HSBC Business Banking - Serious problem
Discussion
Thanks for the various answers guys.
They have admitted their mistake, written me a completely fob-off letter and have now sent me yet another letter saying that they need to ask more questions about my business and will shut my account if I don't comply ....
Given there is an admission of error and that it cost me two days of time to sort out (or, more accurately, there were two days when I could neither make nor receive payment) then what am I best advised to do to get recompense. As said, I am not a fan of the compensayshun culture but this is a clear case of poor service on their behalf, failure in their duty of care and breach of their own T'sandC's. Should I approach them and ask for a figure of recompense, or take it to the Ombudsman? (Clearly if I try the former and they decline - which I am sure they will - then I will need to go to the next step which would be Small Claims, but we'll deal with that if/when it comes to it.)
Thanks for your suggestions.
They have admitted their mistake, written me a completely fob-off letter and have now sent me yet another letter saying that they need to ask more questions about my business and will shut my account if I don't comply ....
Given there is an admission of error and that it cost me two days of time to sort out (or, more accurately, there were two days when I could neither make nor receive payment) then what am I best advised to do to get recompense. As said, I am not a fan of the compensayshun culture but this is a clear case of poor service on their behalf, failure in their duty of care and breach of their own T'sandC's. Should I approach them and ask for a figure of recompense, or take it to the Ombudsman? (Clearly if I try the former and they decline - which I am sure they will - then I will need to go to the next step which would be Small Claims, but we'll deal with that if/when it comes to it.)
Thanks for your suggestions.
Agreed, just move on - I've opened an account on Tide - it was instant. Only drawback is they haven't implemented IBAN yet but this is coming apparently. It's a mobile app but has a desktop interface too which you enable by scanning a QR code. You also get a credit card. As a small business with a turnover of about £100k this is good enough for me. Feels good to get out of HSBC after years of substandard treatment, except I have to get the rather large balance out of them too...
Edited by stamford55 on Sunday 27th January 14:51
Here's an example of HSBC thinking I encountered several years ago:
The missus had an idea of setting of a catering business and she worked out she needed about £30k. At the time she was working part-time with an income of about £7k/pa. So she wanted to borrow said £30k as a business loan and since she had her personal account with HSBC she arranged to go and see their business advisers about it and I went with her.
The conversation went like this:
HSBC : "How much do you want to borrow ?"
Missus : "£30k"
HSBC : "And what's your income ?"
Missus : "£7k a year"
HSBC : Tappery-tap on their computermamob
HSBC : "I'm sorry but on that income we could not lend you what you are asking for".
Me : "I see, so what you are saying is this; You are using her current income to make your lending decision. If you were to lend her the money, then she would then instantly give up her current job (and hence her current income). So your lending criteria is based on an income which will cease as soon as you were to lend her the money. That is to say, it's based on a criteria that will no longer hold true"
HSBC : 2 businesses advisers mouths opening and closing but no words were coming out of them.
The missus had an idea of setting of a catering business and she worked out she needed about £30k. At the time she was working part-time with an income of about £7k/pa. So she wanted to borrow said £30k as a business loan and since she had her personal account with HSBC she arranged to go and see their business advisers about it and I went with her.
The conversation went like this:
HSBC : "How much do you want to borrow ?"
Missus : "£30k"
HSBC : "And what's your income ?"
Missus : "£7k a year"
HSBC : Tappery-tap on their computermamob
HSBC : "I'm sorry but on that income we could not lend you what you are asking for".
Me : "I see, so what you are saying is this; You are using her current income to make your lending decision. If you were to lend her the money, then she would then instantly give up her current job (and hence her current income). So your lending criteria is based on an income which will cease as soon as you were to lend her the money. That is to say, it's based on a criteria that will no longer hold true"
HSBC : 2 businesses advisers mouths opening and closing but no words were coming out of them.
Just so you know this is not limited to England, I had a similarly Kafka-esque experience with my online bank here in Canada...
I get an online notification that they need to know the purpose of my savings account, so I complete the form using an option from their drop down menu, calling it .....savings (original huh?), this being the savings account I opened with them 14 years ago, as a savings account!
I then start receiving snail mail letters from them telling me thanks for opening an account with them, but we need more information, please fill in this box online......except thats the form I already did fill in (you can already see where this is going to go).....
I then spend time and effort calling them to establish what the issue is, they tell me its all fine and ignore the letter(s) its an IT glitch, which I explain in this day and age is unacceptable, as with identity theft and phishing/email interception they want me to ignore letters asking me about newly opened accounts??? Anyway the letters continue for 3 months, each time I am re assured its an IT glitch and to ignore, at which I reveal I actually work for a bank(not the same one, a rival), and am amazed at the slackness of the way this is being handled.
They then try and fob me off with AML warnings and threaten to close the account if I do not comply, it turns out that although I used their online form to advise it was a savings account, they wanted to know what I was saving for (really, I actually have to have an aim?) The savings label they provided as an option not being sufficient ! They then proceeded to try and tell me the rules surrounding what constitutes a reportable transaction for AML purposes, but completely f*ck that up, and show themselves to have no idea what they are really talking about.
I call again and am finally advised to amend my answer online to label the account as being saving for a boat, which they now accept and cease sending me the letters. I get a call from a 'team lead' who implies its all my fault for not completing the form correctly(even when I inform him that the options were limited to 4 that they picked, so really any/all should have been acceptable. I then reiterate their lack of knowledge concerning AML reporting guidelines only to be told I am wrong (accept its been my job for the last 20 years, so no, I really am not wrong).
Banks worldwide have caught themselves in an infinity loop of stupidity, linked to crap/non existent training for staff all trying to comply with AML rules which they don't even understand, sadly its us as the clients who then have to deal with the resultant sh*tshow and worry.
By the way, when I have issues professionally at work, 50% of the time its usually HSBC that are involved often screwing over their own clients rather than solve the issue or work with my bank to fix something. I do not know why anyone would use them in any capacity such is their level of insouciance.
I get an online notification that they need to know the purpose of my savings account, so I complete the form using an option from their drop down menu, calling it .....savings (original huh?), this being the savings account I opened with them 14 years ago, as a savings account!
I then start receiving snail mail letters from them telling me thanks for opening an account with them, but we need more information, please fill in this box online......except thats the form I already did fill in (you can already see where this is going to go).....
I then spend time and effort calling them to establish what the issue is, they tell me its all fine and ignore the letter(s) its an IT glitch, which I explain in this day and age is unacceptable, as with identity theft and phishing/email interception they want me to ignore letters asking me about newly opened accounts??? Anyway the letters continue for 3 months, each time I am re assured its an IT glitch and to ignore, at which I reveal I actually work for a bank(not the same one, a rival), and am amazed at the slackness of the way this is being handled.
They then try and fob me off with AML warnings and threaten to close the account if I do not comply, it turns out that although I used their online form to advise it was a savings account, they wanted to know what I was saving for (really, I actually have to have an aim?) The savings label they provided as an option not being sufficient ! They then proceeded to try and tell me the rules surrounding what constitutes a reportable transaction for AML purposes, but completely f*ck that up, and show themselves to have no idea what they are really talking about.
I call again and am finally advised to amend my answer online to label the account as being saving for a boat, which they now accept and cease sending me the letters. I get a call from a 'team lead' who implies its all my fault for not completing the form correctly(even when I inform him that the options were limited to 4 that they picked, so really any/all should have been acceptable. I then reiterate their lack of knowledge concerning AML reporting guidelines only to be told I am wrong (accept its been my job for the last 20 years, so no, I really am not wrong).
Banks worldwide have caught themselves in an infinity loop of stupidity, linked to crap/non existent training for staff all trying to comply with AML rules which they don't even understand, sadly its us as the clients who then have to deal with the resultant sh*tshow and worry.
By the way, when I have issues professionally at work, 50% of the time its usually HSBC that are involved often screwing over their own clients rather than solve the issue or work with my bank to fix something. I do not know why anyone would use them in any capacity such is their level of insouciance.
I contacted my HSBC account manager yesterday, just to ask if he was aware of the reportedly sudden account closures, and to ask for some reassurance that our account wasn't somehow going to suffer a similar accidental fate.
His reply is below. I'm somewhat encouraged to hear we would get 12 months notice in order to fulfil any additional requirements.
His reply is below. I'm somewhat encouraged to hear we would get 12 months notice in order to fulfil any additional requirements.
HSBC account manager said:
Thank you for email. I understand your concerns. You are correct that due to a change in regulation we are reviewing all our clients ‘KYC’ to ensure that the information we currently hold is correct and accurate. Due to the number of customers HSBC has this is a staged process which will take place over the coming months and years. This project began in 2016 and is ongoing. As of yet your company has not been identified for KYC refresh. If and when your account does require a KYC refresh we will reach out 12 months prior to the completion date and work with you in completing the project.
EddieSteadyGo said:
I contacted my HSBC account manager yesterday, just to ask if he was aware of the reportedly sudden account closures, and to ask for some reassurance that our account wasn't somehow going to suffer a similar accidental fate.
His reply is below. I'm somewhat encouraged to hear we would get 12 months notice in order to fulfil any additional requirements.
I wouldn’t trust the CEO to be able to tie his own shoelaces, let alone run a bank.His reply is below. I'm somewhat encouraged to hear we would get 12 months notice in order to fulfil any additional requirements.
HSBC account manager said:
Thank you for email. I understand your concerns. You are correct that due to a change in regulation we are reviewing all our clients ‘KYC’ to ensure that the information we currently hold is correct and accurate. Due to the number of customers HSBC has this is a staged process which will take place over the coming months and years. This project began in 2016 and is ongoing. As of yet your company has not been identified for KYC refresh. If and when your account does require a KYC refresh we will reach out 12 months prior to the completion date and work with you in completing the project.
Thank goodness that I saw this as I've been getting reminders and ignoring them. Just logged on now and completed it; end date was mid Feb 19 so nearly ran out of time!
TX.
Edit - pretty intrusive and not very relevant Bank vs Business questions either imho!
TX.
Edit - pretty intrusive and not very relevant Bank vs Business questions either imho!
Edited by Terminator X on Wednesday 30th January 17:18
Terminator X said:
Thank goodness that I saw this as I've been getting reminders and ignoring them. Just logged on now and completed it; end date was mid Feb 19 so nearly ran out of time!
TX.
Edit - pretty intrusive and not very relevant Bank vs Business questions either imho!
Check your account late Feb TX.
Edit - pretty intrusive and not very relevant Bank vs Business questions either imho!
Edited by Terminator X on Wednesday 30th January 17:18
The application for new HSBC bank account for a separate new Company which went live 1st Jan (we started the HSBC application process three months ago) has STILL not been finalised.
So we saw Santander yesterday morning and have been told today that the Business 123 Account is now up and running. Took 24 hours from start to finish for them to process the application.
Vote with your feet people...!!
So we saw Santander yesterday morning and have been told today that the Business 123 Account is now up and running. Took 24 hours from start to finish for them to process the application.
Vote with your feet people...!!
loafer123 said:
I wouldn’t trust the CEO to be able to tie his own shoelaces, let alone run a bank.
I would trust a fairly detailed email to his email address to catch somebodies eye quite quickly and deal with it straight away. I speak from experience. The Safeguard team closed my business account down despite me even having been through the Safeguard process. When I discovered my account had been closed, I spoke with the Safeguard team who informed me a queque was in the post. I phoned numerous times to chase this as it just didn't arrive. HSBC even sent me a letter saying my account closure date was wrong and was actually a month away. After a few phone calls, they said they won't be reopening my account at all. After months of chasing my money and not sleeping at night, I wrote to Stuart J Guliver and within 25 minutes they had transferred every penny in to my personal HSBC account. They phoned 45 mins later, apologised and gave me some compensation of several thousands of pounds.
If only the rest of HSBC's support lines worked as well as the CEO's office. The lady I spoke to was friendly, apologetic and got it sorted quickly. in fact, it wasn't just because I could breathe a sigh of relief that I finally had my money back, she genuinely was brilliant.
I no longer have any accounts with HSBC. Santander offered the least resistence and have been pretty damned good!
StevieBee said:
I've had some dealings with Metro Bank of late and find them very good. Am thinking of transferring our account to them. Opened a personal account within 25 mins and left with a bank card and all online access there and then. I assume a business account might take a little longer.
IMO, Banks have superseded HMRC as the #1 institution that exists to suppress commercial endeavour. I've been subject to much horror with them and regularly hear of worse. I cannot think of any other business or institution that is completely impervious to the effects of appalling customer service, mismanagement and pig-headedness.
are metrobank where's its at now?IMO, Banks have superseded HMRC as the #1 institution that exists to suppress commercial endeavour. I've been subject to much horror with them and regularly hear of worse. I cannot think of any other business or institution that is completely impervious to the effects of appalling customer service, mismanagement and pig-headedness.
Went to pay some cheques in to find rbs closed permantly, and several other nearest, seem to be closing all their branches! Guess I'm moving banks then!!??!!
Mind, I emailed metrobank enquiring when they're opening in enfield and they currently have no plans ... Which is odd as there's a building site where the old santander used to be with "metrobank opening soon" all over the hoardings, guess they're being ripped off then!
Autopilot said:
I would trust a fairly detailed email to his email address to catch somebodies eye quite quickly and deal with it straight away. I speak from experience. The Safeguard team closed my business account down despite me even having been through the Safeguard process.
When I discovered my account had been closed, I spoke with the Safeguard team who informed me a queque was in the post. I phoned numerous times to chase this as it just didn't arrive. HSBC even sent me a letter saying my account closure date was wrong and was actually a month away. After a few phone calls, they said they won't be reopening my account at all. After months of chasing my money and not sleeping at night, I wrote to Stuart J Guliver and within 25 minutes they had transferred every penny in to my personal HSBC account. They phoned 45 mins later, apologised and gave me some compensation of several thousands of pounds.
If only the rest of HSBC's support lines worked as well as the CEO's office. The lady I spoke to was friendly, apologetic and got it sorted quickly. in fact, it wasn't just because I could breathe a sigh of relief that I finally had my money back, she genuinely was brilliant.
I no longer have any accounts with HSBC. Santander offered the least resistence and have been pretty damned good!
This sounds like the person I need to talk to, and I'd be quite interested in the email address you mentioned for Stuart J Guliver. When I discovered my account had been closed, I spoke with the Safeguard team who informed me a queque was in the post. I phoned numerous times to chase this as it just didn't arrive. HSBC even sent me a letter saying my account closure date was wrong and was actually a month away. After a few phone calls, they said they won't be reopening my account at all. After months of chasing my money and not sleeping at night, I wrote to Stuart J Guliver and within 25 minutes they had transferred every penny in to my personal HSBC account. They phoned 45 mins later, apologised and gave me some compensation of several thousands of pounds.
If only the rest of HSBC's support lines worked as well as the CEO's office. The lady I spoke to was friendly, apologetic and got it sorted quickly. in fact, it wasn't just because I could breathe a sigh of relief that I finally had my money back, she genuinely was brilliant.
I no longer have any accounts with HSBC. Santander offered the least resistence and have been pretty damned good!
I like your approach - a similar one worked for me to get my account re-opened. Amanda Murphy (amandamurphy@hsbc.com) is head of Commercial Banking and it was an eMail to her (but answered by someone else) that gained enough traction where several hours to various call centres and a visit to the branch manager of my local branch failed.
Teddy Lop said:
are metrobank where's its at now?
Possibly. I started to open an account with them only to find out (somewhere near the end of the process, to my annoyance) that they only allow 50 free transactions a month, charging a certain amount for each transaction over this. I run a lettings agency and have rather more transactions than 50 per month so this would get very expensive very quickly. Next port of call is a Santander, when I have the time. I continue to use HSBC for now.
2Btoo said:
This sounds like the person I need to talk to, and I'd be quite interested in the email address you mentioned for Stuart J Guliver.
I like your approach - a similar one worked for me to get my account re-opened. Amanda Murphy (amandamurphy@hsbc.com) is head of Commercial Banking and it was an eMail to her (but answered by someone else) that gained enough traction where several hours to various call centres and a visit to the branch manager of my local branch failed.
Hi Oli,I like your approach - a similar one worked for me to get my account re-opened. Amanda Murphy (amandamurphy@hsbc.com) is head of Commercial Banking and it was an eMail to her (but answered by someone else) that gained enough traction where several hours to various call centres and a visit to the branch manager of my local branch failed.
I'm just emailing you now! When I had issues I mentioned it in this thread - https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=17... and one of the guys kindly suggested I email the boss, so I did. I just did a quick check and looks like Stuart Gulliver is no longer CEO (James Emmett now I believe), but we can so some sleuth work to get an email address for you.
I'll have an email with you in 5 mins!!
Cheers
David
Autopilot said:
loafer123 said:
I wouldn’t trust the CEO to be able to tie his own shoelaces, let alone run a bank.
I would trust a fairly detailed email to his email address to catch somebodies eye quite quickly and deal with it straight away. I speak from experience. The Safeguard team closed my business account down despite me even having been through the Safeguard process. When I discovered my account had been closed, I spoke with the Safeguard team who informed me a queque was in the post. I phoned numerous times to chase this as it just didn't arrive. HSBC even sent me a letter saying my account closure date was wrong and was actually a month away. After a few phone calls, they said they won't be reopening my account at all. After months of chasing my money and not sleeping at night, I wrote to Stuart J Guliver and within 25 minutes they had transferred every penny in to my personal HSBC account. They phoned 45 mins later, apologised and gave me some compensation of several thousands of pounds.
If only the rest of HSBC's support lines worked as well as the CEO's office. The lady I spoke to was friendly, apologetic and got it sorted quickly. in fact, it wasn't just because I could breathe a sigh of relief that I finally had my money back, she genuinely was brilliant.
I no longer have any accounts with HSBC. Santander offered the least resistence and have been pretty damned good!
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