RE: PH Buying Guide: TVR Griffith

[RichB]

3024E said:

No-one has mentioned 'The ultimate' 4.5BV Griff, rev'd and went like a b/stard...
I dont see the point of going higher in cc if it wont rev freely, and be strangled by a catalyst..
The early 5.0 did suffer from crank failure.. Or am i being a bias pre cat owner, with a genuine SEAC 4.5BV to be fitted soon ??????? HAPPY DAYS !!!

I guess 'bias' may be the opperative word there. Being later the 500s benefited from more development and removing the pre-cats is simple, they had big valves as standard so IMO you get best of both worlds

p.s. During 17 years of being involved in TVR circles I've never heard of crankshaft failures, worn cam lobes yes but dodgy cranks, never.

[G4HKS]

vjj said:

TVR were optimistic on nearly everything to do with powertrains - not least recommending 0/40 oil for a 40-year-old design!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have had 6 Griff 500's only one of which made over 300bhp - a 97 car which had belonged to a factory mechanic and had the cam timing set up properly on a John Eales 5.2 block with bigger injectors.Also had the precats out and a stainless bespoke system(car now lives with a pilot in Chichester)- this made 318 on Austec's rolling road.
All the others made between 275 and 290 at the flywheel, as did the 2 chimaera 500's I had.

I have it on good authority that the most powerful engines to leave TVR power were the dozen or so 4.5-litre BV specials which that went into special-order road cars (made a genuine 300bhp and were similar spec to those used in the race Tuscans before the AJP came along).

Hope this helps

Blimey, your madder than me - I had 5 Griff 500's and I thought that was a lot !

[900T-R]

RichB said:

I
p.s. During 17 years of being involved in TVR circles I've never heard of crankshaft failures, worn cam lobes yes but dodgy cranks, never.

If I only count the # of crankshaft failures on 500s reported on here, we're almost talking a percentage of engines built rather than a promillage.

Chris71 on here was one of the latest victims IIRC.

At least one of the best known RV8 builders has told me he will decline to rebuild a TVR 5 litre; I can bring one in but he'll replace the complete bottom end with one built to his spec. The other well known RV8 guru has emitted similarish noises (to a lesser extent, though) about the 500.

I've yet to hear about a single crankshaft failure on non-500 TVR RV8s... In fact, catastrophic TVR Power RV8 engine failure is pretty much unheard of on anything but 500s, full stop.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying avoid 500s at all cost - it's nothing like the early Speed 6 saga - but I'd say it's well documented that the 5 litre short engine is a little less robust than the other versions (especially the 450 - if I was to hedge my bets on a TVR that option would get my vote any time).

Edited by 900T-R on Tuesday 13th March 06:49

[BliarOut]

That's a load of old bks, I've yet to hear of a single crank failure on a standard car. Sorry to be frank but when you've had a Boxster you get kinda fed up with rumours of chocolate engines...

[Bluebottle]

BliarOut said:

That's a load of old bks, I've yet to hear of a single crank failure on a standard car.

Not entirely bks...but mostly bks;)...the very early 500's used the older style Rover crank case which had smaller crank journals, and it is these that were a bit fragile.

[900T-R]

Er... not just the very early ones had 2.300" mains... the first application of the later style ('big journal') 4.0/4.6 block with the 2.500" mains was the 450 somewhere early 1997, and they kept on building 4 litres and 500s on the old 3.9 block for a long time after that...

Chris71s is a 1998 Chim 500 IIRC.

[Chilliman]

When I had my (500) engine rebuilt/built (new block - last year) I saw the original 500 crank next to the later crank that was going in the new lump. Have to say the original crank looked decidedly weedy compared to the new one. It was a porosity problem that initiated the new lump though not a problem with the crank. As I was looking for more power it didn't make sense to have the original block top hat linered and the original crank put back.... Must say I'm pleased I took that route and muchly impressed with the power delivery from the new engine..

[Biggles101]

Getting back to the handling issues. My Griff is totally std, on it's original Billies and Bridgestone SO2's yet even at 150mph it feels solid, doesn't weave or jiggle about. (privat road obviously!) However my wife's 450 Chim feels "Scarey" at anything over 80mph. The steering is very light, feels like it wants to turn in at every opportunity and tramlines on anything resembling a painted line! Yet the Chim has had a full geo setup and is running Gaz Gold Pro's???
I firmly believe there is a fine line between a rock steady setup that is safe and a "agreed book" setup that may be an excepted starting point for most cars. It's then down to the individual to "fettle". Those that can!, get good driveable cars, those without the ability or resources get an average car that isn't right but is just accepted.

Perhaps we need a thread on HOW TO ADJUST YOUR RIDE

[LordGrover]

My old Griff was scary above 110/120 mph, especially if windy. Felt pretty steady up to that point but the steering would go VERY light and I was never quite sure who or what was in control.
(protechs and toyo t1-r 'properly' set up by both wildcats & neil garner).

[EGB]

King Fisher said:

All this arguing about power misses the point - these cars are about acceleration and it's the torque curve that gives you that, not just the maximum power. And the Rover V8 (in any size) has enough torque to make the Earth spin the other way over a large range of revs - the torque curve is fairly flat from 2000rpm up to 5000+, so the car pulls like stink and keeps on doing it.

Put a Griff (or Chim) in 3rd at 50 and boot it, then watch almost everything on the road recede backwards like they're in reverse until you hit 100 and have to change up (mine's a 4.5 Chim, but the Griffs are similar)

And Chimaeras are not even a teensy, weensy bit gay, darlings.

See Griff against Tuscan in U tube sprint. Griff beats it easy up to 100mph. I think it was SAGRIFF with 285bhp. Massive 5 litre torque against smaller high rev Tuscan engine
Le Mans triumph TR7 Rover V8 3.6 litre with twin Janspeed turbos feeding twin 2in SUs. Bhp in excess of 500bhp. did 201mph on Mulsanne strait. This was in 1981.

Edited by EGB on Tuesday 13th March 19:16

[Chinnster21]

Does anyone know much about history of this car?

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/t...

It seems like reasonably good value but has been sticking for a while. Anyone have any ideas why this might be?

[GlynMo]

If it's as nice as they make out, I'd suggest that the colour is the sticking point. Personally, I like it, but many appear not to so buyers who like it let the potential sale difficulty, when/if the time comes, influence them against buying.

[Chinnster21]

Well we both have exceedingly good taste then! I think the colour is great. Worth closer inspection maybe.

[GlynMo]

Quite a journey for you but if the car blows your skirt up, it might be worth it. If I was in the market for a 500, I'd go to see it (with an expert) - in fact, I almost regret having bought the 500 I have earlier this year!

[GlynMo]

YHM.

[Chinnster21]

Thanks for the heads up Glyn! Does look a beaut. What are the details of the 500 you decided on?

[MPoxon]

BliarOut said:

That's a load of old bks, I've yet to hear of a single crank failure on a standard car. Sorry to be frank but when you've had a Boxster you get kinda fed up with rumours of chocolate engines...

Just read back through this thread and read this comment and thinking back to the 2 Griffs with crank failure recently. Still a rare occurrence but certainly not unheard of.

[5.0ltr]

Chinnster21 said:

Anyone have any ideas why this might be?

The price?

[macdeb]

5.0ltr said:

Chinnster21 said:

Anyone have any ideas why this might be?

The price?

I'm with Bob.

Edited by macdeb on Wednesday 23 October 09:26

[GlynMo]

Compared to some in the classifieds, I don't think it's a bad price given (i) it's in as good condition as it appears to be and (b) the seller won't actually expect to make his asking price. The days of cheap well-maintained, low mileage Griffs are over I feel, although it'll be interesting to see how new cars from phoenix TVR affect prices. Could go either way.