Has the Internet caused the recession?
Discussion
RYH64E said:
The new model is obviously much more efficient, the problem is that nobody (hardly anyone, anyway) actually pays for the electronic version of the news...
Nobody pays in terms of a similar transaction to buying a physical paper but there are plenty of other ways in which people can "pay" for access to content - e.g. providing profile data. Currently the vast majority of the publishing industry is too scared of losing print revenues to do anything brave like going electronic only and developing a proper business model for doing so.
miniman said:
Nobody pays in terms of a similar transaction to buying a physical paper but there are plenty of other ways in which people can "pay" for access to content - e.g. providing profile data.
Currently the vast majority of the publishing industry is too scared of losing print revenues to do anything brave like going electronic only and developing a proper business model for doing so.
Music, newspapers, books, all have similar problems - getting people to pay for content. there's only so much that you do with advertising revenue. PH itself is an example, I've spent countless hours on here over the years, and got a awful lot of enjoyment from the site, but how much money have they actually made from me? Not much I'd guess.Currently the vast majority of the publishing industry is too scared of losing print revenues to do anything brave like going electronic only and developing a proper business model for doing so.
POORCARDEALER said:
ringram said:
Welcome to the world of perfect competition.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_competition
All positive IMO. Goodbye middlemen, you added nothing anyway.
So you are saying goodbye to yourself as a middleman?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_competition
All positive IMO. Goodbye middlemen, you added nothing anyway.
Hey plenty of people do buy direct, so I have to offer free lifetime support to make a difference.
If I didnt do that then Id be totally useless and add no value correct.
Its up to the vendor to prove the add value. If not tough, suck it up.
Durruti said:
ringram said:
Welcome to the world of perfect competition.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_competition
All positive IMO. Goodbye middlemen, you added nothing anyway.
From the website link in your profile.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_competition
All positive IMO. Goodbye middlemen, you added nothing anyway.
"We are authorised European Distributors for EFILive and Innovate products."
Cool, as you add nothing of value I'll just give Innovate a call and buy direct from them. Thanks for the heads up.
Another middle man bites the dust....
RYH64E said:
DSLiverpool said:
As said above the net has given opportunity, information and power to buyer and seller BUT it's destroyed margin.
If you look at retail there's still margin for internet based sellers who don't have to maintain high street premises with customer facing staff and all the associated costs, lower selling costs maintain or even increase margins.Typically a ups to postman pat tablecloth to iPhone cover to latest gadget retailer works on 5% and can do because they sell huge volumes (babz media anyone) a specialist can't make 5% or even 15% on a much narrower portfolio.
RYH64E said:
miniman said:
Nobody pays in terms of a similar transaction to buying a physical paper but there are plenty of other ways in which people can "pay" for access to content - e.g. providing profile data.
Currently the vast majority of the publishing industry is too scared of losing print revenues to do anything brave like going electronic only and developing a proper business model for doing so.
Music, newspapers, books, all have similar problems - getting people to pay for content. there's only so much that you do with advertising revenue. PH itself is an example, I've spent countless hours on here over the years, and got a awful lot of enjoyment from the site, but how much money have they actually made from me? Not much I'd guess.Currently the vast majority of the publishing industry is too scared of losing print revenues to do anything brave like going electronic only and developing a proper business model for doing so.
Marf said:
Securitisation failed precisely because of it's main selling point.
Don't agree it's failed - there's still a market, just not for the resi stuff that hit the headlines.I'll not knock the thread off course, but my views on what caused all of the issues a few years ago are based on what I saw at the time.
..Excess leverage for a start..
However problems such as gross debt, unfunded pensions, medical liabilities etc all existed before the recession, people just stuck their heads in the sand. Politicians were and still are retarded and finally these things are on the radar.
I agree its not the internet that caused the recession. But it is most definitely transforming business.
Margins are wiped out for most goods. The ability to compare prices and gather information on products from the internet has helped immensely.
You have to be extra efficient or add significant value in order to exist. This is all good. This is all negative for physical shops, especially with business rates and council thrashing parking charges. Pound shops do well as their goods don't lend themselves to distance selling. People are going to have to be a lot more inventive on what they do and sell because just making margin on retail or distribution is going to get even harder as more and more people get online and have access to fast internet with smartphones etc.
Its all positive, but very disruptive in a short amount of time.
However problems such as gross debt, unfunded pensions, medical liabilities etc all existed before the recession, people just stuck their heads in the sand. Politicians were and still are retarded and finally these things are on the radar.
I agree its not the internet that caused the recession. But it is most definitely transforming business.
Margins are wiped out for most goods. The ability to compare prices and gather information on products from the internet has helped immensely.
You have to be extra efficient or add significant value in order to exist. This is all good. This is all negative for physical shops, especially with business rates and council thrashing parking charges. Pound shops do well as their goods don't lend themselves to distance selling. People are going to have to be a lot more inventive on what they do and sell because just making margin on retail or distribution is going to get even harder as more and more people get online and have access to fast internet with smartphones etc.
Its all positive, but very disruptive in a short amount of time.
All true. I based my positive solely on my belief in the free market and the goal of ever increasing efficiency.
So when argued from a point of efficiency I believe its positive.
Tax take is largely irrelevant. Consumers win by wasting less money, which can then be put to other uses. Perhaps more leisure time?
http://www.aeonmagazine.com/living-together/john-q...
Paying tax is not efficient, nor is parking fee's and rates. Taxes are designed to punish behavior or at the very least discourage it. So on that basis they are working well. They are accelerating the move away from city center retail.
Its easier to get an unbiased view by aggregating feedback across a number of sources, than just a single point. Also driving around the place is less efficient than locating a seller and buying online. The bottom line is people get more cash in their pocket for spending elsewhere. Like a nice new Gen5 dodge viper, or a Mp4-12C etc
There are always losers when the economics change. Look at the old steam engine firms, chimney sweeps, typewriter manufacturers, hell even PC makers now. We live in rapidly changing times. Fighting change is a recipe for failure. It's all been seen before aka the Luddites. The solution is to be proactive identify new industries reskill and embrace the future.
The is the exact problem the economy has, ask yourself why governments are fighting over each other to create tech hubs and national broadband availability etc.
So when argued from a point of efficiency I believe its positive.
Tax take is largely irrelevant. Consumers win by wasting less money, which can then be put to other uses. Perhaps more leisure time?
http://www.aeonmagazine.com/living-together/john-q...
Paying tax is not efficient, nor is parking fee's and rates. Taxes are designed to punish behavior or at the very least discourage it. So on that basis they are working well. They are accelerating the move away from city center retail.
Its easier to get an unbiased view by aggregating feedback across a number of sources, than just a single point. Also driving around the place is less efficient than locating a seller and buying online. The bottom line is people get more cash in their pocket for spending elsewhere. Like a nice new Gen5 dodge viper, or a Mp4-12C etc
There are always losers when the economics change. Look at the old steam engine firms, chimney sweeps, typewriter manufacturers, hell even PC makers now. We live in rapidly changing times. Fighting change is a recipe for failure. It's all been seen before aka the Luddites. The solution is to be proactive identify new industries reskill and embrace the future.
The is the exact problem the economy has, ask yourself why governments are fighting over each other to create tech hubs and national broadband availability etc.
Pioneer said:
Is it positive though? How much do you think all those shop workers and business rates contribute to the tax take? I bet it's a massive percentage!! Then you get the likes of Amazon paying bugger all tax in UK.... As you said it's negative for physical shops but I think it's also negative for online shops are margins are so so difficult to make...
Some make good margins, most don't, as if that was different from the more physical businesses... It's more efficient and cheaper this way though and benefiting the consumer (at least in this case).The U.K. is heavily over-taxed, its public sector wasteful and its property over-priced - that's negative and contributing to the prolonged depression (rather than just recession). The internet and other technology based business is a bright spot here.
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