the optional booster blower which lives inside the drivers wing and this is where it sources its fresh air supply from.You sould find the 3 speed control knob for this under the dash somwhere near your right knee if you have one?500dread said:
I assume you mean right hand side of the footwell? Mine does not appear to have an additional blower in the drivers side wing.
If you have the afore mentioned 3 speed switch you should have the blower.The right hand vent on mine is much harder to see than the left hand one,get your head on there and take a closer look.Hi AJP. Definetly no 3 speed switch. No blower in the inner wing to the right side of the footwell that I have found and no hole for a tube to go to.
I have the entire dash out of the car. I have removed the heater box too. I have located where the blower is in the passenger side inner wing left of the footwell. There is also a motor operated flap under the blower area.
Because I have an incomplete ducting system I cannot establish how the system should duct in my Griff.
There exists an ambiguity due to what information is present on PH and other websites. Most of what little information there is all point to the left dash vent connected with a T piece to the left centre dash vent. But then I have seen pictures of both centre dash vents T'd from the tube over the steering column (I'm searching again to find this particular topic due to my laptop HD failing on Saturday morning).
Then there's Virgil pictures which show the left centre dash vent fed by a tube which goes somewhere to the left side of the heater box but I can't see where and it doesn't appear to be T'd to the left dash vent, looking more like Virgil's Griff has two tubes feeding both these vents individually. As Virgil hasn't responded to my latest questions I am a little clueless as to what is meant to be.
I suppose what I'm trying to establish is I don't want just the left dash vent to work on its own. It either works with the left centre vent or all three vents together. For me to work this out I need to know where the tube from above the steering column gets it's feed and if the feed is controled by a motor operated from the heater control unit. If it isn't this would suggest the right side vent just gets cold air and is not controlled by anything other than closing the vent on the dash. If this is the case it would not be practical to have both centre vents T'd to such a supply as only the left passenger vent would be under the control of the heater control unit and therefore receive both hot and cold air. In an ideal world I would enjoy to have all three dash vents under control to allow for both hot and cold air. That's the target!
I have the entire dash out of the car. I have removed the heater box too. I have located where the blower is in the passenger side inner wing left of the footwell. There is also a motor operated flap under the blower area.
Because I have an incomplete ducting system I cannot establish how the system should duct in my Griff.
There exists an ambiguity due to what information is present on PH and other websites. Most of what little information there is all point to the left dash vent connected with a T piece to the left centre dash vent. But then I have seen pictures of both centre dash vents T'd from the tube over the steering column (I'm searching again to find this particular topic due to my laptop HD failing on Saturday morning).
Then there's Virgil pictures which show the left centre dash vent fed by a tube which goes somewhere to the left side of the heater box but I can't see where and it doesn't appear to be T'd to the left dash vent, looking more like Virgil's Griff has two tubes feeding both these vents individually. As Virgil hasn't responded to my latest questions I am a little clueless as to what is meant to be.
I suppose what I'm trying to establish is I don't want just the left dash vent to work on its own. It either works with the left centre vent or all three vents together. For me to work this out I need to know where the tube from above the steering column gets it's feed and if the feed is controled by a motor operated from the heater control unit. If it isn't this would suggest the right side vent just gets cold air and is not controlled by anything other than closing the vent on the dash. If this is the case it would not be practical to have both centre vents T'd to such a supply as only the left passenger vent would be under the control of the heater control unit and therefore receive both hot and cold air. In an ideal world I would enjoy to have all three dash vents under control to allow for both hot and cold air. That's the target!
RichB said:
While people are on here giving out pearls of wisdom on Griffith 500 heaters, can I ask, what is the most recent thinking on improving/repairing/correcting the control of the hot water flow valve? Back in 1999 when new, mine was one of those Griffs that provided either warm or hot air so I dug around under the dash and tightened a grub screw on the valve and that seemed to improve it for a few years but it's reverted giving hot or hotter for several years now. And I would really like to have a heater which I can turn off, which surely should not be beyond the wit of man. I seem to remember reading somewhere that it's VW heater valve which needs bits cutting off with a junior hacksaw. Anyone know the details?
p.s. I know I can simply block it off in the engine bay but that's not what I want to do. Thanks Rich...
HCV's need indexing correctly on the shaft and fail and just pass water leading to hot/bloody hot behaviour. Might as well buy a new one, they're only £14. As long as it seals and indexes closed there's no need for any more valves in the system p.s. I know I can simply block it off in the engine bay but that's not what I want to do. Thanks Rich...
500dread said:
There exists an ambiguity due to what information is present on PH and other websites. Most of what little information there is all point to the left dash vent connected with a T piece to the left centre dash vent. But then I have seen pictures of both centre dash vents T'd from the tube over the steering column (I'm searching again to find this particular topic due to my laptop HD failing on Saturday morning).
Ah found it. It appears Lord Grover's Griff has the two centre vents T'd from the tube over the column.It might be necessary to enlarge the picture for a closer view.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
500dread said:
Thank you again.
Sorry - just got back on after a hectic Weekend!Think I was mistaken on a couple of points!!
So:
Right hand dash vent flexi pipe does indeed route over the steering column and into the right wing. I belive this now feeds off the right wing cool air motor along with the right hand drivers footwell vent.
The big fat pipe running from the right side of the heater box, through the engine bay seems to feed the drivers 'left knee vent'...does seem over kill, but seems the only place it can go to now. Have a picture down the vent and it seems to go straight and the only place it can go....
The ali box on the piece of pipe I'd left on the centre console is the far left passenger vent feed. The ali box slips over the back of the actual plastic vent...the other end of the 40mm flexi pipe fits the white left had exit (labeled 'Jason' on mine) on the heater box.
The left-centre dash vent is fed from the longer flexi tube that goes behind the glove box, dissapears under the dash and goes into the left wing. I have a picture I can put up later to show this, but definately does not split from the heater box feed. Not sure how it gets fed on mine...maybe only cold air from the wing?? Can't remember if it gave hot or just cold air...sorry.
if that's the case, mine would sum up as:
left passenger vent, passenger knee vent, drivers knee vent: hot/cold from heater box.
driver's right fotowell vent, centre right dash vent: ambient temp air from right 'wing'/motor.
left centre vent from left 'wing': question mark as to source/type of air supplied.
will be taking my heater box out at some point but probably a few weeks away as I have enough bits off the car already!
Sorry I can't help more but will post pics tonight...
virgil said:
Sorry - just got back on after a hectic Weekend!
Appreciate your efforts Virgil.virgil said:
So:
Right hand dash vent flexi pipe does indeed route over the steering column and into the right wing. I belive this now feeds off the right wing cool air motor along with the right hand drivers footwell vent.
All I can say for now is the hose on my Griff from over the column goes right up into the top corner and likely through into the wing cavity behind the wheel arch.Right hand dash vent flexi pipe does indeed route over the steering column and into the right wing. I belive this now feeds off the right wing cool air motor along with the right hand drivers footwell vent.
I don't appear to have a motor for any air in the right side footwell area. I don't have a right side floor level vent on the backsidse of the inner wing - and no switch to control such.
virgil said:
The ali box on the piece of pipe I'd left on the centre console is the far left passenger vent feed. The ali box slips over the back of the actual plastic vent...the other end of the 40mm flexi pipe fits the white left had exit (labeled 'Jason' on mine) on the heater box.
That's great information. At least I can work the left side vent out.virgil said:
The left-centre dash vent is fed from the longer flexi tube that goes behind the glove box, dissapears under the dash and goes into the left wing.
This is where it goes pear shaped for me. There is simply nowhere for a flexi tube to go to. This is what makes me think the two centre vents on the dash on my Griff should both feed off the tube from the column. Problem I have is I've no idea if this is just a fresh air supply from the nose of the car and over the wheelarch. I don't see how it can have any heated air pass through it as there is no control flap so I imagine fresh air these are. virgil said:
I have a picture I can put up later to show this, but definately does not split from the heater box feed. Not sure how it gets fed on mine...maybe only cold air from the wing?? Can't remember if it gave hot or just cold air...sorry.
Would be interesting to knowvirgil said:
Sorry I can't help more but will post pics tonight...
Your help has been invaluable. Many thanks. I conclude with my Griff that it is likely as different as different can be from others!Pics as promised...
Taken under the drivers dash showing the right flexi pipe going to riht wing...
I think we've established you've not got this one, but my left centre flexipipe going to left wing tucked right up under dash
Driver's side 'left knee' vent taken lookig down the vent. Must be the big fat flexi pie running through the engine bay behind the engine...
Not sure if that helps much more.
I guess if your aim is to get all the dash vents working together you could tee them off the left outlet of the heater box...that way you get temperature controlled air rather than some ambient air, as seems to be the case now...
Taken under the drivers dash showing the right flexi pipe going to riht wing...
I think we've established you've not got this one, but my left centre flexipipe going to left wing tucked right up under dash
Driver's side 'left knee' vent taken lookig down the vent. Must be the big fat flexi pie running through the engine bay behind the engine...
Not sure if that helps much more.
I guess if your aim is to get all the dash vents working together you could tee them off the left outlet of the heater box...that way you get temperature controlled air rather than some ambient air, as seems to be the case now...
Brilliant Virgil!
Yes my Griff is exactly the same location. It can only be supplied through the wing and over the wheel arch but I'm going to make certain.
My Griff is nothing like that. On my Griff there is an opening at the top of the inner wing wall where the end of the heater box locates so as the fan which is situated in the wing behind the inner wing wall can blow up into the heater box.
Another thing I have on the passenger side and facing directly down from under the dash is an eyeball vent. This too has no tube and I'm wondering where this vent also received its supply of air from.
I think what I will do is supply the two centre dash vents from the column tube as would seem to be how it left Blackpool. Just fresh air presumably, and controlled only by opening or closing the vents themselves.
The left side dash vent and the left side downward eyeball vent must have been T'd near the glovebox somewhere with their supply taken from the left side of the heater box. I'm assuming before I test the layout that these two vents will blow in unison with the drivers side knee vent which I do hope work from the heater control this way.
This will mean when the system is venting to the floor it will only be doing so on the passenger side from the left side floor vent under the fan housing in the inner wing wall. Drivers side will receive no floor venting it would appear.
Now to work out if it all fits as I have it worked out in my head - which hopefully it should.
Thank you again Virgil. With your help I believe I've got it worked out finally. If it changes I will post up what I find.
virgil said:
virgil said:
Another thing I have on the passenger side and facing directly down from under the dash is an eyeball vent. This too has no tube and I'm wondering where this vent also received its supply of air from.
I think what I will do is supply the two centre dash vents from the column tube as would seem to be how it left Blackpool. Just fresh air presumably, and controlled only by opening or closing the vents themselves.
The left side dash vent and the left side downward eyeball vent must have been T'd near the glovebox somewhere with their supply taken from the left side of the heater box. I'm assuming before I test the layout that these two vents will blow in unison with the drivers side knee vent which I do hope work from the heater control this way.
This will mean when the system is venting to the floor it will only be doing so on the passenger side from the left side floor vent under the fan housing in the inner wing wall. Drivers side will receive no floor venting it would appear.
Now to work out if it all fits as I have it worked out in my head - which hopefully it should.
Thank you again Virgil. With your help I believe I've got it worked out finally. If it changes I will post up what I find.
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