Citroen door mirror woe's
Discussion
Payment sent Brian and I've emailed you with my address.
We only live 30 miles apart so please feel free to save the postage and drop them off in Rickmansworth if you're over this way soon?
A couple of questions if I may.
1. Does the mirror sit higher than the original position?
Just curious, but if the mirrors sit higher it could actually offer a rear visibility advantage as the standard position is quite low.
2. Did you have any luck finding a 5 way Plug/Socket?
Last time I fixed my mirrors I went with bullet connectors but I'd like to make a neater job of it this time.
Many thanks for creating such an excellent kit, Dave
We only live 30 miles apart so please feel free to save the postage and drop them off in Rickmansworth if you're over this way soon?
A couple of questions if I may.
1. Does the mirror sit higher than the original position?
Just curious, but if the mirrors sit higher it could actually offer a rear visibility advantage as the standard position is quite low.
2. Did you have any luck finding a 5 way Plug/Socket?
Last time I fixed my mirrors I went with bullet connectors but I'd like to make a neater job of it this time.
Many thanks for creating such an excellent kit, Dave
ChimpOnGas said:
Payment sent Brian and I've emailed you with my address.
We only live 30 miles apart so please feel free to save the postage and drop them off in Rickmansworth if you're over this way soon?
A couple of questions if I may.
1. Does the mirror sit higher than the original position?
Just curious, but if the mirrors sit higher it could actually offer a rear visibility advantage as the standard position is quite low.
2. Did you have any luck finding a 5 way Plug/Socket?
Last time I fixed my mirrors I went with bullet connectors but I'd like to make a neater job of it this time.
Many thanks for creating such an excellent kit, Dave
Re the height, here is a before and after shot.We only live 30 miles apart so please feel free to save the postage and drop them off in Rickmansworth if you're over this way soon?
A couple of questions if I may.
1. Does the mirror sit higher than the original position?
Just curious, but if the mirrors sit higher it could actually offer a rear visibility advantage as the standard position is quite low.
2. Did you have any luck finding a 5 way Plug/Socket?
Last time I fixed my mirrors I went with bullet connectors but I'd like to make a neater job of it this time.
Many thanks for creating such an excellent kit, Dave
The plug/socket I have bought myself cost £34 for both doors, they are well overspec'd but I think will work well.
To be honest, I've been more concerned with completing these orders than finding cheaper plugs but now the initial rush is over I will look into them again. So watch this space......
Oldred_V8S said:
Brian
Many, many thanks. The kit arrived today, and what a great piece of workmanship! You are a true artisan!
It seems a shame to hide these under the plastic covers.
I said it before and I will say it again, pure engineering porn!
Mine arrived as well today - totally agree with the above.Many, many thanks. The kit arrived today, and what a great piece of workmanship! You are a true artisan!
It seems a shame to hide these under the plastic covers.
I said it before and I will say it again, pure engineering porn!
I take it the method of removing the mirrors is brute force and ignorance? Also, just want to check they both unscrew conventionally i.e. neither of them is right-hand threaded?
On the subject of the door mirrors, can I ask why they were recessed in the first place? Were they recessed on the donor car?
The doors of my rebuild have had the brass mount and surrounded GRP removed leaving just a circular hole because the OE mirrors were broken and the PO was going to fit some other mirrors.
I have the original mirrors but have not examined them yet. If they are repairable and I can find or get some mounts, my thought would be to glass them in flush or just below the outer door surface. This would mean the mirrors would protrude further out but maybe the grub screw would be accessible.
What you think?
BTW, Tidy product Brian
lancepar said:
On the subject of the door mirrors, can I ask why they were recessed in the first place? Were they recessed on the donor car?
The doors of my rebuild have had the brass mount and surrounded GRP removed leaving just a circular hole because the OE mirrors were broken and the PO was going to fit some other mirrors.
I have the original mirrors but have not examined them yet. If they are repairable and I can find or get some mounts, my thought would be to glass them in flush or just below the outer door surface. This would mean the mirrors would protrude further out but maybe the grub screw would be accessible.
What you think?
BTW, Tidy product Brian
. I am sure none of the many companies that have fitted them have been stupid enough to mount them in a recess so that access to the fastening grub screw is nigh on impossible to adjust. Brian should be nominated for man of the year for this little venture.
Oldred_V8S said:
The mirrors have been on all sorts of cars; the title of this subject says "Citroen" but I prefer to think of them as Aston Martin or Jaguar XJ220, both marques having used them too . I am sure none of the many companies that have fitted them have been stupid enough to mount them in a recess so that access to the fastening grub screw is nigh on impossible to adjust.
Brian should be nominated for man of the year for this little venture.
Thanks for all the comment guys. You may find this little snippet of interest.. I am sure none of the many companies that have fitted them have been stupid enough to mount them in a recess so that access to the fastening grub screw is nigh on impossible to adjust. Brian should be nominated for man of the year for this little venture.
http://definitelymotoring.blogspot.co.uk/2015/02/l...
And don't forget that Marcos used them too.
lancepar said:
On the subject of the door mirrors, can I ask why they were recessed in the first place? Were they recessed on the donor car?
The doors of my rebuild have had the brass mount and surrounded GRP removed leaving just a circular hole because the OE mirrors were broken and the PO was going to fit some other mirrors.
I have the original mirrors but have not examined them yet. If they are repairable and I can find or get some mounts, my thought would be to glass them in flush or just below the outer door surface. This would mean the mirrors would protrude further out but maybe the grub screw would be accessible.
What you think?
BTW, Tidy product Brian
With any luck the PO cut them out as one and all the bits are still attached to the mirror.
I found this "how too" description on a Marcos site very helpful......
http://marcossportscarenthusiasts.yuku.com/topic/5...
The Marcos is the total opposite to our cars as they put the mirror on a stalk!!!
simonwedge said:
Mine arrived as well today - totally agree with the above.
I take it the method of removing the mirrors is brute force and ignorance? Also, just want to check they both unscrew conventionally i.e. neither of them is right-hand threaded?
Simon, yes it takes a firm grip and steady pressure to unscrew the mirror and mount as one. Maybe apply some easing-penetrating oil a day or two before you try to undo them.I take it the method of removing the mirrors is brute force and ignorance? Also, just want to check they both unscrew conventionally i.e. neither of them is right-hand threaded?
I'll correct you with regard the thread.
They ARE right hand threaded not left, so as you stand looking down at the mirror you will need to turn them anti-clockwise.
That's for both sides.
Hope this all helps.
Brian.G
With regard to mirror positioning and how TVR did it with the grub screw being recessed, if you look closely at your original collar you'll see the boys at TVR marked it with a permanent marker.
If people are still using their original collar:
1. With the mirror off the car line up and tighten the grub screw on the mark put there by TVR when the car was made and it'll be in the perfect position
2. To stop the grub screw slipping on the collar lightly drillit in the right spot to create a recessed dimple that the rounded head of my grub screw locates so locking the assembly tight and in the right place.
3. The mirror can then be screwed back into the door and once tight, it'll both be in the perfect position and locked firmly to the collar, so no more spinning mirrors.
Obviously with Brian's excellent raised collar none of this is necessary, by making the collar higher the grub screw can now be tightened with the mirror already screwed into the door.
While I have fixed my internally broken mirrors and learned the process of correct adjustment I have still purchased Brian's excellent raised collar kit simply because it's infinitely better by design and made from far superior material. On the original the whole inner skeleton/componentry that makes up the mirror frame and closing system is fabricated from injection moldable monkey metal, this material is excellent for fast low cost production, it's ideal for high definition castings produced on a mass scale but has the structural strength of chocolate.
Brian's kit solves the grub screw accessibility frustration but and having learned the trick to setting the mirrors in the door it's more a 'nice to have' feature than it's biggest advantage, the key benefits of Brian's kit is a key monkey metal mirror component has been replaced with a proper machined chunk of infinitely stronger aluminum.
Unfortunately we are still left with the rest of the very weak monkey metal components that make up the mirror's internals, these are known to fail especially the tapered post that completely snaps off. With replacement components being difficult to find or prohibitively expensive I resorted to fabricating aluminum plates which I pop riveted in place, what my photos don't show is I also passed a countersunk alen bolt up the centre of the tapered post to further clamp it to the frame.
Bolting the tapered post to the frame makes the mirror a 1000 times stronger when it was new.
I strongly recommend this modification to anyone removing their mirrors to fit Brian's excellent collar kit, even if your tapered post is still connected to the frame base you are well advised to drill out the blind hole and pass a countersunk alen bolt through the centre, clamping it tightly with a nut effectively gives the very weak and fracture prone tapered post a super strong steel core.
Here are some photos of my repair, sadly I didn't take any pictures of the steel bolt I passed through the middle of the super weak and failure prone tapered post but hopefully you get the idea?
With the grub screw accessibility issue resolved and the collar now available in much stringer aluminum I wonder if Brian might consider using his machining skills to address the other areas of weakness with these failure prone mirrors?
Drilling the blind hole out in the monkey metal tapered post so you can pass and clamp a steel bolt up it's centre works extremely well and I recommend everyone does this when they next have their mirrors off the car, but a proper machined aluminum tapered post with base plate to replace the monkey metal original would be even better and perhaps could be offered by Brian as an additional part to his excellent collar kit?
This part....
I hope the above photos and my rather long winded description of my repairs will help others when they face the inevitable fixes these super weak monkey metal framed mirrors demand?
Finally, much respect to Brian for creating this excellent collar kit
Dave.
If people are still using their original collar:
1. With the mirror off the car line up and tighten the grub screw on the mark put there by TVR when the car was made and it'll be in the perfect position
2. To stop the grub screw slipping on the collar lightly drillit in the right spot to create a recessed dimple that the rounded head of my grub screw locates so locking the assembly tight and in the right place.
3. The mirror can then be screwed back into the door and once tight, it'll both be in the perfect position and locked firmly to the collar, so no more spinning mirrors.
Obviously with Brian's excellent raised collar none of this is necessary, by making the collar higher the grub screw can now be tightened with the mirror already screwed into the door.
While I have fixed my internally broken mirrors and learned the process of correct adjustment I have still purchased Brian's excellent raised collar kit simply because it's infinitely better by design and made from far superior material. On the original the whole inner skeleton/componentry that makes up the mirror frame and closing system is fabricated from injection moldable monkey metal, this material is excellent for fast low cost production, it's ideal for high definition castings produced on a mass scale but has the structural strength of chocolate.
Brian's kit solves the grub screw accessibility frustration but and having learned the trick to setting the mirrors in the door it's more a 'nice to have' feature than it's biggest advantage, the key benefits of Brian's kit is a key monkey metal mirror component has been replaced with a proper machined chunk of infinitely stronger aluminum.
Unfortunately we are still left with the rest of the very weak monkey metal components that make up the mirror's internals, these are known to fail especially the tapered post that completely snaps off. With replacement components being difficult to find or prohibitively expensive I resorted to fabricating aluminum plates which I pop riveted in place, what my photos don't show is I also passed a countersunk alen bolt up the centre of the tapered post to further clamp it to the frame.
Bolting the tapered post to the frame makes the mirror a 1000 times stronger when it was new.
I strongly recommend this modification to anyone removing their mirrors to fit Brian's excellent collar kit, even if your tapered post is still connected to the frame base you are well advised to drill out the blind hole and pass a countersunk alen bolt through the centre, clamping it tightly with a nut effectively gives the very weak and fracture prone tapered post a super strong steel core.
Here are some photos of my repair, sadly I didn't take any pictures of the steel bolt I passed through the middle of the super weak and failure prone tapered post but hopefully you get the idea?
With the grub screw accessibility issue resolved and the collar now available in much stringer aluminum I wonder if Brian might consider using his machining skills to address the other areas of weakness with these failure prone mirrors?
Drilling the blind hole out in the monkey metal tapered post so you can pass and clamp a steel bolt up it's centre works extremely well and I recommend everyone does this when they next have their mirrors off the car, but a proper machined aluminum tapered post with base plate to replace the monkey metal original would be even better and perhaps could be offered by Brian as an additional part to his excellent collar kit?
This part....
I hope the above photos and my rather long winded description of my repairs will help others when they face the inevitable fixes these super weak monkey metal framed mirrors demand?
Finally, much respect to Brian for creating this excellent collar kit
Dave.
Edited by ChimpOnGas on Tuesday 21st March 08:07
Brian.
Your kits arrived today, and what lovely pieces of work.
Brian also does a stainless steel rear wishbone adjuster. Again a quality kit and worth every penny If, like me you are doing a wishbone and bush refurb and want to prevent the usual seized adjusters further down the line.
Many thanks Tim
Your kits arrived today, and what lovely pieces of work.
Brian also does a stainless steel rear wishbone adjuster. Again a quality kit and worth every penny If, like me you are doing a wishbone and bush refurb and want to prevent the usual seized adjusters further down the line.
Many thanks Tim
Hi Brian, received my mounting kit yesterday, thank you. Lovely workmanship as all have said. My mirrors are fine just now but I feel this is good insurance.
My late father-in-law was a very exacting tool maker and I'm sure he would have been impressed with this.
Thank you again for your industry and overall camaraderie towards fellow TVR owners.
Peter
My late father-in-law was a very exacting tool maker and I'm sure he would have been impressed with this.
Thank you again for your industry and overall camaraderie towards fellow TVR owners.
Peter
Hi Brian
Received mine today.
Top quality !
When will you be re-engineering the rest of The Griff to bring it all up to the same standard.
Only downside ...... I thought that it was a 'fitted and working deal'
It is guys like you that just keep on making the Griff experience even better.
Received mine today.
Top quality !
When will you be re-engineering the rest of The Griff to bring it all up to the same standard.
Only downside ...... I thought that it was a 'fitted and working deal'
It is guys like you that just keep on making the Griff experience even better.
Gassing Station | Griffith | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff